PublishAmerica's stock image covers

Marian Perera · Feb 2, 2009

I thought I'd start a new thread for these, rather than cluttering Son of PAMB with them.

Here's the book:

And the stock image (23085716 on Jupiter Images) :

Here's the book:

They weren't even trying with this one (24918005 on Jupiter Images)

Here's the book:

And the stock image (23770835 on Jupiter Images);

von Hipper · Feb 2, 2009

No offense, but what's the point you're trying to make here? I own books done by legit publishers that have public domain/stock image covers. Military history books are particularly guilty of this-if it's a book about a battle, it'll just have the title placed over an unaltered painting/photograph of that battle.

M.R.J. Le Blanc · Feb 2, 2009

von Hipper said:
No offense, but what's the point you're trying to make here? I own books done by legit publishers that have public domain/stock image covers. Military history books are particularly guilty of this-if it's a book about a battle, it'll just have the title placed over an unaltered painting/photograph of that battle.

It's more to the point that PA claims to have 'illustrators' and 'cover artists' when really all they're doing is using stock images and slapping some text on using a paint program - maybe alter the image a little. It's plain out deception, while PA authors think they're getting an original cover designed specifically for their story.

Marian Perera · Feb 2, 2009

von Hipper said:
No offense, but what's the point you're trying to make here? I own books done by legit publishers that have public domain/stock image covers. Military history books are particularly guilty of this-if it's a book about a battle, it'll just have the title placed over an unaltered painting/photograph of that battle.

What M. R.J. said. And the way I see it, is it fair to authors to pick out a stock image that offers only the barest hint of what the book is about? If I see a book with a painting or photograph of a battle, I can usually tell whether this is a medieval or modern battle. I also own several fantasy novels with covers that make it very clear what kind of fantasy they are.

With one of the stock image covers I found previously, it wasn't even clear that the picture was of a wolf. And with many of these covers, PA simply puts the title and the author's name on them (i.e. not making any further effort).

Real publishers may use stock image covers, but I have yet to come across one that uses them so often. PA only uses illustrations created specifically for that particular book when the author provides them. And PA reuses stock images.

That's the point I'm trying to make here.

veinglory · Feb 2, 2009

The examples given don't seem to demonstrate these shortfalls. As mentioned, even Bujold has non-exclusive stock on her covers--doing it at all is quite standard. Doing it badly... needs clearer examples perhaps? These ones look merely mediocre to me.

Marian Perera · Feb 2, 2009

veinglory said:
The examples given don't seem to demonstrate these shortfalls.

The wolf example is here.

As mentioned, even Bujold has non-exclusive stock on her covers--doing it at all is quite standard. Doing it badly... needs clearer examples perhaps? These ones look merely mediocre to me.

Even "mediocre" is quite a far cry from the claims I've read that PA has the best cover designs in the business. Most authors believe that they're getting art specifically designed for them.

wwhitman · Feb 2, 2009

It's more to the point that PA claims to have 'illustrators' and 'cover artists' when really all they're doing is using stock images and slapping some text on using a paint program - maybe alter the image a little. It's plain out deception, while PA authors think they're getting an original cover designed specifically for their story.

I think your splitting hairs. If their artists use stock cover art as a basis for their, well, art, that's one thing. It all depends on the talent of the artist to make it good, or bad. I've seen many stock art covers that were quite well put together (even a few PA) ones. Using stock arts by itself isn't bad. Judge the art by the finished product.

circlexranch · Feb 2, 2009

And don't forget . . . using the same stock image over and over on different books when the PA writers think the image was designed just for them using their work as the inspiration.

M.R.J. Le Blanc · Feb 2, 2009

I think - and I'm not sure if this is allowed - if we showed many covers with the same stock image? That to me would prove the point further.

Marian Perera · Feb 2, 2009

M.R.J. Le Blanc said:
I think - and I'm not sure if this is allowed - if we showed many covers with the same stock image? That to me would prove the point further.

Well, if this isn't allowed, the mods will let me know and I'll delete my posts.

134x200_66_100_0.7243_1_185_277-127665.jpg

PA liked this cover so much that they recycled it...

And here's the stock image... (23896909 on Jupiter Images)

And the dewdrop-on-leaf covers, although this isn't an exact reuse.

kullervo · Feb 2, 2009

How a cover artist should use stock art. Doing nothing but adding a title is the work of five minutes. PA authors should know that they are receiving very minimal effort on their cover.

This is actually the second cover done for my novel. The publisher rejected the first cover and hired somebody new:

Christine N. · Feb 2, 2009

Yeah, I've seen covers that credit certain parts of covers to Ghetty images or something. But it was only a part- a pair of sunglasses, for example. PA not only reuses those images, but lifts them wholesale and stamps some font on the front, then tries to pass it off as 'original artwork', done by an 'art department' for each book.

No. I have art, done by an art department. Complete and original, and absolutely tailor made for my books. I know the artist's name, and it's listed on the inside cover of each book.

Wait, does PA credit their stock images on the books? That might be something to look into. Do they credit their artists?

Using stock isn't bad in and of itself; using stock and trying to pass it off as your own work? Not so much.

veinglory · Feb 2, 2009

Many high volume publishers are reusing art (Harlequin for example). Not saying I agree with it, but it is a shortcut seen rather often.

I do wonder if PA buy extended stock licenses in the expectation of selling over 50,000 copies

I notice when my stock sells an extended license because I know to look out for it appearing in a book a year or so later.

merrihiatt · Feb 2, 2009

I'm sure my cover is stock, and had absolutely nothing to do with what my book was about, except the main character was a woman and a woman was on the cover. My character was not pensieve or brooding, though. There was a photograph and cover art permission form included in my materials from PA. I didn't have an artist design a cover or use a photograph of any kind on the cover, so I left that part blank. Jason's book used original artwork, so he might be able to answer this question by looking on the inside cover of his book to see if the artist was acknowledged. I would certainly hope so.

xXFireSpiritXx · Feb 2, 2009

The artist is mentioned on the copyright page but that is only because I specifically requested it. PA couldn't give a crap about giving the artist credit.

Cyia · Feb 2, 2009

Queen of Swords said:
Well, if this isn't allowed, the mods will let me know and I'll delete my posts.

PA liked this cover so much that they recycled it...

And here's the stock image... (23896909 on Jupiter Images)

Did they adjust the width of the pic or something on the "Shimmer" cover; that thing's fangs are a lot bigger in that one. And the shimmering effect is a bad attempt to cover the cut and paste halo on the wolf. The "Eternity" cover is cleaner, but it lost the whiskers.

Christine N. · Feb 2, 2009

I wonder if the stock art work is credited to Jupiter Images, or if to some random PA art department person? Every legitmate publisher cover that I've seen that uses stock art, even if it's the tiniest bit, credits the stock art company.

Blake M. Petit · Feb 2, 2009

You've got me intrigued. I feel like I should make some popcorn and just sit here, waiting to see what else you discover.

Christine N. · Feb 2, 2009

Wait, who's got a copy of that Orlando Bloom Elf-Vampire cover???? That one was priceless.

veinglory · Feb 2, 2009

Christine N. said:
I wonder if the stock art work is credited to Jupiter Images, or if to some random PA art department person? Every legitmate publisher cover that I've seen that uses stock art, even if it's the tiniest bit, credits the stock art company.

My extended license work has always showed up eventually in a Google book search credited to me by name and to the stock vendor. But this isn't a legal requirement.

M.R.J. Le Blanc · Feb 2, 2009

Christine N. said:
Wait, who's got a copy of that Orlando Bloom Elf-Vampire cover???? That one was priceless.

Wasn't there still a copy floating on Amazon? Or did it get pulled? I think the image is saved somewhere in the Son of PAMB or something.

JulieB · Feb 2, 2009

Christine N. said:
Wait, who's got a copy of that Orlando Bloom Elf-Vampire cover???? That one was priceless.

I actually tracked down a copy of that book.

As I recall, that cover art was submitted by the author.

There's a picture of the cover with Crevette's review over at LJ. The review is not work, keyboard, or bladder safe. Just warning you.

Gillhoughly · Feb 2, 2009

That cover was done by the writer.

She hated the one PA provided which was a picture of a grassy field. (Maybe it was a vegetarian vampire that grazed.)

She was turned in, the book removed, then it came back with a new cover.

A review. Pic of cover on the page. Beverage alert. Seriously.

Ms. Ross now writes as Valena Graham.

She has rewritten Night Travels as an erotic elven vampire alien fighter pilot serial killer werewolf paranormal.

Another review: http://crevette.livejournal.com/240745.html

But she seems to have figured out that PA is not her friend as she's selling the redux version and her other novel "Debutante Gunfighter" on Lulu.

More power to her for scraping PA from her shoes like sticky dog poop.

Christine N. · Feb 2, 2009

I remember she submitted the Orlando Bloom thing AS AN IDEA of what she wanted. An example ONLY.

PA printed it, as it was. OB's people were NOT happy.

Sparhawk · Feb 2, 2009

Yeah, Christine, that's my recollection as well... also the book to the left of my post.... original cover design by and actual artist.

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