Upper middle grade - POV switching and chapter length

[Shalon]

Happy Halloween!


(Here I am working on my novel instead of trick-or-treating! boo...)

So, ummm... I've written a middle grade novel, but after beginning work on the second draft, I've come to realize that it needs so much editing that it will be easier to rewrite it from scratch rather than do a patchwork fix.

For that reason, I really want to get all the structural elements right, so that I don't just go and shoot myself in the foot when I go to shop it.

First off, here are my specs: upper middle grade science fiction. 55K word count.

My POV switching Conundrum

I have alternating POVs in my book, and have heard that's a bit of a no-no in mg, but I've seen it done.

My question is, is it okay to switch point of views INSIDE of a chapter in middle grade? I know it's okay in adult fiction, but also a bit frowned upon.

The reason being, this is an intense moment where two very different characters finally meet in chapter 13 (out of 40). It's been building a long time, so the tension is high and the reader wants to know what each character thinks of the other.

Option #1: POV switch in the chapter (what i currently have and fan-readers have loved it)
Option #2: Don't POV switch in the chapter (what I believe is the industry standard for MG)
Option #3: Write really short chapters so that I can switch, but technically not break the rule...

Honestly, option #3 is probably what I'm leaning towards, but then they say that in MG consistency in chapter lengths is important.

This might sound fussy of me, but please understand I've already written this book once now, so I don't want to have to write it a third time if I find out I've broken some industry expectation.

Okay, thanks for any thoughts or help you can give!

 

[Bufty]

A no-no in upper middle grade? Never heard of such 'rules'.

I think you may be overthinking this. Why not just do what you feel makes for the better flow of the story and reader experience. It can easily be changed later if felt necessary and nobody is going to reject a good story submission because the chapters aren't the same length or because of where a POV change occurs.


Good luck

 

[The Second Moon]

I totally agree with Bufty. Go with your style.

 

[Toothpaste]

First of all you are totally allowed to shift POVs in MG. My latest series vacillates between my two main characters throughout.

As to your quandary, I'm with the others. Do what you feel is right for your story! There's no rule you have to switch only at the start of the new chapter (though having a space or something that delineates a change does make sense). The only thing I'd caution against is doing a POV switch just because of any trouble you might be having revealing exposition. A lot of the time I have found when writers really want to switch a POV it's because they want to explain something about the plot or character motivation and not because it's important to the story to specifically switch POV. Ask yourself if you absolutely need to switch, if there is any way to get the information across in another fashion. When we are struggling with the how when writing often we are the most creative with the solutions I find. I mean, at least I am .

But yeah, if this is what you feel your story needs then don't feel worried about "the rules". Just go for it!

 

[Brightdreamer]

A no-no in upper middle grade? Never heard of such 'rules'.

I think you may be overthinking this. Why not just do what you feel makes for the better flow of the story and reader experience. It can easily be changed later if felt necessary and nobody is going to reject a good story submission because the chapters aren't the same length or because of where a POV change occurs.


Good luck

+1 (or 2, or 3...)

These "rules" people throw around... they don't exist. They're guidelines, if anything. (Yes, there are some definite no-no's - no graphic orgies in MG, for instance - but rules like "only two POVs" and "chapters must consist of prime numbers of paragraphs"... not so much.) The only real rule is clarity: your reader should never be confused. Intrigued, yes. Curious, of course. But actively confused about what's going on... no.

Tell your story. Consider posting a sample chapter in SYW for feedback.

Good luck!

 

[Shalon]

A no-no in upper middle grade? Never heard of such 'rules'.

An agent, and a published middle grade author told me that single point of view books are much easier to sell. Traditionally, MG has one viewpoint, although there are more books doing multiple. Wonder comes to mind.

Anyway, I'm okay with having multiple points of view, that's not the question. I'm talking about switching points of view inside the chapter.

It can easily be changed later if felt necessary and nobody is going to reject a good story submission because the chapters aren't the same length or because of where a POV change occurs.

This is actually not true. First of all, it's not easy to simply "fix" a large portion of a story told in the wrong perspective. Secondly, there are industry standards, and agents and publishers ROUTINELY reject debut novels that don't follow them.

The only thing I'd caution against is doing a POV switch just because of any trouble you might be having revealing exposition. A lot of the time I have found when writers really want to switch a POV it's because they want to explain something about the plot or character motivation and not because it's important to the story to specifically switch POV. Ask yourself if you absolutely need to switch, if there is any way to get the information across in another fashion. When we are struggling with the how when writing often we are the most creative with the solutions I find.

Thank you! This is actually advice that's helpful, and not patronizing. I appreciate this. i think you're right. i'm trying to use the multiple points of view to reveal exposition in this scene..... Very interesting. This is definitely food for thought.

Thank you.

 

[Toothpaste]

My pleasure! I'm glad it was helpful!

Also just to be a bit clearer with my answer specifically with what you asked above, I have switched between POVs within one chapter myself. But it's rare. And it's a proper scene break. Almost like a mini-chapter break. And I don't go back and forth. One change and that's it.

Again there is no hard and fast rule, but yeah, thought I'd share my personal experience.

(Also I'm not so sure about the idea that single POV MG's sell better than multiple though. If you heard it from an agent then it might very well be true, I definitely don't have the broader perspective that they do, but I haven't found it to be the case personally. Then again, my POVs are still third person limited. Are you doing that or first person? I wonder if that makes a difference?)

 

[Bufty]

[=Shalon;10475110]An agent, and a published middle grade author told me that single point of view books are much easier to sell. Traditionally, MG has one viewpoint, although there are more books doing multiple. Wonder comes to mind.

Anyway, I'm okay with having multiple points of view, that's not the question. I'm talking about switching points of view inside the chapter.

Originally Posted by Bufty
It can easily be changed later if felt necessary and nobody is going to reject a good story submission because the chapters aren't the same length or because of where a POV change occurs.

This is actually not true. First of all, it's not easy to simply "fix" a large portion of a story told in the wrong perspective. Secondly, there are industry standards, and agents and publishers ROUTINELY reject debut novels that don't follow them.

I think you may be misinterpreting my comments and mistakenly including these minor issues in 'industry standards'. A good story will never be rejected simply because the chapter lengths vary. I know it's the positioning of a POV change within a chapter that you were asking about and that has nothing to do with 'fixing a story told in the wrong perspective'.



Thank you! This is actually advice that's helpful, and not patronizing. I appreciate this. i think you're right. I'm trying to use the multiple points of view to reveal exposition in this scene..... Very interesting. This is definitely food for thought.

Glad you found Toothpaste's responses helpful. They usually are, but not sure what prompted the 'actually' ... 'not patronizing' comment. Maybe that relates to your experience in other sites but it's not the norm here. Folk here are always pretty helpful and caring.

Kindest, Bufty.

Thank you.[/QUOTE]