Using Other Historical Events In a Different Period?

I think it's a fine option if you're writing historical fantasy/alt-history and have the freedom to make stuff up/move stuff around to suit your story. If you're writing straight historical fiction with the baseline assumption that you're not going to be actively violating known history, lifting episodes from a completely different context and plopping them into your historical scenario is a bit dodgy IMO.

That said, if you're just using the other-period-event as an inspiration/model of the dynamic for an undocumented-but-plausible story event, as long as you file the serial numbers off thoroughly enough you might be able to pull it off and no one the wiser.

gothicangel said:

I was wondering do others use historical events outside their time period as a basis to create the 'fiction' in their HF?

As most know my WIP is set in the Bar-Kokhba Revolt of CE 132-5, and very little is known about the actual revolt. I'm reading a lot about the First Jewish Revolt (particularly Josephus), and decided a few weeks ago I wanted a riot (inspired by the Alexandrian riots during the reign of Caligula.) Then my mind began to drift back to my A-level in Modern History, and Kristallnacht. So, I have went back and done some reading and discovered that there are some events that would fit really well with my book.

Anyone else done this?

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Well, sure. I can see some incidents from Kristallnacht being similar to incidents that happened during the Bar-Kokhba revolt. Mob mentality, human nature, etc . . . those don't change. If Kristallnacht helps you flesh out your conception of an ancient Jewish revolt, then by all means use it.

Sat Nam! (literally "Truth Name"--a Sikh greeting)

I agree with Ben: Fine to use it if it's inspiration; not so fine to lift it up complete with combat boots unless it's alternative history or historical fantasy.

Blessings,

Siri Kirpal

gothicangel said:

I was wondering do others use historical events outside their time period as a basis to create the 'fiction' in their HF?

As most know my WIP is set in the Bar-Kokhba Revolt of CE 132-5, and very little is known about the actual revolt. I'm reading a lot about the First Jewish Revolt (particularly Josephus), and decided a few weeks ago I wanted a riot (inspired by the Alexandrian riots during the reign of Caligula.) Then my mind began to drift back to my A-level in Modern History, and Kristallnacht. So, I have went back and done some reading and discovered that there are some events that would fit really well with my book.

Anyone else done this?

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Yep - in fact in a very similar way to you. Spookily similar.

I'm writing about the aftermath of Exodus (historicalised version) in Egypt, and there are also riots in my story. The vizier responds to these by imposing sanctions against the Hebrews, restrictions on where they can live and work, who they can associate or trade with... I got a lot of inspiration from the Nazi suppression of the Jews, not surprisingly.

I don't want to recreate Nazi Germany in ancient Egypt, but as Angel says, human nature doesn't change much, and I figure persecution doesn't either - restricting and regulating the basic necessities of life is a logical means to control a segment of the population deemed threatening or undesirable. After all, the Egyptians tried it once before - they just used the slightly more radical method of killing all the male children (according to the Bible anyway - lets not get started on the historicity of that)

benbenberi said:

I think it's a fine option if you're writing historical fantasy/alt-history and have the freedom to make stuff up/move stuff around to suit your story. If you're writing straight historical fiction with the baseline assumption that you're not going to be actively violating known history, lifting episodes from a completely different context and plopping them into your historical scenario is a bit dodgy IMO.

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Bolding is mine.

I think the problem being addressed by the OP is one of gaps in the source material - if there IS no known historical account to deviate from, then 'making it up' is kinda your only option. This is, after all, where the 'fiction' part of historical fiction comes in. Taking inspiration from other periods of history and adapting it to your historical context is an HF writer's bread and butter. And need I point out... history repeats itself

Seems fine to me. Human nature hasnt changed, so lots of types of events have happened over and over countless times.

Not only does human nature not change, but honestly, we do not know every detail of history. There are bound to have been people/events/uprisings that we have no record of.

Let's not fall into the trap of universalism. Human nature may not have changed, but human behavior and human relationships are to a great extent culturally and socially dependent. Expectations, beliefs, priorities, and standards are all conditioned by their context. So whenever a writer is tempted to lift a scenario from one setting and use it in a completely different one, it's important to think through all the ramifications. Otherwise it's like a badly photoshopped picture, with things that just don't look right together and all the discontinuities obvious.

benbenberi said:

Let's not fall into the trap of universalism. Human nature may not have changed, but human behavior and human relationships are to a great extent culturally and socially dependent. Expectations, beliefs, priorities, and standards are all conditioned by their context. So whenever a writer is tempted to lift a scenario from one setting and use it in a completely different one, it's important to think through all the ramifications. Otherwise it's like a badly photoshopped picture, with things that just don't look right together and all the discontinuities obvious.

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That's why I very deliberately said 'Taking inspiration from other periods of history and adapting it to your historical context is an HF writer's bread and butter.'

Please take note of the bold. Maybe I didn't emphasise it sufficiently before, but I thought it was clear I was not advocating just cutting and pasting historical events into a different period. I probably could have made my point better, as I'd never accuse anyone of willfully misinterpreting my comments...

(Just noting for the record, Kallithrix, that I was not taking issue with what you said, which I completely agree with, but with the repeated claim that "human nature hasn't changed," which is a hazardous oversimplification when applied to historical fiction.)

benbenberi said:

Let's not fall into the trap of universalism. Human nature may not have changed, but human behavior and human relationships are to a great extent culturally and socially dependent. Expectations, beliefs, priorities, and standards are all conditioned by their context. So whenever a writer is tempted to lift a scenario from one setting and use it in a completely different one, it's important to think through all the ramifications. Otherwise it's like a badly photoshopped picture, with things that just don't look right together and all the discontinuities obvious.

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Oh for sure you have to make adaptations based on the cultures involved, but even taking cultural differences into account there ARE universals in human nature. That's why modern westerners can read an ancient Chinese novel like Romance of the Three Kingdoms and still get caught up in it. The cultural context may be completely alien, but there's enough recognizable humanity in it to make it resonate centuries later. All art and literature would have a shelf life of one or two generations if there werent universals in human nature.