• Guest please check The Index before starting a thread.

united p.c. publisher / novum publishing GmbH

editing_for_authors
Editing for authors: because every writer needs a good editor.

aliceshortcake

Wilde about Oscar
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Dec 4, 2010
Messages
1,633
Reaction score
256
Location
Oop North
Ads for this company have been following me round the internet for a couple of days now so I thought I'd have a closer look:

http://uk.united-pc.eu/united-pc-publish-easily-and-at-no-cost.html

The ESL phraseology is due to the fact that upc is based in Austria and associated with another Austrian publisher, Vindobona Verlag.

We believe that any good manuscript should be published as a book, to do this we have developed a publishing concept by which any author can publish books free-of-charge, quickly and easily in our publishing house! In addition you will become a member of the united publishing club with its many benefits, Classic membership is also free-of-charge!

Actually it doesn't matter if your manuscript is good or not:

As a publishing house for all authors, we review each submitted manuscript and if there are no legal reservations, we send you a publishing contract in which we list our comprehensive publishing services.

Just avoid libel, hate speech and plagiarism and you too can be published!

You need no contacts, money, nothing! We guarantee free-of-charge publication with ISBN, sales through book sellers and online shops such as amazon etc. You will receive royalties and discounts from the 1st book! Hard to believe? Simply give us a try at no risk!

No, the risk is all upc's:

No author must pay us for publishing their book. We at united p.c. publisher publish each book at our own risk! Guaranteed and free-of-charge!



Below you will find a selection of the benefits of cost-free publishing with united p.c. publisher:
  • Personal author consultations
  • Issue of a unique, global ISBN number
  • Entry into the Index of Deliverable Books
  • Entry into the Library
  • EAN Barcode with sales price on the back cover of the book
  • Approval of the inside page design and jacket design
  • Guidelines for authors with helpful tips for readings and dealing with the media and book sellers.
  • Presentation and listing on the home page of the publishing house
  • Listing on hundreds of other online shops such as amazon etc.
  • Private buyers, book sellers, wholesalers and distributors can order from the publishing house by telephone, email, post and fax
  • Listing on the directories of book wholesalers in Great Britain
  • The publishing house designs comprehensive publicity materials for the work such as book marks, order forms, flyers, posters, order slips ...
  • The publishing house provides press releases to journalists
  • The publishing house sends review copies – if demanded – to the media in Great Britain
  • The author may order books from the publisher in any amounts for the duration of the publishing contract
  • Club membership with all the benefits which go with it
  • Royalties and discounts from the 1st book sold!
Hang on a minute...who pays for those book marks, flyers and posters? Does the word 'discounts' apply to the books the author will have to buy because booksellers won't touch overpriced POD books with a bargepole? As for jacket design, the upc house style makes everything in their catalogue look like a textbook.

Although upc claims to have 20 years of experience and a club membership of 1500, there are only six books on the site. There's no 'look inside' feature on Amazon so I have no idea if the title of Dennis Kott's Green. Welcome to Heartbreake is a spelling mistake or not, and at £15.70 for 238 pages I doubt if anyone will want to find out. Mind you, it's still better value than Sarah-Anna Linton's Fuck this Superficiality! (£11.75 for 46 pages).

In short, upc is doing nothing for authors they couldn't do for themselves with CreateSpace or Lulu.
 
Last edited:

shaldna

The cake is a lie. But still cake.
Super Member
Registered
Joined
May 12, 2009
Messages
7,485
Reaction score
896
Location
Belfast
the books are very overpriced - double what you would pay for the same length of book elsewhere.

In addition the covers are horrible - very cheap looking.
 

aliceshortcake

Wilde about Oscar
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Dec 4, 2010
Messages
1,633
Reaction score
256
Location
Oop North
How very odd. None of united p.c.'s authors have German-sounding names and the titles are all in English, yet the books themselves are in German.

The 'club' is equally strange. Gold membership (£7.80 per month) entitles the author to five book publications a year and a 5% discount on club books. Platinum members (£19.60 per month) get ten book publications a year and

one book fair presentation of your choice per year...

in either London or Frankfurt:

notice of attendance at the requested book fair must be given at least 5 months prior to the start of the fair.

http://uk.united-pc.eu/club/the-club.html

Everyone benefits from the Partner Program ("author advertises author"), which sounds like a case of the blind leading the blind.
 

aliceshortcake

Wilde about Oscar
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Dec 4, 2010
Messages
1,633
Reaction score
256
Location
Oop North
Susan, there's already a thread here: <snipped>
 
Last edited by a moderator:

DreamWeaver

Shakespearean Fool
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Apr 11, 2005
Messages
2,916
Reaction score
403
Disclaimer: opinions below come solely from a visit to the website.

The website is aimed at authors. If you're looking for a trade/commercial publisher, that's a very bad sign. If you're looking for a vanity publisher, it's par for the course. Many people have reported being better off self-publishing rather than going with a "publishing services" company. Very few have reported being better off with either rather than with a big-six* or well-established smaller trade publisher.

And that one photo of the lady with the rictus grin and improbable eyelashes--actually scary :eek:.


*depending on the status of the Random Penguin merger, that should perhaps be "big-five" :)

ETA: are we about to go on a magic mod-carpet ride to the existing thread? Hanging on to my hat!
 
Last edited:

calieber

Couth barbarian
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Aug 7, 2006
Messages
787
Reaction score
57
Location
BK.NY.US
The website is aimed at authors. If you're looking for a trade/commercial publisher, that's a very bad sign.

I've seen that a couple of times, so I looked at a big-however-many publisher's site (Simon and Schuster, because a friend works there, though she has this week off) and ... the contrast jumps out at you.
 

Rainbow 2000

Banned
Joined
Dec 3, 2012
Messages
3
Reaction score
0
Location
UK
United PC Publishers - Questions pls on royalties and discounts

http://uk.united-pc.eu/publisher/the-advantages-to-you.html?L=3

Last sentence states: royalties and discounts from the first book sold.

1. What does this mean? Does it mean the author ONLY receives 100% income (royalties) from the sale of his/her first book???

2. What is this "discount" they are talking about? Is it that they pay for the difference of the loss gone into discount?

They are using confusing language!

Thanks in advance for your clarified and sensible replies. UK.
 
Last edited:

aliceshortcake

Wilde about Oscar
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Dec 4, 2010
Messages
1,633
Reaction score
256
Location
Oop North
God knows what they're on about. Their books are ludicrously overpriced and have no distribution, so I suspect that the only people who'll buy copies are the authors' family and friends. Oh, and the authors themselves:

How much are copies for the author?
You can order books minus your discount – as contracted – from the publisher at any time. When ordering at least 100 copies – prior to the official book release – you get a unique special discount of 40%.

These people really, really need a native English speaker to re-write the website:

What are the further actions after my submission of all required documents?
When we receive your documents according to the info sheet “submission of manuscript and texts”, we will check the manuscript regarding printing quality and assign the graphics department with the jacket design. Upon completion of these workings we will send you the inner part and the jacket for your approval.

Who read my manuscript? What are your criteria?
We sight manuscripts according to our company-internal standards and make a fundamental decision pro and con. There was no detailed appraisal.

I get the impression that u.p.c. is a wannabe LAP Lambert/Just Fiction! Edition - an author mill in search of authors.
 

aliceshortcake

Wilde about Oscar
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Dec 4, 2010
Messages
1,633
Reaction score
256
Location
Oop North
Oh, and another thing: the testimonials on the home page are from people whose names don't appear on any books published by u.p.c., and their photographs look suspiciously like stock images.
 

Willow eBooks

Registered
Joined
Oct 9, 2013
Messages
1
Reaction score
0
A sub-standard Lulu.com

As far as I can make out, this outfit is just another Print on Demand group. Lulu are the masters in this area, as far as I am concerned. On behalf of a number of authors I have published over 20 books using Lulu and the whole system is brilliant. One slight difference is that these people will read the MS first, but with what publishing skill is anyone's guess. At least they don't look for thousands of Pounds/Dollars/Euros up front like vanity houses do.

One of my specialities is scanning out-of-print books for their authors and publishing on Lulu and/or Amazon Kindle. Two of my clients are in their 80s and are delighted to see more life injected into their work.

By the way, that comment about being paid for the first book just means "from" the first book - not "just" the first book.

These people are in Austria, Lulu is global.

Not recommended.
 

gingerwoman

Super Member
Registered
Joined
Jun 27, 2007
Messages
2,541
Reaction score
211
Anyone knows anything about this publisher?

http://uk.united-pc.eu/publisher/submit-manuscripts.html

Thanks in advance
Susan these places simply aren't "publishers" not in the sense that you're using the word. As somone said in another thread about these vanity things if it has testimonials from authors on it's website it is rubbish. It is not a place focused on selling books to the public, it has a different business model and that model is selling stuff to wannabe writers with big unrealistic dreams that are going to get crushed.
 

aliceshortcake

Wilde about Oscar
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Dec 4, 2010
Messages
1,633
Reaction score
256
Location
Oop North
I was dismayed to find that one of upc's authors is the great Scottish folk singer and storyteller Sheila Stewart. She's the author of three previous books, all reputably published by Birlinn Ltd, but her upc book - Nomads of the Road - is unedited ("the author is responsible for the content and correction") and littered with errors. It also retails at £14.80 for 206 pages. It's tragic to see such culturally important work thrown away like this.

It's impossible to sample the books on upc's site but I managed to find some of them on Amazon. For a mere £53.20 you can treat yourself to a two-volume biography (or is it a novel?) running to 1,444 pages, apparently written by someone not on intimate terms with the English language. And don't get me started on a different author's three books for children, one of which has a classic greengrocer's apostrophe in the title and all of which (if the blurbs are anything to go by) feature appalling spelling and grammar.
 
Last edited:

aliceshortcake

Wilde about Oscar
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Dec 4, 2010
Messages
1,633
Reaction score
256
Location
Oop North
novum publishing GmbH

http://www.novum-publishing.co.uk/home.html

Many authors are disappointed when they offer their work after many years of creating to a publisher who refuses or shows no sign of reaction. Unfortunately, this is very often the case. We believe that every author with a good manuscript is supposed to have a fair chance to present his work to a wide audience around the world. It is our purpose to provide this opportunity.

Something tells me that this disappointed author is going to have to pay for the privilege of being published.

Today’s novum publishing GmbH was founded in 1997. At the beginning, the company was positioned as service provider – in the field of layouts – for publishers in the German-speaking world. Shortly after that the own publisher with cost sharing by authors was founded. Especially new authors found and will find here the perfect start to the world of publishing. The consequent work paid off rapidly over the years and is reflected in numerous awards.

Told you so! And why do these people never tell you which awards their books have won? There is an "Awards" page but it's about the awards won by the publisher, not the books:

INNOVATION AWARD 2012

No one can foresee how the future will really look like and in which dimensions the world will change. But what one can say today is clear: innovation, research & development are the growth engines of the future. They form the basis for something new and also provide the basis for progress and prosperity. For these reasons, the state government of Burgenland organises together with the WIBAG the long-term innovation initiative “Good idea, Burgenland!” The novum publishing gmbh was nominated for its innovative publishing model.

Therewith, the initiative wants to set creative, cultural and social impulses and wants to support the visionary spirit of research.

This Austrian company now has bases in Germany, Hungary, Switzerland, Spain - and now the UK, where they have a strangely familiar address:

novum publishing gmbh,
Hamilton House, Mabledon Place,
Bloomsbury, London, WC1H 9BB

It's the building where Austin Macauley claims to have an office, but it's probably just a mailing address.

Novum publishing is pleased with every manuscript submission. We submit an offer for publication for every good manuscript!

Oh, I'll just bet you do. And why not? "Cost-sharing" usually means that the author is bearing most of the expense and the publisher is taking no financial risk.

Successfully granted licenses for translations, Braille editions or even film versions show that there is a deep interest in undiscovered authors. Some of our books were nominated for literary prizes and even won them.

Yes, you already mentioned that.

Thousands of reviews, reports in newspapers and the media as well as publications of up to 10 books by individual authors are an impressive proof that we are on the right track!

Surely selling lots of books would be proof that you're on the right track?

We are pleased to read your manuscript very soon!

I think not!

The handful of books in Novum's bookshop are, with one exception, awful English translations of German originals. None of them have Amazon rankings, so one can only hope that the authors managed to sell at least a few copies through the online bookshop.
 

aliceshortcake

Wilde about Oscar
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Dec 4, 2010
Messages
1,633
Reaction score
256
Location
Oop North
I'm a bit late to the party here, but United P.C. also trades as Novum Publishing:

http://www.novum-publishing.co.uk/

Many authors are disappointed when they offer their work after many years of writing to a publisher who turns it down or shows no sign of reaction - unfortunately, this is very often the case. We believe that every author with a good manuscript is supposed to have a fair chance on the book market. It is our purpose to provide this opportunity.

In July 2013 UPC/Novum fell foul of Britain's Advertising Standards Authority:

Two issues were investigated, both of which were Upheld.

Ad
The website www.united-pc.eu stated "united p.c. publisher - publish easily and at no cost - united p.c. publisher publishes your books and e-books - free, guaranteed, simply!" and "Submit a manuscript or an extract to united p.c. publisher: Manuskripts [sic] per e-mail: [email address ending .eu followed] - Manuskripts [sic] per post: novum publishing gmbh c/o united p.c. publisher [London WC1 postal address followed]".

Issue
A complainant challenged whether:

1. the claims "publish easily and at no cost" and "united p.c. publisher publishes your books and e-books - free, guaranteed, simply" were misleading, because he found that there were charges associated with editing, design and promotion which were not clarified; and

2. the ad misleadingly suggested that the advertiser was UK-based.

Assessment
1. Upheld

The ASA noted that the ad used the terms "publish" and "publishes" and stated that that service would be free of charge. We noted that the complainant reported being asked to pay for corrections, designing the front and back covers and the additional cost of publishing an e-book. We asked United Publisher to comment on that and for details of the proportion of respondents who kept to the free of charge contract and the proportion that chose to pay for additional services, but that information was not forthcoming and they did not respond in further detail than is summarised above.

We considered expectations of what would be included in a general offer to publish a book would vary but that respondents were likely to expect some or all of the elements listed above to be included. Because United Publisher had not supplied information that showed other respondents had not incurred similar costs, we concluded that the claims that United Publisher published books free of charge were misleading.

On this point the claims breached CAP Code (Edition 12) rules 3.1 and 3.3 (Misleading advertising), 3.9 (Qualification) and 3.11 (Exaggeration).

2. Upheld

We noted that the legal and contact sections of www.united-pc.eu listed a headquarters address for United Publisher in Austria but that they also listed an address in London for a UK office. We considered respondents were likely to feel more protected if they were dealing with a company based in the UK or which had representatives based in the UK. We considered that the use of contact details for a London office and a website address that, because it ended ".eu", was ambiguous in that it did not explain that the company was based in a country outside the UK, suggested to respondents that they were dealing with a company that was based in the UK and/or which had a permanent base for conducting business in the UK. We noted from United Publisher's response, however, that that would not be the case because the London office was used simply as a point of contact for forwarding manuscripts and documents to the headquarters in Austria. Because we considered the ad suggested United Publisher was based in the UK when that was not the case, we concluded that the ad was misleading.

On this point the ad breached CAP Code (Edition 12) rules 3.1 and 3.3 (Misleading advertising) and 3.9 (Qualification).

Action
The ad must not appear again in its current form. We told United Publisher not to claim that their service was free of charge if respondents needed to pay costs and not to suggest that they were based in the UK if that was not the case.
https://www.asa.org.uk/Rulings/Adju...lishing-gmbh/SHP_ADJ_225574.aspx#.VnKVBeBFAv4

United P.C. ignored the ruling and are now listed as non-compliant online advertisers.
 
Last edited:

CaoPaux

Mostly Harmless
Staff member
Super Moderator
Moderator
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Feb 12, 2005
Messages
13,737
Reaction score
1,585
Location
Coastal Desert
Kewl. Thread for novum publishing merged into united p.c.
 

inspector

Registered
Joined
Jun 21, 2020
Messages
13
Reaction score
0
Hi there! I wanted to ask if any of you have had any new experiences with Novum Publishing? I am aware that the thread is a bit older and that some things may have changed in the last years. One of my colleagues has been desperately looking for a publisher for a long time. He simply does not get an answer from most of the publishers. Or he only gets very simple standard answers. I meant he could try self-publishing, but he says that it's not really his thing...It would be important for him to get professional proofreading, editing and general feedback on his book from a publisher. After all, publishers know the market much better and you’ll surely have more success selling your book with a publisher than if you do all by your own. That’s what he thinks and actually he is kind of right...How do you deal if you don’t get any answer from publishers? Just keep trying or try something new? Thanks in advance for the help!
 

Sonya Heaney

Super Member
Registered
Joined
Apr 16, 2019
Messages
565
Reaction score
78
Location
Canberra
Hi there! I wanted to ask if any of you have had any new experiences with Novum Publishing? I am aware that the thread is a bit older and that some things may have changed in the last years. One of my colleagues has been desperately looking for a publisher for a long time. He simply does not get an answer from most of the publishers. Or he only gets very simple standard answers. I meant he could try self-publishing, but he says that it's not really his thing...It would be important for him to get professional proofreading, editing and general feedback on his book from a publisher. After all, publishers know the market much better and you’ll surely have more success selling your book with a publisher than if you do all by your own. That’s what he thinks and actually he is kind of right...How do you deal if you don’t get any answer from publishers? Just keep trying or try something new? Thanks in advance for the help!

***

Edit again, because now I'm mostly awake I have something to add about this: After all, publishers know the market much better and you’ll surely have more success selling your book with a publisher than if you do all by your own. That’s what he thinks and actually he is kind of right...

That's the thing, though. Vanity publishers don't care about the market and they don't care about selling your books. They make their money off you before the book is published, and then it's all up to you. They WON'T get your books into shops - they don't care about that because they've already got your money in the bank. They don't care what the market is, because vanity-published books generally spend the remainder of their days in boxes in your garage. It's not a vanity publisher's priority to sell your books. You're WORSE OFF going with them.

The only time a vanity publisher has a place is if you've got some little project you only want a few copies of for yourself (e.g. a book about your family), but even then there are cheaper options. It costs $49 to use IngramSpark and they'll distribute your books worldwide, in print and ebook.

***

Older post:

(I preface this with the fact I am VERY angry about vanity presses at the moment.)

Nothing has changed. They're still a vanity publisher, complete with cheesy stock photography, a lot of nonsense about "realising your publishing dreams" - and they still claim "WE ARE WORLD RECORD!" (edit: HERE). A vanity publisher doesn't just wake up one day and decide to become a real publisher when they're already making a fortune scamming people.

The only difference between this one and many others is that they're clever enough to bury their costs so deeply you won't even know about them until you've signed your life savings away. I know this because - out of curiosity - I signed up for their ridiculous "information package" (and now must rush to unsubscribe before I'm spammed for years).

I'm sorry, but - having spent the past three years helping someone finish a manuscript, and then spending freaking ages researching agents and REAL publishers for them, they decided to go with a vanity publisher who asked for $36 000. I have no time for this nonsense anymore, not after wasting so much time and energy and emotional effort just for someone to throw it all away because a scammer said a few nice things. :(

Here's what the "information package" says (they still don't mention the money they're going to ask for). The appalling grammar and spelling and punctuation both on their site and in the "package" are sign enough they're a scam. Bold=theirs:

thank you for your interest in novum publishing.

I am delighted that you are considering our expertise for the publication of your manuscript.
Thank you very much!

The Latin word novum stands for something unique and unprecedented. This concept has also been the philosophy of our family-run publishing company and the foundation of our day-to-day business of discovering new authors for nearly 20 years.

Together with my colleagues, our authors and our booksellers as well as media partners, we have been able to establish one of the most influential publishing houses for new authors. Today our award-winning publishing house features numerous books by still unknown authors who have been introduced to the book market thanks to our experience and extensive know-how in this field.

Our success in book sales, licences for translations into other languages, braille editions and film adaptions show that there is a great interest in new ideas and perspectives. Moreover, thousands of reviews and reports in countless newspapers and the media as well as publications of up to 15 volumes by individual authors impressively demonstrate the market’s particular demand for professionally published books by new authors.

We passionately believe that each and every author with a good manuscript should get a fair shot to present their work to a wider audience all across the globe. It is our mission to find the best possible way to publish your work.

Find out more about the publishing house, the book industry in general as well as all kinds of great tips and tricks for new authors below.

BLAH BLAH BLAH RANDOM PROMOTIONAL STUFF

More information that might spark your interest:
Our books - novum online store
Authors’ opinions about the publisher
Publishing blog
Video about the publisher


It would be a great privilege for us to receive your manuscript for a free perusal either by e-mail to [email protected] or by post! Our editorial office will require about 1-2 weeks to come to a decision. You will then receive a non-binding publishing offer or a reasoned letter of refusal.
We guarantee the confidential and respectful processing of both your data and your manuscript. Rest assured that your intellectual property is in safe hands with us!

True to our motto “He who stops being better stops being good”, we would be delighted and feel honoured to work with you on the publication of your book.


With kind regards from the publisher

Bianca Bendra
Author support

novum publishing
Alpha House - 100 Borough High Street – London SE1 1LB
www.novum-publishing.co.uk - [email protected]
 
Last edited:

inspector

Registered
Joined
Jun 21, 2020
Messages
13
Reaction score
0
Hello Sonya Heaney. Thank you for the feedback! :)

Have you ever made your own experiences with vanity publishers? Or why are you so angry about them at the moment?

I think it's clever that you generally inform yourself in advance. If you know what you want and what you're looking for, and if you compare your interests with the publisher, then you'll quickly see if this is the right way or not.

Of course, it is very demotivating when you hardly ever get an answer from publishers. My colleague feels the same way. But one question: why do you think you wasted your time? Did you help somebody to finish the manuscript just for fun? Or why does it bother you now that he/she went to a vanity publisher?

I imagine that you can’t even compare all publishers (whether vanity or not)…there are so many and there might be good and bad ones. My colleague said that there are also vanity publishers who offer proofreading, editing, marketing, cover design, etc. So, you get something for your money. And of course, there are always cheaper options, but I personally have my doubts about that anyway. It won't be so cheap for any reason. I never go for the cheapest option. Printing a book is not that difficult.. But for only $49 you won’t be able to publish a good book either…

and my question was actually: what do you do if you don't get an answer from publishers? Just carry on or rather improve your manuscript on your own? Do you have any experience?
 

lizmonster

Possibly A Mermaid Queen
Absolute Sage
Super Member
Registered
Joined
Jul 5, 2012
Messages
9,128
Reaction score
4,715
Location
Massachusetts
Website
elizabethbonesteel.com
and my question was actually: what do you do if you don't get an answer from publishers? Just carry on or rather improve your manuscript on your own? Do you have any experience?

There are many options:

1) Keep working on the MS.
2) Self-publish.
3) Write another book.

There's nothing a vanity press can do for you that you can't do for yourself, and with better quality.
 

Sonya Heaney

Super Member
Registered
Joined
Apr 16, 2019
Messages
565
Reaction score
78
Location
Canberra
Have you ever made your own experiences with vanity publishers?

No. I worked my arse off for years and got myself a publishing contract.

Or why are you so angry about them at the moment?

"having spent the past three years helping someone finish a manuscript, and then spending freaking ages researching agents and REAL publishers for them, they decided to go with a vanity publisher who asked for $36 000."

Of course, it is very demotivating when you hardly ever get an answer from publishers.

I'm a former ballet dancer. Almost nobody ever gets to dance the lead in Swan Lake. Nobody is owed a career as a ballet dancer, and nobody is owed a career as an author. You work hard, and then you work harder, and then you work harder. Even published authors get rejections.

there are also vanity publishers who offer proofreading, editing, marketing, cover design, etc. So, you get something for your money. And of course, there are always cheaper options, but I personally have my doubts about that anyway. It won't be so cheap for any reason. I never go for the cheapest option. Printing a book is not that difficult.. But for only $49 you won’t be able to publish a good book either…

No. Vanity publishers take your money *before* the book is published and do nothing after. It's a scam. Read about IngramSpark if you want to, but it is not the same thing. It's not a case of getting a better book the more money you waste on it. And it *is* wasted money, no matter how many phony movie deals they offer.

A person should not be paying a "publisher" to publish their book.

and my question was actually: what do you do if you don't get an answer from publishers? Just carry on or rather improve your manuscript on your own? Do you have any experience?

Nobody owes anyone a publishing contract. Work, learn, work, learn, and then work harder. That's the only way to get there. If a person is not getting any responses to their work, the only thing to do is try harder. It's a brutal industry, and there are no shortcuts.
 
Last edited:

Happy Thanksgiving

Autumn image for Thanksgiving