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Ellora's Cave Publishing, Inc.

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Editing for authors: because every writer needs a good editor.

gingerwoman

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I don't know that EC ever gives advances? They are, at least generally, a no advance publisher. I've heard no confirmed stories of any advances being paid.
 
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firedrake

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I don't know that EC ever gives advances? They are, at least generally, a no advance publisher. I've heard no confirmed stories of any advances being paid.

I'm getting the vibe from EC that some authors are more equal than others.
 

brainstorm77

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I'm getting the vibe from EC that some authors are more equal than others.

Isn't that the case with many publishers? Or that's the way it seems to me. The big moneymakers get pushed ahead of the rest.
 

Ann_Mayburn

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But Farrah is different because she's their 'Star' and Farrah has agents out the wazoo. I can't imagine any of her agents or reps would let her sign a contract with no advance.
 

EvolvingK

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I'm working on edits with a couple other publishers right now, but when that settles down, I'd have no problem submitting to EC again.

Thank you for this!

My personal perspective would be: maybe don't contract multiple books until you see how your sales and overall experience is with them. It is my impression that they are not the big sales leader that they used to be.

Thank you for this, too! As far as I understand the conversations I've had with them, "quickies" can count as "books" in their terms, and honestly, I have enough 7k stories around that I can fling at them if necessary that I'm not incredibly worried about filling out the contract, if it comes to that.

If it doesn't go well, at least I've learned a lot in this thread about the other erotica-type ebook publishers are, and know where to look next.
 

veinglory

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Do read the right of first refusal clause closely.

This: It pays to assume any publisher will apply the contract literally to maximize benefits to them on current and future books. They might take a Quickie, but what if they don't?
 

DexyDoo

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I believe the contract specifies anything 7000 words or up. Also, they will remove the clause if you ask. I did.
 

EvolvingK

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Do read the right of first refusal clause closely.

Always do. I'm one of those people who even reads through the little clicky agreements on websites.

I believe the contract specifies anything 7000 words or up. Also, they will remove the clause if you ask. I did.

This is one thing I've definitely heard a fair amount of, that they're willing to negotiate on a lot of their terms.
 

EvolvingK

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I have also spoken to people who reported that, in their case, they were not.

Yeah, and if it's not negotiable, then I probably won't move forward. But I want to see what I get and what I can negotiate. I've committed to nothing other than talking to the contracts people at this point (it can apparently be another 3 weeks before I hear from them).
 

Ann_Mayburn

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Don't forget you can search on Sales Rank Express to see how all of EC's books are actually selling on Amazon and compare it to other publishers. Other than Laurann Dohner and Joanna Wylde(who took her biker series to another publisher after the first book) at this point they aren't anything to write home to mom about.

http://salesrankexpress.com/

Search by publisher, then click sales in the pull down thingy. I'd also omit unavailable.
 

EvolvingK

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So I have the contract in my hot little hands, and the right of first refusal clause, as far as I can tell, only applies to prequels, sequels, or stories making use of the same characters. To me, at least, that's very very different from stating that they have right to first refusal on any work I write.

They also do not request the right on stories LESS than 7k, which means that I could, for example, write a short hot vignette for an anthology using the characters, utterly apart from EC.

Thoughts?
 

veinglory

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I, personally, think right of refusal on stories about the same characters is entirely reasonable.
 

Captcha

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So I have the contract in my hot little hands, and the right of first refusal clause, as far as I can tell, only applies to prequels, sequels, or stories making use of the same characters. To me, at least, that's very very different from stating that they have right to first refusal on any work I write.

They also do not request the right on stories LESS than 7k, which means that I could, for example, write a short hot vignette for an anthology using the characters, utterly apart from EC.

Thoughts?

I think there's a clause like that in pretty much every contract I've ever signed with an e-publisher.

I'm with veinglory - I think it's totally fair if that's all they're asking for.
 

MandyHarbin

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When I first signed with them, the clause wasn't that specific (they wanted the next romance book, period). I had to negotiate it and said they could have first right of refusal to prequels/sequels but not to just any work. They modified my contract to read what you have above and subsequent contracts I had with them left the new language in. Maybe it's standard now?
 

Jules Court

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Saw some rumors that Ellora's Cave just made staff cuts that included laying off all their contract editors. Supposedly they just have a handful of editors left????

I don't know how reliable my information is, so hopefully someone who knows more can weigh in and either confirm or refute the rumors.
 

veinglory

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There have been a tonne of alarming rumors. The only one I could verify is that Jaid Black is started a second publishing house for non-erotic works.
 

junierob

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It's true. They fired all their contract editors and cover artists. All editing will be done by the 3, maybe 4, people in the office.
 

Filigree

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Well then. Is there an emoji for 'circling the drain'?

I'm sorry to hear about this. Either EC is drastically trimming their publishing schedule, or the remaining staff will be handling everything. That's scary.

ETA: after reading that letter, I'm even more concerned. I knew about the Amazon losses (which have not been my experience, as the bulk of my sales are through Amazon), but I didn't know how dire EC's situation had become.
 
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Filigree

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I just looked at the first 100 EC books listed on Amazon, and their e-book prices are not bad. Heck, they're less than Loose Id's in many cases. Unless we're talking about readers who want 100K+ books for $3, I'm not really certain if price is a factor.
 

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