Amazon.com removes Macmillan books from site!!

[Cyia]

I think publishers should mimic the DVD/BluRay model Disney uses. If you shell out the $$$ for the BluRay, you get a DVD and digital download in the deal. That way you don't have to shell out extra cash for the other formats. If you don't like the film, you can give the DVD to someone else (or the download code) who might enjoy it.

If you buy a hardcover, then you should get a code that allows you to download the ebook version when it's available. That way, even if they put off the ebook availability for 6 months or so, readers don't have to shell out the extra cash for the digital copy. They can give the hardback as a gift and keep the digital or just keep both.

I've yet to see someone stand in line to have an e-book signed by the author.

 

[IceCreamEmpress]

If ebooks came out at the same price as their hardcover equivalent, I'll be back in the tight spot of buying fewer books.

Macmillan isn't suggesting it's going to do that. It's suggesting that Amazon's artificial limiting of the top manufacturers' list price to $9.99 doesn't work for them, because they'd rather introduce a tiered pricing system similar to the hardcover/mass market paperback system, where people who want immediate access to a given title pay a premium for that, and that titles that have been on the market longer reflect that with lower prices.

So maybe you'd choose to buy more older books, rather than so many new releases, if the new releases were $14.99 rather than $9.99. Which is still significantly cheaper than the hardcover equivalent.

Or maybe Amazon would slash the prices of new-release e-books from the list price of $14.99 to $9.99 as a loss leader. Macmillan isn't going to stop them from charging less than $14.99--they just aren't going to let Amazon set the manufacturers' list price at $9.99.

Remember, Macmillan isn't saying that Amazon can't sell an e-book with a list price of $14.99 for $9.99 or $8.99 or whatever Amazon wants to do. But Amazon was trying to say that Macmillan couldn't set a list price of $14.99.

 

[Gillhoughly]

Perks -- I got a Barnes & Noble Nook for Christmas.

FWIW--if I ever went in for e-books, I'd prefer a Nook over a Kindle. I read the reviews, and it just seems like a better product.

But I don't dare get one. Put things in my hand--books, food, pointy objects, pricy e-toys--and I'll forget they're there and drop them or make a wild gesture to illustrate a point and slam my hand into walls. Or people. I had a near-miss with a salad fork once that increased my body space by a full yard for decades.

Those times when I've dropped a book, it doesn't just hit the floor with a slap and pick up a scrape. It hits edge on and, by some fluke of gravity going neutral in that point of the space-time continuum, goes galloping across the floor, sometimes bouncing up and down like a gazelle in full rout from a peckish predator.

Add insult to injury, it suddenly stops in its flight, I accidentally kick it in my chase, and it skids like a hockey puck (across carpeting!??) until slamming into furniture (or the foot of the bookstore manager and I feel honor bound to buy the damned thing). The final result is still readable, but looks like it went a few rounds with a blender and lost.

If that happened to my shiny new 259.00 + S&H Nook...

 

[Twizzle]

If that happened to my shiny new 259.00 + S&H Nook...

QFT. I'm on my third Kindle. Third. In eight months. And my warranty is almost over.

 

[ChristineR]

Plus there are stories out there of people who dropped their Kindles in the sink and had Amazon refuse to give them books they've already paid for, people who returned their Kindles for replacement because their battery was bad and so lost all their books, and even a guy who returned three items and had Amazon remotely turn his Kindle off forever and ever because they decided he was some sort of crook.

I assume some of these got resolved, but it doesn't make Amazon look good.

 

[amergina]

Those times when I've dropped a book, it doesn't just hit the floor with a slap and pick up a scrape. It hits edge on and, by some fluke of gravity going neutral in that point of the space-time continuum, goes galloping across the floor, sometimes bouncing up and down like a gazelle in full rout from a peckish predator.

Add insult to injury, it suddenly stops in its flight, I accidentally kick it in my chase, and it skids like a hockey puck (across carpeting!??) until slamming into furniture (or the foot of the bookstore manager and I feel honor bound to buy the damned thing). The final result is still readable, but looks like it went a few rounds with a blender and lost.

If that happened to my shiny new 259.00 + S&H Nook...

My propensity for dropping books while reading in the bathtub is a big deterrent against buying an e-reader. *sploosh*

At least with paper, I can fish the thing out, and stick it by a heating vent/sunny spot to dry with a metric ton of other books on top (to keep the warping down). It might not be quite the same after its dunking, but it still is readable and it still works. If I really like the book and want a non-water-damaged copy, I'm out at most ~$25, if I happened to drop a hard cover.

 

[Unimportant]

I'm picking up, in a dim and distant way, that this thread has shifted to discussion of what's a fair e-book price, speculation on their production costs, who loves their Kindle and who won't touch one.

I'm still stuck on the fact that Amazon arbitrarily shut down all sales of my Macmillan titles last Friday.

Oh, look--they're STILL shut down.

Yeah, sorry (hangs head in shame) -- I got sidetracked. Because I divorced Amazon in one of the previous AmazonFails (the Teh Gay Ranking fiasco), so authors aren't losing sales to me, at least -- Amazon's hijinks might tick me off but they have zero effect on my book-buying choices.

 

[Twizzle]

Plus there are stories out there of people who dropped their Kindles in the sink and had Amazon refuse to give them books they've already paid for, people who returned their Kindles for replacement because their battery was bad and so lost all their books, and even a guy who returned three items and had Amazon remotely turn his Kindle off forever and ever because they decided he was some sort of crook.

I assume some of these got resolved, but it doesn't make Amazon look good.

Amazon can shut off your acct, yes-not your Kindle. You can't order squat thru Amazon but the Kindle itself still works. Also, your book purchases are stored on your Amazon acct and you can download them to your computer, etc. So you don't lose anything you've purchased when it dies. And when you receive your replacement, your books are already on there in the archive. They deregister the old Kindle for you.

I've been through it three times now. Grrrr.

But I'm digressing again. I'm sorry, Gilloughly. There's no news?

 

[Claudia Gray]

I think publishers should mimic the DVD/BluRay model Disney uses. If you shell out the $$$ for the BluRay, you get a DVD and digital download in the deal. That way you don't have to shell out extra cash for the other formats. If you don't like the film, you can give the DVD to someone else (or the download code) who might enjoy it.

If you buy a hardcover, then you should get a code that allows you to download the ebook version when it's available. That way, even if they put off the ebook availability for 6 months or so, readers don't have to shell out the extra cash for the digital copy. They can give the hardback as a gift and keep the digital or just keep both.

I've yet to see someone stand in line to have an e-book signed by the author.

I totally agree with this proposal and can't think why publishers aren't trying it. Also, the keycode could allow you to DL whichever version you needed (Nook, Sony Reader, Kindle).

 

[JulieB]

All the Macmillan links I checked at Amazon are still down as of a few minutes ago.

 

[CEtchison]

I'm still stuck on the fact that Amazon arbitrarily shut down all sales of my Macmillan titles last Friday.

And that is exactly why I'll never go back to Amazon, no matter when the fair market value for an e-book is determined. Amazon is playing the corporate bully game, and I, as a consumer, can and will punish them for it.

I've also shared this news with all my friends and family who dislike this kind of corporate behavior. We have long memories and hold grudges. Keep in mind none of them own a Kindle. They don't download e-books either. But this "our way or the highway" mentality has made them very angry and they have vowed to never buy anything from Amazon again, be it a movie, a toy or a book.

 

[Anaquana]

I usually spend several hundred dollars a year at Amazon on books. Not any more. I'll take my money to Borders.

 

[Slushie]

The buy button for Macmillan books may not return until the new agreement takes effect on March 1st. Pure speculation, but it doesn't seem too far-fetched. Hope I'm wrong.

 

[Deb Kinnard]

Those times when I've dropped a book, it doesn't just hit the floor with a slap and pick up a scrape. It hits edge on and, by some fluke of gravity going neutral in that point of the space-time continuum, goes galloping across the floor, sometimes bouncing up and down like a gazelle in full rout from a peckish predator.

Add insult to injury, it suddenly stops in its flight, I accidentally kick it in my chase, and it skids like a hockey puck (across carpeting!??) until slamming into furniture (or the foot of the bookstore manager and I feel honor bound to buy the damned thing). The final result is still readable, but looks like it went a few rounds with a blender and lost.

If that happened to my shiny new 259.00 + S&H Nook...

Gil, we'll get you a neck strap. What color would you like?

 

[happywritermom]

A good friend of my sister's (and a virtual friend of mine) is caught up in all this. Steve Hamilton's The Lock Artist was just released and now Amazon has pulled it. I don't know how I feel about the whole business side of this mess, but I feel horrible for him. The authors are the ones who are suffering in this. For some, esepcially debut novelists, these sales can make or break their careers. Fortunately, he has plenty of novels to his name and solid fan base, but I'm sure that's not the case for all those Macmillan authors.

 

[Gillhoughly]

Gil, we'll get you a neck strap. What color would you like?

Better make it purple. The last time I used one it caught on a door knob and I danged-near strangled myself.

 

[Calla Lily]

I had a near-miss with a salad fork once that increased my body space by a full yard for decades.

Gill, you owe me a keyboard.

 

[LeslieB]

I think publishers should mimic the DVD/BluRay model Disney uses. If you shell out the $$$ for the BluRay, you get a DVD and digital download in the deal. That way you don't have to shell out extra cash for the other formats. If you don't like the film, you can give the DVD to someone else (or the download code) who might enjoy it.

That's why for the few ebooks I've bought over the last few years, I've gotten pdfs. I can use them on any computer, and if I ever get around to buying an ereader, capability to read pdfs will be a major factor in my choice.

 

[Deleted member 42]

I note that if you buy a Baen hardcover, inside it you will find a CD-ROM with all the Baen e-books, in multiple file formats.

One of the things we learned in 1992 with ebooks was that at least for early adapters, they tend to be book lovers and geeks.

They wanted the printed book and the ebook, and we worked with Douglas Adams to provide Last Chance to See both as a CD-ROM double set, and as the printed coffee table book.

I would guess that 40 to 50% of my ebooks I've also bought a printed book too, and for some, I have multiple copies of the printed book.

At the same time, I'm really interested in seeing a lot more quality control being built into ebooks. I think ebooks could be a lot better than they are in terms of readability and features.

 

[Deleted member 42]

Amazon can shut off your acct, yes-not your Kindle. You can't order squat thru Amazon but the Kindle itself still works. Also, your book purchases are stored on your Amazon acct and you can download them to your computer, etc.?

Actually, if Amazon chooses, they can bork your purchased Kindle books, (even the back up copies, as soon as you join the network again) and the Kindle itself, just as cell phone makers and registrants can bork your cell phone (and yes, that includes Apple who can bork cell phones) or software companies can bork applications or OSs.

I'd really like to see ebooks treated as "movables," not software. Right now ebooks are seen as software that you license. I hate that.

 

[Deleted member 42]

Macmillan isn't suggesting it's going to do that. It's suggesting that Amazon's artificial limiting of the top manufacturers' list price to $9.99 doesn't work for them, because they'd rather introduce a tiered pricing system similar to the hardcover/mass market paperback system, where people who want immediate access to a given title pay a premium for that, and that titles that have been on the market longer reflect that with lower prices.

Before Amazon entered the fray this is how it worked. Books had day and date release, or awfully close (sometime, accidentally, the ebook was released a few days early, sometimes a few after). If the release was a hardcover, the ebook price was very close to that hardcover cover, but more often than not there would be a discount.

When the paperback was released, the price of the ebook was adjusted to be at or under (usually a buck or so under) of the paperback cover price.

And when an author had a new book, the back list was often reduced, especially for series. I bought series that way sometimes, usually just before going on a west to east coast trip.

 

[MacAllister]

I'm really not an early adapter, so I've been sort of waiting to venture much more heavily into ebooks because the QA just isn't there, yet.

 

[Calla Lily]

It's both financial and tactile for me. Frankly, I can't afford an e-reader. And also I love holding a book in my hands. Love the feel, the smell, the sounds.

 

[Gillhoughly]

Amazon's post-purchase control over downloads reminds me of a former friend.

When he gave something to anyone, after they thanked him, he'd say, "Consider it a permanent loan."

Meaning he could take it back anytime he wanted.

I did mention he's a *former* friend.

 

[JulieB]

They wanted the printed book and the ebook, and we worked with Douglas Adams to provide Last Chance to See both as a CD-ROM double set, and as the printed coffee table book.

I still have that CD-ROM set. I can't let go of it, even though it probably wouldn't even run on my system.

And yes, I have the book as well.

And am looking forward to Stephen Fry's update of Last Chance to See.