Alternate History

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The Exorcist

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If this has already appeared here, I appologize. I'm new here, and I checked 5 pages back.

A couple of years ago, I was told that Alternate History was a hot genre' with a hungry market. That was a happy coincidence, since it's a favorite of mine and I have a good working knowledge of history.

I chose the 1860s, because I thought that it would be less crowded than WW2 (oops!) and I had a great idea.
I was also tired of Harry Turtledove's work, and thought that something radicaly different would sell.

However, after submitting to several dozen good agents and getting nowhere, I am wondering... has the market crashed? Did I just waste three years?
 

escritora

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I don't know the answer to your question, but perhaps your query letter needs some help? Or perhaps we can critique a sample of your work on the Share Your Work forum and provide ideas on how to improve it. (when I say "we" I mean "they" I'm not the best at critiques)
 

The Exorcist

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Thank you very much, escritora!

Im so new I didn't even see that place yet!


Okay... does anyone here have any thoughts on the whole genre? My intetion was not to create a thread about my own problems.

For instance; why so little good stuff about WW2. Good, bad or indifferent, there just doesn't seem to be much out there.
 

pdr

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If you can...

get hold of some back issues of the HNS (Historical Novel Society) 'Review' which is their quarterly journal full of details and reviews about the latest books you will see there are quite a few alternate histories reviewed.

They do fall into a crack rather as many readers of historical novels regard alternate histories as fantasy and not historical. Fantasy readers find them too 'real'!

The main areas written about in alternates seem to be times where the author shows what s/he thinks would have happened if the Romans defeated Hannibal or Hitler won WW11, or Napoleon won at Waterloo.

And no, I'm not a fan, I like my history 'straight'!
 

Puma

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Hi The Exorcist - I also like my history straight but I know there are those who like alternate history.

But - you're making an assumption that the problem is in the market rather than asking whether there's a problem with your writing or with your story line. Start with these latter two ideas. As Escritora suggested, post a small snippet - the first 1000 or so words on Share Your Work, Historical and see what kinds of comments you get. But - be advised, the critiquers in Historical are pretty straight shooters and aren't going to tell you something's wonderful if it's not. Hope to see you up there. Puma
 

DeleyanLee

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FWIW, "Alternative History" is generally considered a subgenre of Science Fiction from what I've learned. The Fantasy equivalent is "Historical Fiction".

Which way a story falls depends on how you've altered the history. If aliens come down, or there's a new technology, etc, then it falls to the SF side. If it's something mythical, magical, etc, then it's Fantasy.

Not all agents rep both Fantasy & SF, so it's possible that you thought it was Fantasy when it was really SF, or vice versa. You might want to look at your list of agents again and make sure you were submitting to the right ones.

Just a thought.

Good luck to you.
 

Zelenka

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Hi The Exorcist! I've only read a few alternate histories, besides Turtledove (whom I've always regarded more as SF than historical to be honest), and they have always been classed in the other genre. Mary Gentle, for instance, is always shelved in SF / Fantasy so far as I've seen. I'm not sure what the situation would be if your story didn't involve magic or something like that as part of the 'alternative'. But since 'Jonathan Strange & Mr Norrell' is technically an alternate history, I do think there can be a market for them, if you can just find how to get in.

I'll agree with what's been said and say try putting your query letter up for critique, or perhaps a sample of the story itself, just to be sure there's not something stumping it there. One trick I picked up from the discussions here was to find a book that's similar to yours and compare it in the query, as in 'My book would appeal to readers of Harry Turtledove' or whatever.

I write a sort of alternate history, but mine I think leans more towards the fantasy side, more like urban fantasy but with a historical setting, or 'supernatural historicals'. I always describe it as fantasy and put it in that section of SYW rather than here in historicals, unless, I suppose, it was a purely historical section I wanted help with (but that hasn't cropped up yet). I hope it's not a dead part of the genre, whichever genre that actually is, as it's one of my favourite ways to write.
 

Doogs

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The main areas written about in alternates seem to be times where the author shows what s/he thinks would have happened if the Romans defeated Hannibal or Hitler won WW11, or Napoleon won at Waterloo.

Being a stickler, here, but the Romans did defeat Hannibal. It just took them sixteen years to do so...
 

Doogs

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Alternate history is a fascinating genre and, when done right, a fantastic read. I agree with pdr in that I like my history "straight", but I think there's a game theory aspect to alternate history that can shed some valuable light on what really happened and how tenuous the links were that led to the history we know.

Honestly, I've never understood why alt. history gets stuffed into fantasy so often. If it involves time travel/aliens/etc, alright, I can see putting in it sci-fi, but the "organic" alternate histories strike me as more straight fiction.

As a reader, my take on alternate history is the same as historical fiction - I want it accurate, and I want it plausible. Most alt. histories hinge on a single point of divergence, and if that point isn't plausible, the whole story usually falls apart.

A few of my favorites:

How Few Remain - Harry Turtledove: This series got sillier and sillier as it went along, but HFR, tracing the story of a war between the USA and CSA in the 1880s, was in my opinion both accurate and plausible. The point of divergence was organic (soldiers finding Lee's dropped cigar case containing orders), avoided Antietam, and set the stage for a British intervention.

Gettysburg - Newt Gingrich: Yes, it's Newt, but this is alt. history at its finest. The point of divergence is Lee listening to Longstreet and marching in a wide flanking maneuver, rather than throwing men at Little Round Top.

The Fox and the Rhine (can't remember the authors): The Valkyrie plot succeeds, Hitler is assassinated, and Himmler becomes fuhrer. Rommel heals from his injuries and is given command against the Allies after D-Day. There are some outlandish elements (a massed Me-262 strike against a bomber fleet), but for the most part the story is well handled.

Rivers of War - Eric Flint: Sam Houston avoids injury at the Battle of Horseshoe Bend, with significant ramifications on the War of 1812.

I've also read my share of stinkers, mostly involving implausible divergence points or outright hero worship. One, in fact, is one of the things that motivated me to write my novel (figuring if it could get published, then my story stood a chance):

Hannibal's Children - John Maddox Roberts
: The premise is promising - Hannibal defeats the Romans and banishes them across the Alps. A century or so later, they return, and all hell breaks loose. But the point of divergence is inaccurate and implausible. It involves Hannibal appearing outside Rome in the fall of 216 B.C., his army swollen to absurd size thanks to the support of Philip V of Macedon. The problems with this are many:

  • Hannibal and Philip didn't strike an alliance until 215, and Philip never sent a single soldier to Italy in support of Hannibal
  • Even if the diplomacy had occurred earlier, there is NO WAY Philip could have mobilized and dispatched an army of 200,000 to Italy within three months of the Battle of Cannae
  • Quintus Fabius Maximus was not dictator after Cannae. That would be Marcus Junius Pera
  • Ignoring the gross mishandling of Publius Cornelius Scipio's character, he was 19 at the time of Cannae. His rank as military tribune would have given him some authority on the battlefield, but none in the Senate (which he would not join for another three years). And yet Roberts has the tie-breaking vote on whether or not to accept Hannibal's terms falling to him.

I guess what I'm getting at is that alternate history, like historical fiction, can be done very well, or very poorly, and that just because it's alternate history doesn't mean one can avoid the historical reality at his or her leisure.
 

Zelenka

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Honestly, I've never understood why alt. history gets stuffed into fantasy so often. If it involves time travel/aliens/etc, alright, I can see putting in it sci-fi, but the "organic" alternate histories strike me as more straight fiction.

I think it might be because it involves an 'alternative' world, even if there is no magic or aliens or what have you. It would be nice to see it as a category within historical fiction, though, for the type of stories you mentioned where it is just teh 'what-if' premise, no aliens. (And thank you for mentioning 'Gettysburg' - I was talking with a friend about this post and this issue last night and neither of us could remember the name of the author or the book).

There was actually a nice little TV programme on here for the 400th Anniversary of the Gunpowder Plot, which speculated as to what would have happened if it had been successful. I've always though that'd make a good novel, even before it aired.
 

The Exorcist

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You may be right about the Query letter, here it is;


Top-secret information is smuggled to Britain toward the end of 1862, information so explosive that all of Europe’s Imperialist Nations decide to help the Confederacy crush the United States. The Union is not without friends, however, and soon chain-reaction of opportunism and aggression sweeps the whole world into a war that will change it forever.

This alternate history novel is titled World War One, 1863-66, how the American Civil War became the war to end all wars. The more research I did on this project, the more I wondered why it didn’t happen this way. In order to keep the book reasonably small, I only wrote about what seven key people (all fictional) see and do during the critical years. Chapter One describes and places each of them in the first week of 1863, and introduces the reader to the new situation. The only deviation from this formula is an English maid, who eavesdrops on the British Prime Minister at the very beginning and very end of the story.

This will be my first major book to be published. I have traveled to many of the places that I have written about, and while my conclusions might be very controversial, my characters are well-grounded. Having spent ten years in the military and seeing combat in Iraq, I write about war in and unforgiving, no-nonsense way.
Have fun with the reading!


Or is there a better place to post this?

At any rate, thank you all for your replys to this thread (and damn... am I glad I have tomorow off! So much to do...)
 
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Zelenka

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There's an actual query letter section in the SYW forum. I've not used it myself yet as I'm not at that stage with my WIP, but I do read the comments there regularly to improve my chances of writing a good one, and I would recommend it. There are a lot of people there who offer fantastic advice and go through it all with a fine tooth comb.

(very sorry I don't have time to read it right now, but I'm supposed to be working ;) )
 

IceCreamEmpress

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You need to query agents who represent science fiction/fantasy/speculative fiction, not agents who represent historical fiction. Start there and see if you get better results.
 
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