Use of Brand and Existing Titles in My Novel

morrighan · Jan 16, 2015

I'm stumped. I completed a 88K word novel for NaNoWrimo and I've just been told that I have way too many brands in my novel - and I didn't realize this but I do. From Nutella, to Facebook, Twitter, even a toddler wearing a Captain America costume, and another wearing a Thor costume and yelling a quote from the movie, and them watching Finding Nemo. There's also the mention of Aerosmith and one of their song titles.

While I will be removing those and replacing them with more generic descriptions, my question is about Dr. Seuss's Green Eggs and Ham. I have two of my characters supposedly acting out the narrative to kids they're baby-sitting one night which sets up an endearment they call each other - "Jack-I-am" and "Jill-I-am". So can I do this? Or should I replace this with something else? Are Dr. Seuss' works considered a brand?

BenPanced · Jan 16, 2015

Not a brand, but still under copyright. Brands and books are protected under two different branches of intellectual property law, but somebody more learned in the field might be able to shed some light on your question; I'm guessing you might be safer if you replaced their names. Not sure how litigious his estate is, though.

Evan Henry · Jan 16, 2015

What you're asking about is copyright law. The fact that neither of those words appeared in your initial post is what worries me.

Read these articles. All of them.

Ravioli · Jan 17, 2015

But, should an author really have to tiptoe around everyday brands and brands-gone-generic or essentials such as Facebook when they make content more realistic? What's the harm in writing that a little girl is hugging her Batman pillow, or a little boy necks a bottle of Coke and jumps off the pantry screaming "I'm Son Goku!"?

morrighan · Jan 17, 2015

Evan Henry said:
What you're asking about is copyright law. The fact that neither of those words appeared in your initial post is what worries me.

Read these articles. All of them.

I didn't believe I had to write down "copyright law" on the initial post to not know it's about copyright, because I was only trying to be simple-specific like I was 8-years old asking what I thought was a simple question about the specific use copyright-wise of a titles and brand names that have become synonymous with life in this day and age. Obviously I was so wrong.

But thanks for the link. I will read all of them.

Mods, if I am in the wrong thread, please feel free to move it in the right thread.

cornflake · Jan 17, 2015

NaeimGiladisLegacy said:
But, should an author really have to tiptoe around everyday brands and brands-gone-generic or essentials such as Facebook when they make content more realistic? What's the harm in writing that a little girl is hugging her Batman pillow, or a little boy necks a bottle of Coke and jumps off the pantry screaming "I'm Son Goku!"?

Sometimes.

There are actually two things here - trademark and copyright.

There are some things that are usually alright - mentioning a brand in a very neutral way, though that depends on the brand and how they tend to deal with their trademark. There are things that may be on the line - the overweight kid drinks a lot of Coke (TM), and there are things that, without permission, are clear violations - quoting books or song lyrics that are not in the public domain.

Ravioli · Jan 17, 2015

cornflake said:
Sometimes.

There are actually two things here - trademark and copyright.

There are some things that are usually alright - mentioning a brand in a very neutral way, though that depends on the brand and how they tend to deal with their trademark. There are things that may be on the line - the overweight kid drinks a lot of Coke (TM), and there are things that, without permission, are clear violations - quoting books or song lyrics that are not in the public domain.

I see, thanks for the explanation

So basically, mentioning a character interacting with someone else on Facebook, or being into Spiderman or listening to Hollywood Undead, should be fine?

Bufty · Jan 17, 2015

Yes. It's all part of life.

Commonsense use of names usually keeps one on the straight and narrow...

Jamesaritchie · Jan 17, 2015

You can legally use all the brand names you like. The only problem is when you use so many that your story reads like a two hour commercial. Trademark in no way stops writers from using brand names. Trademark stops people from start a business that would be confused with the trademark owner's business.

Nor do you have to walk on tiptoe when using a brand name. You should not say that McDonald's puts poison in their beef. You can have a character say he thinks the Big Mac is foul smelling, tastes like garbage. and is unhealthy in every possible way.

You should capitalize brand names, but there is no bid, bad, trademark organization that will put a horse's head on your bed is you don't listen to them. You are not violating trademark in any way by mentioning brand names.

Nor i McDonald's going to come after you with lawyers because you have a character insult them or their food.

You can't use Captain America as a character. That is a violation of trademark because you're in the same business. You can, however, have a child dressed in a Captain America costume for Halloween.

Just worry about having so many brand names that the story gets lost, but there is no reason to worry about using some, and there is no need to say only nice things when you do.

Debbie V · Jan 19, 2015

Consider whether the brand names have staying power. Today's big thing may not be around in five years. Companies come and go. Too many Trademarked items can date a story. This may not be bad. It is something to be aware of.

Jamesaritchie · Jan 19, 2015

Debbie V said:
Consider whether the brand names have staying power. Today's big thing may not be around in five years. Companies come and go. Too many Trademarked items can date a story. This may not be bad. It is something to be aware of.

I have no idea why so many think dating a story is bad. It isn't bad in any possible way. If it were bad, peopel wouldn't still be reading books from a hundred or more years ago that are datyed id a hundred way, or even all those wonderful books from the thirties, forties, fifties and sixties, on up, that are also dated.

And no one, of course, would read a historical novel, and certainly not an Ian Fleming novel, or a John D. MacDonald novel when both are full of dated brand names.

What bad is not dating. I don't care how you write the novel, it will be dated, and any reader can tell when you wrote it. What's bad is a novel the writer scrubs clean of all time and place because the writer is afraid of dating the novel, even though there isn't a single bit of evidence that this has ever harmed a novel, and much evidence that the opposite is true.

Dating a book sets in in real time, real place, and readers love this.

khobar · Jan 19, 2015

Jamesaritchie said:
You can legally use all the brand names you like. The only problem is when you use so many that your story reads like a two hour commercial. Trademark in no way stops writers from using brand names. Trademark stops people from start a business that would be confused with the trademark owner's business.

Nor do you have to walk on tiptoe when using a brand name. You should not say that McDonald's puts poison in their beef. You can have a character say he thinks the Big Mac is foul smelling, tastes like garbage. and is unhealthy in every possible way.

You should capitalize brand names, but there is no bid, bad, trademark organization that will put a horse's head on your bed is you don't listen to them. You are not violating trademark in any way by mentioning brand names.

Nor i McDonald's going to come after you with lawyers because you have a character insult them or their food.

You can't use Captain America as a character. That is a violation of trademark because you're in the same business. You can, however, have a child dressed in a Captain America costume for Halloween.

Just worry about having so many brand names that the story gets lost, but there is no reason to worry about using some, and there is no need to say only nice things when you do.

Actually, you do run some risk if you use brand names in place of their generic names. Corporations employ teams of lawyers whose job, in part, is to prevent trademark dilution, and while they won't likely put a horse's head in your bed, they can and will fire off a cease and desist letter and follow up as they see fit.

This may be helpful: http://www.rightsofwriters.com/2010/12/can-i-mention-brand-name-products-in-my.html

Use of Brand and Existing Titles in My Novel

morrighan

Always writing

BenPanced

THE BLUEBERRY QUEEN OF HADES (he/him)

Evan Henry

Short story-ist, editor for hire.

Ravioli

Crazy Cat Lady

morrighan

Always writing

cornflake

practical experience, FTW

Ravioli

Crazy Cat Lady

Bufty

Where have the last ten years gone?

Jamesaritchie

Debbie V

Mentoring Myself and Others

Jamesaritchie

khobar

Be constructive