Learn Writing with Uncle Jim, Volume 2

[James D. Macdonald]

I still owe y'all a big post on how art requires limits.

 

[smsarber]

Limits? But, but, uh... Well crap, that's not what it said in the brochure

 

[paritoshuttam]

Alternating POVs?

Uncle Jim,

In my WIP, my plan is to tell the story in alternating POVs (alternating across chapters). So Chapter 1 would be from the main male character's POV, Chapter 2 would be from the main female character's POV, Chapter 3 back to the male, and so on.

A problem I face is that later on, there might be two successive chapters better told through the same character's POV. Do you think that would be OK? Or would the reader be jarred, because he has been expecting the next chapter to switch the other POV? Or should I try to force-fit the plot to adhere to the alternating POVs?

Any advice is welcome. I am still at the rough outlining stage, so I wouldn't be devastated if I had to overhaul the whole structure.

Thanks,
Paritosh.

 

[RJK]

I wrote a novel with 3 alternating first person POVs. the protagonist, the heroin, and the antagonist. When I came upon the problem you described, I went in one of two ways.

Choice one would be to extend the chapter, making it considerably longer than the others. There's no rule on chapter length.

Choice two, would be to continue with the next chapter, if you can stay on the same subject from the chapter you left, but from the second POV, then get back to your original POV at a convenient point.

 

[Caitlin Black]

What RJK said. I was going to say, "You can make the chapters as long as you like, so why not just chuck in a scene break and carry on with that POV for a bit longer."

But RJK beat me to the punch.

 

[Krintar]

<parts of a story told from the perspective of> the heroin

This sounds like an interesting story.

 

[James D. Macdonald]

Your beta readers will tell you if you're doing it wrong.

 

[RJK]

This sounds like an interesting story.

Not according to a few dozen agents.

 

[euclid]

On the recommendation of a brother-in-law, who's a mad, fanatical American Civil War expert, I have ordered a copy of "The Killer Angels" by Michael Shaara. Do you know this book, Jim?

 

[Will Collins]

Hey James, is it ok that my 1st Novel ends in a MAJOR cliffhanger, I remember way back in volume one how the book must end in a satisfying way?

 

[allenparker]

Not Jim, but...

On the recommendation of a brother-in-law, who's a mad, fanatical American Civil War expert, I have ordered a copy of "The Killer Angels" by Michael Shaara. Do you know this book, Jim?

I know this book. It is a good read and is a good companion to watching Gettysburg on DVD.

 

[euclid]

Finished it a few minutes ago. It was an interesting read. The prose is truncated quite a bit, which gives the impression of pace, tension. Reading it is like being slightly out of breath all the time. The descriptions of the battle scenes came across as evenly paced, calm, a surprisingly effective technique.

This account places the blame for the defeat squarely on Robert E. Lee's (broad) shoulders. I expect there are accounts that blame others, like Longstreet, Ewell and Stuart.

 

[euclid]

Switched on the TV and found the movie, part 1 of 3. What a coincidence!

 

[allenparker]

Finished it a few minutes ago. It was an interesting read. The prose is truncated quite a bit, which gives the impression of pace, tension. Reading it is like being slightly out of breath all the time. The descriptions of the battle scenes came across as evenly paced, calm, a surprisingly effective technique.

This account places the blame for the defeat squarely on Robert E. Lee's (broad) shoulders. I expect there are accounts that blame others, like Longstreet, Ewell and Stuart.

Lee took the blame. I see it as a tactical error. Lee never should have taken the stand there. Had Lee left Early to hold and draw Mead to the battle, Lee could have circled around the battle and marched straight to Washington.

If Lee had better visuals for the cannon barrage for Pickett's Charge, they may have done better.

Longstreet historically has gotten the blame for defeat, but he actively campaigned for not fighting there. Stuart should have come back to Lee earlier, but he was engaged in a battle of his own. Ewell never had the authority to make any decisions that would have changed the outcome.

But there is plenty of good alternate history fodder in that battle.

 

[euclid]

Lee was the man in charge, overall. The buck stopped there, so in that sense he had to take the blame. Also, he would never have shifted the blame onto any of his generals.

Where was Stuart? The book never said.

 

[James D. Macdonald]

Stuart was out running around collecting supply wagons, rather than doing scouting and security.

Way back in LWWUJ Part 1, I recommended this book, and quoted a bit from it to illustrate a couple of techniques.

I allude to Gettysburg in Land of Mist and Snow. I'd originally planned to have a Gettysburg scene in Lincoln's Sword (going so far as to research the phase of the moon--the moon was full that night), but it didn't fit in the final work.

 

[RJK]

For you folks doing historical writing, I found this site for calendars. It also shows the dates of each phase of the moon.

 

[euclid]

Yes, Jim, I loved that scene between Longstreet and Pickett. And your instruction on it has opened my eyes. (as usual)

 

[Neversage]

Uncle Jim,

So I'm finally done with what expect is the last revision of my book; it has gone to betas for the last round of plot-hole snooping. For the sequel--which I've also been working on for some time--I was toying with ways for new or forgetful returning readers to catch up.

At first I went with short recaps scattered throughout the first two chapters, but that always felt cumbersome to me. Then I tried taking the wrap-up scene from the previous book and putting it in as a properly optional prologue, just in case the reader didn't already know what was going on.

What are your thoughts on this? I think the prologue method looks and works well, but I want to be sure there isn't a good reason not to do it.

Thank you in advance.

 

[James D. Macdonald]

The only good reason not to use the last scene from the previous book as a prologue is that many (most?) of your readers will skip it.

Why not write the sequel as if it were the only novel you'll ever write? Put in the backstory exactly as you put in the backstory in the first book. It's a sequel, not a two-part novel, right?

Readers need remarkably little backstory. Just tell this story, make it good, and they'll love you for it.

 

[Neversage]

I do want them to love me. I'll definitely have to see how that line of thinking treats me. Time for another angle.

 

[Xoggy]

Jim,

I hope this hasn't been answered before, if so, I apologize. My question is how do you stay organized when you are writing? Do you personally outline? Keep note cards?

I feel that organization is one of my key faults when writing. I attempted to outline and have found that my story went a different direction. New ideas keep coming to me while I right and at times I feel like I need to stop writing the story and sit down and really create the world, that way I have a foundation.

Should I continue to write the story or go back and really work on the setting and plot first? I just want to make sure I stay productive. I can be very detailed orientated and I don't want to use this as an excuse to not finish the first draft.

Any advise would be greatly appreciated.

 

[James D. Macdonald]

Hey James, is it ok that my 1st Novel ends in a MAJOR cliffhanger, I remember way back in volume one how the book must end in a satisfying way?

Yes, your book must end in a satisfying way.

Major cliffhangers ... I wouldn't. Intriguing directions for further developments, yes. Fine. But the end of the novel should (in my opinion) be like getting to camp after a long hike. Sure, there are other trails into the bush, but, for now, it's done.

Jim,

I hope this hasn't been answered before, if so, I apologize. My question is how do you stay organized when you are writing? Do you personally outline? Keep note cards?

I write very extensive outlines (about 3/4 the length of the finished novel). I also use file cards (character notes; eye color, etc., as they develop during the writing of the book). File cards keep scenes in order (and can be shuffled to re-arrange the scenes if necessary).

And generally I flow-chart too.

And, I realize that first drafts are still fluid documents. If something changes wildly, go with the new direction to see where it goes.

 

[Dolohov]

And, I realize that first drafts are still fluid documents. If something changes wildly, go with the new direction to see where it goes.

This is something that I have trouble with: once a draft is on paper/on the screen, I have a much harder time making big changes. Once the piece has found one form, it's harder for me to imagine it in any other form, and so once the first draft is done, I feel like all I do is tinker. Any suggestions for breaking that habit?

 

[Noah Body]

I write very extensive outlines (about 3/4 the length of the finished novel).

Three-quarters the length of the finished novel? So you have an 80,000 word outline for a 100,000 word book? And in real outline format, not a synopsis?

Damn, guy! That's like writing two books!