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Lyrical Press

editing_for_authors
Editing for authors: because every writer needs a good editor.

AngelaA

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Well I heard back and it was a yes and a no!

Great email, full of detail, wants to offer a contract but I need to do some rewrites. Everything said makes sense so I guess I have some work to do!

I'll keep you all posted!
 

EgyptianGoddess

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Well I heard back and it was a yes and a no!

Great email, full of detail, wants to offer a contract but I need to do some rewrites. Everything said makes sense so I guess I have some work to do!

I'll keep you all posted!


Great news!! Congrats to you and best of luck.
 

Eriador117

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Thanks, Cherelle

and congrats Angela, good luck :)
 

wannawrite

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Hi guys, me again. Talked to Renee (VERY cool lady) over at Lyrical this am via e-mail, she DID get my mss. this time....yeah! Knowing that it landed in the right hands is a comfort. Gonna go back to my corner and play 'this little piggy' again, til I get word, one way or the other. She said 2-4 weeks from this point on. Cross your fingers for me!

Peace.
 

wannawrite

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Hey, guys! Just a quick update...I just heard back from Renee Rocco over at Lyrical. I got a 'revise and resubmit' from her...which I think is WAY COOL! Like Tri said, nothing wrong with sending in your best. I need to work on dialouge tags...I have too many of them, but that is no shocker. Got to cut some out and probably tighten some dialouge along the way. Got to be a more historicaly accurate, I use present references that jar the reader out of the story...and my characters expound a lot. I knew this, too. Sooo...

All of the critiques are valid, IMHO and I can handle them. Plus, I am really digging that they liked my story and still want a chance at publishing it. Hopefully, anyway.

Today is a happy day. Can't wait to get to work!

Take care, everybody! Now, there is a thread on here that talks about dialouge tags, right? Don't want to go overboard, might need a little guidance...:) Wish me luck.
 

triceretops

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wannawrite, that's great news! It's all for the best, believe me. Always take what you can learn with a light heart. In my case they went after overused words and had me chop many of them out--words like "and", "only", "view" and a plethora of "ly" words. They're also big on simple sentences--clarity, and words that don't require a dictionary.

Tri
 

pepperlandgirl

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I submitted my MS on May 13 and received a contract today. The turnaround was so quick, my head is still spinning. I wish I knew what the sales figures were like, though.
 

wannawrite

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Way to go, Pepper. I, too, would like to know their sales figures, but have not been able to come up with any yet. I've hit a couple of 'the money goes here' blogs, but they haven't mentioned Lyrical. If offered a contract, I plan to ask what the average anticipated sales are. Renee seemed very open, so, I don't see any harm in asking. On a more personal note, I'm really sort of looking into ripping into my mss. I'm one of those sickos that really, really enjoys editing....probably more than I like the writing process, itself. Writing is easy. Making something shine, isn't, and I enjoy the challenge.

Anyway, keep me posted if you get your hands on those figures, will you?

Again, guys, way to go! :)
 

AngelaA

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I just finished my edits...I have another set of eyes looking at my ms right now so I hope to email Ms. Rocco soon. I have to say though that I'm pretty embarrassed by the many problems I have found going through it. I've been working my butt off to polish and I think I'm almost there but it was hard work! I really appreciate the fact that Ms.Rocco took the time to point out the flaws in my writing...it has been a learning experience to say the least...but again, very, very embarrassing! I now see how some authors never get past the editing stage of the writing process...it's so easy to keep reworking and reworking a scene. All in all, I think I have a pretty tight novel now and if Lyrical passes at least I know I've caught a lot of mistakes so that I won't be further embarrassed in the future!
 

wannawrite

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Yeah, I know what you mean. I looked over what I sent out, and my fingers are already itching to start tapping those keys. But, like I said, I LIKE to edit. None of my work is ever finished, far as I'm concerned.

And, hey, don't beat yourself up too much. Sounds like they liked your stuff, so it can't be as bad as you think it is. You made the cut, kiddo! My fingers are crossed for you. :)
 

michael_b

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I, too, would like to know their sales figures, but have not been able to come up with any yet.

I'm not with Lyrical, but based on sales at the publishers I've been with in the past, and those I'm currently with, I can tell you a few general things.

Part of your sales will be determined by the fact you're a new author. New authors tend to sell fewer copies of books than established authors with a following.

Next, sales will depend on the content/genre of the work. For m/f romances--in my experience--paranormal sells the best. M/m sells better for me than any m/f title I've ever written. My m/m cyberpunk books sell the most copies, while m/m paranormal sells fewer copies.

Paranormal m/m/f menage sells very well--again in my experience--as does interracial paranormal.

Sales for me have ranged from over 250 copies the first 'month--it was really only two weeks of a month before royalties were calculated for that month--to as few as 65 the first month--again a partial month--for a fem domme. Few people read fem domme BDSM D/s by the way, and almost no publishers will take fem domme.

Your sales could very well range from zero to several hundred copies. It all depends on content, writing style and the phase of the moon, and to some extent the publisher. (Okay, I might be joking about the phase of the moon.)
 

veinglory

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I would say the biggest single factor in sales is the publisher. I bet it would account for a good three quarters of the variance in sales figures. I hope those who would like the data now will send me their figures for the benefit of others (hint, hint).
 

wannawrite

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Thanks for your honesty, Michael B. Mine is a paranormal m/f, with a very small m/m subplot. No sex between the m/m, but much emotion and a satisfying ending for all. :)

Honestly, as a new writer, sometimes when submitting, I feel like I'm going into a knife fight armed only with a pocket knife when everyone else is carrying switchblades. The process in general is so secretive and confusing...

As usual, veinglory, thanks for your input. Keep up the good work in demystifying the process for those of us in the dark. We really, really do appreciate your efforts!
 

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veinglory is absolutely right, because it does fall on the popularity of the publisher when all is said and done. This is not to say that the author doesn't have to get out there and shake the universe to draw attention. But sales with a publisher involves many factors: Length of time in business, name brand recognition, publisher publicity and marketing, quality of product, reviews, awards, competitive price, past and current sales record, number of authors and titles, and other factors.

Ellora's Cave and Sanhaim are just two very prominent e-book publishers who have established themselves and do quite well, in fact, they can be considered leaders in the industry. (Visit Veinglory's site to get some really neat info on stats and performance--she's also a damn fine author--nobody knows this side of it better than she does).

This is my first e-book. Ever. I have NO idea what's up with this kind of publisher. I only know that it HAS to be better than what I went through with my past two print publishers--BELLY-UP--NO SALES AT ALL. So anything I pull will actually be a miracle to me. We'll see. So far Lyrical looks fine, with no real complaints, and they meet certain ethical criteria. In comparison, they are fairly new, which means author participation is very important. For instance, AW Lyrical authors should stay in touch with each other, link up, and market as a group whenever possible. Share review sources, enter contests like the Ippy (sp?), keep a blog going, take advantage of and join display sites, but remain active and current on those display sites. Join groups or organizations pertinent to your genre. Announce/list your titles in any and all free libraries (AW has one).

With any e-publisher, it boils down to what you put into it, you get out of it. We all have to make that effort. Money just doesn't roll on in. You have to make things happen.

So far I'm very impressed with the editorial side of Lyrical (That's as far as I am along the process). I'm getting slaughtered, which is DAMN good for me, because somebody is taking the time and using precision to make this book the best it can be. We don't know what the future holds, but we certainly can impact it and tilt the odds for a favorable outcome.

Good luck, all,

Tri
 

michael_b

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I would say the biggest single factor in sales is the publisher. I bet it would account for a good three quarters of the variance in sales figures. I hope those who would like the data now will send me their figures for the benefit of others (hint, hint).

To some degree it might be dependent on the publisher's popularity, but it really does have a lot to do with building a following as an author. My readers seem to follow me regardless of where I go. Other author's experiences may vary.
 

wannawrite

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Thanks, guys. Tri, you have some great ideas. I'm a newbie, so this will be my first (hopefully) book, and I could use all the advice you have to give. If I get the offer, lets talk about the AW group thing, ok?

Michael B...how did you build your following? I mean, back when you started from scratch. What was your first step? Website? Face book? Twitter? Not trying to sound stupid, just need to know where to begin. Want to build a career, not just publish a book.

Thanks, guys.
 

veinglory

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Michael I am sure this is sometimes the case. However my books with six different epublishers each fall near the mean for that publisher in sales with a earning differential of over $1000, and I see a very similar pattern in reports for authors published with multiple epublishers.

Authors can have a huge effect, but I do not think it is the norm. I think author promotion synergises with publisher standards because the buyer needs to trust the vendor. Author promotion can add a whole lot of sales to a book from the middle to top press, it will tend to have little or no effect on sales from a lower performer.
 

michael_b

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Michael B...how did you build your following? I mean, back when you started from scratch. What was your first step? Website? Face book? Twitter? Not trying to sound stupid, just need to know where to begin. Want to build a career, not just publish a book.

The best way to build a career is to keep writing, keep submitting and make sure you have books coming out at a steady pace. Don't wait to get your first book out and selling before you write and submit your next one. Don't wait until a book sells to start the next one. Keep writing. If you get a rejection from one publisher, try a different one. Start with the bigger publishers and work your way down the list to the smaller ones. Remember a book at a small publisher can earn you some money, while one sitting on your computer's hard drive does not.

Before submitting to any publisher, check out their rep here at Absolute Write. Folks here won't knowingly send you down the path to disaster.

Also, if a publisher suggests a revision before you're under contract, consider if the edit would be good for you, or if it would change your story so much it isn't yours anymore. Sometimes it's better to walk away from a contract--especially after you have a following that expects certain things of your work--than it is to change something significantly in ways you don't like.

Once the contract is signed, unless they've got good escape clauses, you're usually stuck for the term of the contract. Keep that in mind when you sign with any publisher. A lot of epubs have 2-3 year terms, some have longer ones. If you can negotiate a shorter term at those that want more than 3 years, do it if you don't feel comfortable signing for longer than that. If they don't negotiate, consider if that's the place you really want to be for the term of a long contract.

Also keep in mind once a book is sold and comes out of contract it's difficult to resell it to another publisher so typically whatever you got from sales at the first publisher is what you can expect to earn from that book. I know of few pubs actively taking ebook reprints from other publishers.

Promos: Going to Yahoo Groups chats, review site live chats and keeping up your website updated are the next best ways to gain readers after writing more books. MySpace is a waste of time IMO. I can't say I know of anyone getting sales from there because they're making it harder and harder to follow off site links. I can't say if Twitter is making me any sales yet because I haven't had any books release since I started Twittering. I do have followers on LiveJournal, and I have seen sales from there so blogs can work.

Taking out targeted banner ads helps too, but finding the right placement for those is not an easy task. It took me a lot of trial and error and I still take out the occasional ad that generates no sales to speak of. So it's pretty much a crap shoot on banner or cover ads at review sites.

I hope that's of some help.
 

michael_b

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Michael I am sure this is sometimes the case. However my books with six different epublishers each fall near the mean for that publisher in sales with a earning differential of over $1000, and I see a very similar pattern in reports for authors published with multiple epublishers.

Authors can have a huge effect, but I do not think it is the norm. I think author promotion synergises with publisher standards because the buyer needs to trust the vendor. Author promotion can add a whole lot of sales to a book from the middle to top press, it will tend to have little or no effect on sales from a lower performer.

There are a lot of factors Em. Not just the size of the publisher. I was chatting with another author who's with one of the same pubs I'm with--you're with them too--and she told me she had a book that did incredibly well, but another of her books barely sold at the same pub. Some of it is simply timing of the release--what was hot last month may be cold sales wise this month--or it could be that whole 'phase of the moon' thing I mentioned. When you get right down to it sometimes books that look like they'll do great, don't and books you don't expect to do well fly off the electronic shelf.

I didn't expect my book All Hellos to sell well but it made the Fictionwise bestseller's list in November of 2007 which surprised the heck out of me. Would it sell as well now? Who knows.

Publishing is a risky business, and not every book published sells like gangbusters whether we're talking top NYC publisher or bottom rung ebook pub, it's the same: there are no guarantees.
 

veinglory

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Sure, that's true. But I have a data set with 120 books in it now, and I am astounded how much of it is all about publisher (within the erotic romance genre). I think that if you choose a lower performing publisher you will have to work 100 time harder to make up the difference in author promotion, if you choose a publisher out of the top 20 it is probably all but impossible.

The fact that there are other sources of variance does not diminish the fact that publisher choice is probably the single greatest contributor to sales volume.
 

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