Reading a ton of MG and YA while writing my first book (originally conceived as an adult novel), I was surprised at how adult the voices are in many MG/YA books. "This is how it all begins. With Zephyr and Fry - reigning neighborhood sociopaths - torpedoing after me and the whole forest floor shaking under my feet as I blast through air, trees, this white-hot panic." That's the open from one of my favorite MG/YA books, an award-winner - the narrating character is 13. I've stopped worrying about writing down to young readers, at least in words or style. So long as the attitude of the characters, the soul, fits with their age, it feels like we're at a point where the language isn't much different from adult fiction. Is that correct?
Middle Grade, Young Adult, Adult: How do you categorize your novel?
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I've always benchmarked YA novels by the age of the characters involved. If they're 17-20 years old, boom YA novel. My three player characters are 17, 18, and 18 and-a-half respectively.
teeheesrw
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Hi, I've been reading through this thread (there's a lot) and from my skimming I didn't see any posts involving stories with multiple MCs such as a daughter and a father. I rotate between 3 different POVs - an 18yo girl, her love interest, and the girl's father. Does anyone foresee that being an issue in publishing it as YA? 'Cause I'll be honest - I started this story when I was in high school and didn't really give a thought to who my MCs were, and now that I want to publish it, I don't want all publishers to be like "ahh this MC is too OLD since he's a dad" and reject it. 
I'm just finishing a novel with a 12 year old MC. I have multiple POV characters but mostly it is the 12 yo main character female, a 14-16 yo major character male and the other characters mainly being fantasy characters (i.e. not humans). This is a portal fantasy (I just saw that classification in this forum and think it describes my story perfectly) and it's just under 60k words. I'm not sure if this would be considered upper MG or YA. I don't write about sex (MC is as the first kiss stage more than anything) but there is death, identity issues and moral dilemmas that are a more advanced that typical middle school issues. Any thoughts on how you all would categorize this?
Also, slightly unrelated question--I was thinking of have small illustrations at the beginning of each chapter and occasionally a full page illustration throughout the book. Is that something that translates well into eBooks? I'm not an eBook reader so really have no idea.
Also, slightly unrelated question--I was thinking of have small illustrations at the beginning of each chapter and occasionally a full page illustration throughout the book. Is that something that translates well into eBooks? I'm not an eBook reader so really have no idea.
That's good to hear, as that was my thinking as I wrote the book. Do adults read MG frequently?
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My vague understanding is that a lot of adults read YA for pleasure. Fewer adults read MG for pleasure but they may read it with their children, or prior to giving it to their children.
I’d say a 12yo protagonist puts you squarely in the MG category. It might get a little sticky having the older POV character, especially if it’s a 16yo, not a 14yo. 14yo is that tricky spot between the two age categories so can go MG, especially with a 12yo protagonist, but a 16yo POV character would be a harder sell to an MG publisher.
Speaking as an adult who sometimes reads MG, I can say that at least one of us old folk do read it. There's anecdotal evidence I've seen online of parents/caregivers reading MG along with, and even ahead of, their MG kids. And of course many adults screen material before letting their children get it, and read it that way; MG is still an age where there's likely to be a gatekeeper involved in book selection, though not always.
As for why I, a childless adult, still read MG, they can make nice palate cleansers, and sometimes seem able to just do fun and interesting things for the sake of being fun and interesting. (And, yes, they can tackle some pretty thorny stuff, if not graphically or grotesquely, because life's never been bubble-wrapped and the kids who read MG can also be dealing with some pretty thorny stuff... The best stories don't talk down to or preach at their audience, no matter that audiences age.)
Thanks, all. This is very helpful.
That makes a lot of sense to me and I’m glad to hear that you read it truly for pleasure rather than hate keeping, etc. I think adults would enjoy my book and would hope the classification would not deter readers. Do you happen to have any experience reading MG eBooks with illustrations? Or perhaps you primarily read print books in the MG genre?
I do have an occasional POV narrative from the MC’s mother, actually at the beginning of the novel to develop the MC’s character. Do you think this will be seen as an issue? I could turn that chapter into a more third person omniscient POV if you think that would be more easily accepted? As for the boy, his age isn’t stated—he’s just a few years older than the MC.
Aenelis
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I'm not sure how to categorize mine. I want to say it's YA.
- Age 11
- In the MC's world, 12 is the adult age, and 18 is citizenship.
- Wanting to be seen as an adult. YA seems fitting with teens wanting to be seen as such in our world. MG readers would not relate as much, though I do believe some are pressed to take responsibility early on (and so does the MC).
- 74,000 words
- The MC is more "grown up" than others his age due to living in the slums, and takes almost the sole resonsibility of raising his little brother. So, the voice feels more YA.
- I think the standalone prequel I'm writing is definitely YA due to a rise in content, but same age issue.
An agent once told me the story is MG because of age alone, and he only read the first 10 pages. He thought of it as an "Oliver Twist in a futuristic setting," which intrigued him at first. But the MC is nearing adult rituals since he's near age (historical mirror in world where there was no such thing as teens). Content seems edgy for MG.
I was curious what AI would say and found it interesting (I gave it a ton of detail to analyze):
Based on the details you've provided, **Young Adult (YA)** appears to be the most suitable category for your novel. Here's why: 1. **Complex Themes**: Your story deals with complex themes such as trauma, dystopian society, cultural adaptation, and personal growth. These are common in YA literature and resonate well with teenage readers who are exploring similar concepts of identity and belonging. 2. **Content Considerations**: YA readers are generally more equipped to handle mature themes and nuanced cultural discussions. 3. **Protagonist's Age**: While your main character is eleven, the age of adulthood in your universe is twelve. This effectively places him on the cusp of adulthood, aligning with the transitional phase often explored in YA novels. YA literature can feature younger protagonists if the themes and narratives are geared toward older readers. 4. **Audience Appeal**: Your story's blend of Greek mythology, futuristic elements, and deeper themes like environmentalism and humanity can attract both YA readers and adults. YA is known for its crossover appeal to adult readers who enjoy stories with rich world-building and mature themes. 5. **Market Expectations**: Agents and publishers often consider both the protagonist's journey and the story's thematic depth when categorizing a book. YA allows for more flexibility in content complexity and can accommodate stories that might be too intricate for MG readers. **Highlight Universal Themes**: Emphasize the universal coming-of-age aspects, cultural exploration, and personal resilience in your queries and pitches. These elements are compelling to YA readers. By categorizing your novel as YA, you align the story's themes, content, and complexity with the expectations of the target audience, increasing its potential appeal and marketability.
- Age 11
- In the MC's world, 12 is the adult age, and 18 is citizenship.
- Wanting to be seen as an adult. YA seems fitting with teens wanting to be seen as such in our world. MG readers would not relate as much, though I do believe some are pressed to take responsibility early on (and so does the MC).
- 74,000 words
- The MC is more "grown up" than others his age due to living in the slums, and takes almost the sole resonsibility of raising his little brother. So, the voice feels more YA.
- I think the standalone prequel I'm writing is definitely YA due to a rise in content, but same age issue.
An agent once told me the story is MG because of age alone, and he only read the first 10 pages. He thought of it as an "Oliver Twist in a futuristic setting," which intrigued him at first. But the MC is nearing adult rituals since he's near age (historical mirror in world where there was no such thing as teens). Content seems edgy for MG.
I was curious what AI would say and found it interesting (I gave it a ton of detail to analyze):
Based on the details you've provided, **Young Adult (YA)** appears to be the most suitable category for your novel. Here's why: 1. **Complex Themes**: Your story deals with complex themes such as trauma, dystopian society, cultural adaptation, and personal growth. These are common in YA literature and resonate well with teenage readers who are exploring similar concepts of identity and belonging. 2. **Content Considerations**: YA readers are generally more equipped to handle mature themes and nuanced cultural discussions. 3. **Protagonist's Age**: While your main character is eleven, the age of adulthood in your universe is twelve. This effectively places him on the cusp of adulthood, aligning with the transitional phase often explored in YA novels. YA literature can feature younger protagonists if the themes and narratives are geared toward older readers. 4. **Audience Appeal**: Your story's blend of Greek mythology, futuristic elements, and deeper themes like environmentalism and humanity can attract both YA readers and adults. YA is known for its crossover appeal to adult readers who enjoy stories with rich world-building and mature themes. 5. **Market Expectations**: Agents and publishers often consider both the protagonist's journey and the story's thematic depth when categorizing a book. YA allows for more flexibility in content complexity and can accommodate stories that might be too intricate for MG readers. **Highlight Universal Themes**: Emphasize the universal coming-of-age aspects, cultural exploration, and personal resilience in your queries and pitches. These elements are compelling to YA readers. By categorizing your novel as YA, you align the story's themes, content, and complexity with the expectations of the target audience, increasing its potential appeal and marketability.
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“AI” lies, and is not acceptable to post on AW. Also, know that anything you run through LLMs (aka “AI”) is used to train it, essentially will be stolen. So be careful with any use of LLMs for your own writing (but, again, LLM generated content is not acceptable to post on AW).
As for your novel, an 11yo protagonist is not YA. It might be MG or adult, but it cannot be YA. If you feel the rest of your novel matches YA in voice and themes and pacing, you might want to consider aging up your protagonist quite a bit. But at 11yo, you’re looking at MG or adult.
As for your novel, an 11yo protagonist is not YA. It might be MG or adult, but it cannot be YA. If you feel the rest of your novel matches YA in voice and themes and pacing, you might want to consider aging up your protagonist quite a bit. But at 11yo, you’re looking at MG or adult.
If you have an 11 y/o, it's not even close to YA.
It'd have to be adult. You can't have a YA with a 11 y/o protagonist. You can't even have a YA with a 12 y/o protagonist. That's not how the books are marketed.
I'd have to ask why it's so essential the character be 11? Why not jump bump all of the ages back a few years? 14 is an iffier spot (and one that hurt me when querying my first YA novel... along with the length), but 15 is more clearly in YA.
From what you've described, you probably can't query it as MG. 74k is very long for MG, even as SFF. I've sometimes suspected part of the reason my MG fantasy hasn't done well querying is the 65k length (which isn't crazy for MG fantasy, but MG tends to skew short)
Yes, it sounds like you've written something that doesn't neatly fit into a bucket. That's an issue for agents and publishers.
Don't trust AI for stuff like this. Or for most stuff.
Most of that is flat-out wrong. Even a rookie agent will tell you the age is a hard "no". You'd have to query it as adult. That's the only thing that makes sense in context.
Aenelis
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In this case, it's just analysis content, apparently faulty. AI gets me thinking or brainstorm. It's good for that, I believe. It got me out of a writer's block once. I figured, hmm, could it help me with deciding MG or YA? Turns out, no.
One reason I came back here is I want more human input, so thanks for the thoughts. I got sucked into AI for opinions. I am a recovering AI addict.
I think you're right with the MG or adult. I've heard that before somewhere. If my prequel can't be YA, then it surely can't be MG due to the content. Adult is the only fit then. So, I better treat this sequel story as adult too then. I think aging up doesn't work in this case because it's reflecting an ancient culture where certain ages were stages in one's life. An example would be ASOIAF, perhaps, which was based on medieval culture.
Adult, it is. I appreciate it, and I'll refrain from AI.
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