Publishing is doomed?

[AryaT92]

What do you all think of libraries? Fair or no.. Books aren't like songs, after you read it not many people go back and reread, and even if you do... check out again. Does it hurt authors book sales?

 

[Shady Lane]

I'm eighteen, I have a job (I write books, actually...) and I don't download illegally. Books, music, anything. Have I in the past? Yep, but I didn't feel good about it, so I stopped. My favorite band came out with a new album this week. The best way to show this band that I respect them is to pay money for their album.

Same goes for authors. I won't make the argument that pirating is wrong, because that's just a moot point, but it is disrespectful.

As a caviot: a lot of people I know who download illegally buy a legal copy after. So the effect is the same. AND some artists and writers make their work available intentionally for free, and that's an entirely different kettle of fish.

 

[willietheshakes]

What do you all think of libraries? Fair or no.. Books aren't like songs, after you read it not many people go back and reread, and even if you do... check out again. Does it hurt authors book sales?

Libraries BUY books.

And in some countries (Canada, for example), there are Public Lending rights which provide payments for writers based on their representation in library collections.

Next question?

 

[Eddyz Aquila]

I may not be an 18th century nobleman with a full fledged library, but I do admit feeling a little pride in my book-filled apartment. Books are sexy.

"Why don't you come over and check out my Kindle?" just doesn't have the same ring as "Wanna come over and help me put up some bookshelves?"

Ah that made me chuckle. I loved it.

The only thing bad about having a huge library is dusting the books... And if you happen to have a very extensive one, may the Cleaning God be with you.

 

[Momento Mori]

AryaT92:
we sat down at our hotels bar to find an editor from Random House next to us.

Did they have a name?

AryaT92:
Basically, she told me that in 2 years because of the business model and Kindle / piracy of books publishing is completely fucked.

Wow. A whole 2 years, eh?

AryaT92:
Basically her prediction for the future was that, writers who are established will continue to right because they will sell enough to make money, new writers will remain starving artists and eventually not even try because if they aren't writing for themselves they sure as hell can't expect any money out of it. Editors / Publishers will be cut out and sales for books will go directly to Amazon / Apple's new e-book coming out next week.

As an editor at Random House, did she say anything about how these books would market themselves?

AryaT92:
People spend $300 on a Kindle so when the book they want isn't on it they will complain and basically yell "Why the fuck is ____ not on this machine I just paid for? I don't want a hard copy!"

Of course, Kindle is pretty useless for children's picture books and any kind of technical book, so at least that type of publishing is safe. Plus text books and reference books will still need to be in print.

Then there's the whole thing about people getting signed copies of books, which isn't so easy when it's in electronic format.

And people who can't find a book in electronic copy will usually go out and buy a physical one.

AryaT92:
What she told me was her prediction is that we will go back to the 1300 age when Bach / Mozart weren't paid or individually wealthy but were accepted into an aristocratic lifestyle based on their contributions.

Well, this editor clearly isn't a student of history.

AryaT92:
Thoughts? Discuss?

Shenaningans.

AryaT92:
Because Kindle offers books at much lower prices, which are even trying to go lower there will be no need to go out to the store and buy a print book.

Back in the days before Napster and downloading of music, people used to buy music on audio tapes and lo, the CD came along and people said that no one wanted to buy music on tapes anymore, so music publishers started to phase tapes out of stores.

Flasforward 15 years and tapes are starting to make a come-back. Why? Because the babyboomers prefer the technology they grew up with and because the 30 somethings like the nostalgia of listening to taped music.

Another example if the number of vinyl shops in and around London, selling records because people prefer the old-fashioned sound.

AryaT92:
Yeah I love having an album with perfect quality songs and the cool picture of the album on my iPod / iTouch / iPhone but you don't see me going out and buying $20 albums when I can get the almost the same music for free. And not even for bands that I REALLY love and respect as artists and people.

Let's all hope that when you're published, people show your work the same "love and respect" that you show other peoples.

AryaT92:
I wasn't bitching at all, I was simply sharing what I overheard to see if it had any truth behind it.

I thought you'd said you'd had a conversation with her, rather than just "overhearing" something.

AryaT92:
I support them in other ways. I pay to go to their concerts, I pay for some of their books, but I will never pay for Lil Wayne's new hit song even though it sits on my iPod.

That's no excuse and you know it.

AryaT92:
It's easier to pirate than even buy in most cases.

It's easier to shoplift than it is to queue up and pay for goods in a store but that doesn't make it right when people do it.

Convenience is not an excuse for theft and what you're doing is taking something that doesn't belong to you.

AryaT92:
Also, I simply don't believe you have never pirated anything in your life. Maybe my generation and yours are different, judge me as you will.

Don't blame your "generation" for your own actions. It's weak.

AryaT92:
I got what I wanted to learn out of this thread

I bet you did.

AryaT92:
I meant that if I found it easier to obtain the music legally it wouldn't be my money but my parents.. So it isn't the fact that I'm not willing to pay for the music because I am more than happy to for music that is worth paying for.

So go out and earn some money or do some chores around the house in return for pocket money. Stealing is stealing regardless of whether you think the item you're stealing is worth paying for or not.

AryaT92:
I'm only 17 remember?

And?

As for The States News article. There's so much misinformation and self-justification in there, that it doesn't support what you think it supports.

AryaT92:
What do you all think of libraries? Fair or no.. Books aren't like songs, after you read it not many people go back and reread, and even if you do... check out again. Does it hurt authors book sales?

Not only do libraries buy books, but the more people who borrow a book, the more copies of that book the libary will buy and in addition to getting the royalties from the books sales, the author also receives a sum of money under their public lending rights.

MM

 

[willietheshakes]

The only thing bad about having a huge library is dusting the books...

Perhaps you have never MOVED a huge library. Or have blocked it out. Because that's WAY worse than dusting!

 

[Maxinquaye]

As to the "prying the books out of my cold dead hands" - which is valid when it comes to me as well - the thing is, we as writers have no say in the matter. It's all down to what the consumers and the industry as a whole does. We got no say in the matter. Do I regret that? Sure. Do I fret about it? It's pointless, because I have no say and have to adapt to what's out there.

The format isn't important for me. It's writing stories. How those stories are published is secondary, as long as I get paid. And I honestly think book publishing is in a better situation than the music industry. If our primary means of story telling was short stories instead of novels, then maybe we would face the same danger as the music industry did with the arrival of the mp3s. But we write novels, and people aren't going to want dodgy copies of novels that they have to spent a couple of days, or even weeks, reading.

Still, they'll have to pry the books I own out of my cold dead hands.

 

[Rhoda Nightingale]

Hank Moody, you are my hero.

Also:

"Why don't you come over and check out my Kindle?" just doesn't have the same ring as "Wanna come over and help me put up some bookshelves?"

This, this! A thousand times, this.

I love libraries. They are an invaluable resource for people who are curious about a particular book but either can't or aren't ready to spend money on it yet. I myself will always buy a book that I loved reading, and often get things from the library to read first. Most recent example: Koji Suzuki's Ring trilogy, which I bought as a set last month, after reading each one individually about a year ago.

And by the way, AryaT92, a lot of artists have free downloads of a handful of songs on their websites, as promotional tools. I see that as similar to what I do with libraries. Preview for free, buy if interested. And keep in mind that most authors--at least the ones I know--have no problem with libraries whatsoever, and don't see them as a violation of their rights.

ETA: I'm also a rabid rereader. If it was worth my time once, it'll be worth it a second time.

 

[kuwisdelu]

Talk is cheap and I simply don't believe you. Nonetheless, it doesn't matter what I believe.

In the past I haven't cared about downloading music, neither do billions of other people. After talking to the woman yesterday it made me think twice. I might have to go pick up a couple of albums to pay my dues.

Thank you for teaching me the error of my ways. From now on I shall preach my dogoodyness on forums so you all love me. But seriously, thanks for displaying the error of my ways, also, I have never pirated a book and will never pirate a book. I see your points and I will start spending money.

Also, I wasn't playing off my age, it was relavant to both cases in ways that helped my arguement.

Good day to you all, keep the pirates off the open waters!

In the grown up world, people have to be ready to back up their statements.

And just as a shameless plug for Porcupine Tree...

It's quite the coincidence how appropriate the title songs lyrics are to this argument:

Sunlight coming through the haze
No gaps in the blind
To let it inside
The bed is unmade, some music still plays

TV, yeah it's always on
The flicker of the screen
A movie actress screams
I'm basking in the shit flowing out of it

I'm stoned in the mall again
Terminally bored
Shuffling around the stores
And shoplifting is getting so last years thing

Xbox is a god to me
A finger on the switch
My mother is a bitch
My father gave up ever trying to talk to me

Don't try engaging me
The vaguest of shrugs
The prescription drugs
You'll never find a person inside

My face is mogadon
Curiosity has given up on me
I'm tuning out desires
The pills are on the rise

How can I be sure I'm here?
The pills that I've been taking confuse me
I need to know that someone sees that
There's nothing left, I simply am not here

I'm through with pornography
The acting is lame
The action is tame
Explicitly dull, arousal anulled

Your mouth should be boarded up
Talking all day with nothing to say
Your shallow proclamations
All misinformation

My friend says he wants to die
He's in a band, they sound like Pearl Jam
Their clothes are all black
The music is crap

In school I don't concentrate
And sex is kinda fun, but just another one
Of all the empty ways of using up a day

How can I be sure I'm here?
The pills that I've been taking confuse me
I need to know that someone sees that
There's nothing left, I simply am not here

Pirating is SO last decade...

You need to be more hip.

 

[AryaT92]

I meant overheard in the sense that I wasn't at the bar to drink but to talk.... He was trying to play on my age and being at a bar.

The year was not the year she gave but I couldn't remember so I threw something out.

As for her name I didn't get the full thing, Amy was the first I believe? Doesn't help much.

And let's hope I get published, I wrote the book to get a message across, if I needed money I would ask the parents.. Money can't buy me love eh?

But yeah, I'll have to start going out and buying albums to makeup for my carelessness and theft.

You can remind me in the next 5 pages of the post or you can post something that is worth reading, something that will teach and let observers learn.

 

[gothicangel]

Perhaps you have never MOVED a huge library. Or have blocked it out. Because that's WAY worse than dusting!

I moved from nothern England to Scotland 3 years ago (160 miles) and most of my book collection still lives with my parents

Talking of tapes, the last time I tried to play one I could remember how to fit it into the tape deck.

 

[AryaT92]

Kudos, you are accounted for. What about that pirated Miley Cyrus song you have that is just so catchy on your iPhone? Whip out an album or bow your head in shame!

On a side note: That is an extremely creepy picture / what album is that?

 

[firedrake]

I'm puzzled.

You sat and chatted to an editor in a bar and didn't pitch your book to her

How odd.

 

[AryaT92]

I'm puzzled.

You sat and chatted to an editor in a bar and didn't pitch your book to her

How odd.

I'm on submission to a publisher who I am very confident will make an offer *knocks on wood*. If all fails, I am confident my agent will know how to go about things, he is a top one.

Also, she kind of implied that she doesn't take manuscripts from friends etc. Also, it is a longshot that she works in a division that would solicit my genre, aside from the fact that she is now in the e-book division there and no longer an editor I think (?).

It didn't seem appropriate but that is the reason I did go and visit my dad in the first place.

 

[Eddyz Aquila]

I'm puzzled.

You sat and chatted to an editor in a bar and didn't pitch your book to her

How odd.

You Sir, are a genius.

Perhaps you have never MOVED a huge library. Or have blocked it out. Because that's WAY worse than dusting!

Looking forward to do it this summer. My grandparents' house is stacked (or maybe overfilled) with books, and it's up to me to take them out, dust them, arrange them, put them back... It's not 100 books. It's way more than that.

I guess my back will look like Phelps' once I'm done. Or broken into pieces.

 

[kuwisdelu]

Kudos, you are accounted for. What about that pirated Miley Cyrus song you have that is just so catchy on your iPhone? Whip out an album or bow your head in shame!

Eww.

 

[firedrake]

You Sir, are a genius.

It's Madam, actually, but cheers

 

[AryaT92]

Porcupine Tree is good. I have some of them on my iPod.

Lazarus
Trains
Novak
So Called Friend
Sound of Muzak
The Start of Something

 

[Rhoda Nightingale]

Kudos, you are accounted for.

Oh Christ. *headdesk* Can you please just stop using the "You're all liars, I don't believe you, everyone downloads!" argument? It's hugely insulting and isn't going to help you out here one little bit.

 

[Medievalist]

if I needed money I would ask the parents.. Money can't buy me love eh?

You can remind me in the next 5 pages of the post or you can post something that is worth reading, something that will teach and let observers learn.

You just continue to enhance my initial impression of you.

 

[willietheshakes]

Porcupine Tree is good. I have some of them on my iPod.

Lazarus
Trains
Novak
So Called Friend
Sound of Muzak
The Start of Something

Did you pay for any of them, or is that why you didn't recognize the album cover (per your previous post)?

 

[Eddyz Aquila]

Porcupine Tree is good. I have some of them on my iPod.

PirateBay
Mininova
IsoHunt

There, fixed for you.

Just pulling your leg.

 

[kuwisdelu]

Somewhere in the world, Steven Wilson is doing this:



But that's okay. I'm still happy I saw him do this:



And now I am doing this:



Carry on.

 

[James D. Macdonald]

There's no returns and the production costs are less.

Production costs are less, but not a lot less. Printing is the cheapest part of publishing.

 

[Momento Mori]

AryaT92:
Money can't buy me love eh?

[SNIP]

You can remind me in the next 5 pages of the post or you can post something that is worth reading, something that will teach and let observers learn.

You should really see about getting a refund from that charm school because it clearly hasn't done you much good and maybe you could use it to pay for some music for a change.

MM