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Third Person Limited

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Gary the Llama

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I'm have a quick question about writing in third person limited. If I'm going to expose a quick sentence or two of back story, how should I do it?

Like this: John knew that Greg had suffered from depression last year.


(John is the main character, btw.)



Or can I just say: Greg suffered from depression last year.


In other words, in third person limited, how far can I travel outside of my character's head to tell the story or describe things? What about describing locations and their history? Etc., etc.


Thanks in advance guys. :)
 

Sage

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If it would be obvious to the reader that John would know something like that (they're really close, or John is Greg's therapist, or they were roommates, for example), I wouldn't worry about putting the "John knew." If there's reason for them to wonder about it (John only knows Greg though their wives), I'd add it in or go into more detail on how he knows.
 

CDarklock

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Personally, I'd suggest "Greg had suffered from depression last year." Because I'm anal like that. But no, "John knew" isn't necessary - so long as the reader understands (through whatever means) that the POV is limited.
 

dpaterso

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Whatever John knows or can figure out, is your limit.

I'm OK with either of your examples.

You can deliver this info so it's clearly from John's POV (thus inferring it's something he must know) by including John's opinion instead of just stating the fact, e.g.

Poor Greg, he'd suffered from depression last year.

-Derek
 

Phaeal

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The deeper you are inside John's head, the less you need "John knew," "John thought," "John imagined," "John felt," and similar tags. If the reader has not seen, heard, smelled, tasted or touched anything that John could not, if he's been privy to John's thoughts and feelings before, but no one else's, he'll accept that "Greg had suffered from depression" is coming from John's knowledge of the fact, rather than dropping into the story from some omniscient narrator.

As noted above, if it's odd that John should know about Greg's depression, you may need to explain it in a sentence or two.

Also, if you have more than one POV character, you might not want to start a new John section with "Greg had suffered from depression last year." This could be construed as coming from Greg's POV. In which case, you'd just need first to establish that John is indeed the POV:

The sun glare went through John's eyes like lances. He closed them, wincing. [Should be no question about the POV after this. ;p ]

Greg had suffered from depression a year ago...
 

maestrowork

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If it's obvious how John knows (through history, hearsay, conversation, personal experience, etc.) then just state the facts.

In general, filtering is unnecessary. If you really want to explain how John knows, show and don't tell. If you keep it at John's POV, there really is no reason to filter. WE known everything is reported through John. Saying "John knew" or "John saw" or "John heard" or "John felt" is redundant.
 

wrinkles

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Having been subjected to several late night phone calls, John knew Greg had suffered from depression the year before.
 

maestrowork

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Having been subjected to several late night phone calls, John knew Greg had suffered from depression the year before.

That's telling. ;)

Since it's in John's POV anyway, why not just:

John had been on several late-night phone calls with Greg. Apparently, Greg had suffered from depression the year before.


- again, no filtering
 

wrinkles

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Having been subjected to several late night phone calls, John knew Greg had suffered from depression the year before.

My bad, that's filtering. So if there is any doubt that John would have known the information about Greg, how about:

Word on the street was that Greg had suffered from depression the year before.

or

All his friends knew that Greg had suffered from depression the previous year.
 

Julie Worth

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Here's my shot at it:

Oh god, Greg was moping around again. This was like a year now, and John was sick of it. He wanted to yell at him: Take some Prozac already!
 

Jake Barnes

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John had gotten sick of the late night calls, brought on by Greg's so-called depression.
 

dawinsor

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Here's my shot at it:

Oh god, Greg was moping around again. This was like a year now, and John was sick of it. He wanted to yell at him: Take some Prozac already!

This is a great example of voice too.

Generally, if the POV is very limited, you filter as little as possible, ie use as few instances as you can of "John knew" or "John thought." Putting them in jerks the reader out to a wider distance, looking at John, rather than through him.
 

IceCreamEmpress

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"Greg's depression had been going on for months now, and John couldn't face the midnight phone calls anymore. Everyone got the blues sometime, but Greg needed to get help or get over it."
 

wrinkles

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John didn't know what all the fuss was about Greg and his depression; he didn't even like the guy.
 

Gary the Llama

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As John plunged the knife into Greg's chest for the seventh time, he realized this really was the solution to Greg's depression and late night phone calls.

How's that for showing instead of telling? ;)
 

Constantine K

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John realized that he was Greg, and that he'd been going to depression counseling every week for the last year now.
 
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