Question on small town schools/sports

Cathy C · Feb 5, 2008

I'm going to post this here instead of over in the Research room, because I know a lot of teens hang out over here. Okay, I'm starting my first YA paranormal. My agent LOVES the idea, because it's really different. I think I have a handle on my lead's personality, but I don't want to screw up and make him sound too "old."

My MC is Isaac Thomas, a 17-year old Junior, African-American, who's a high school running back. He's All-State and popular, but isn't full of himself. He struggles with school (primarily English Comp. and Math,) has a decent younger sister who winds up helping him out in the clutch during the plot, two parents who are upper middle class (thought about the mother as either a lawyer or doctor, which would make the push for him to go to college stronger than just going straight to the NFL.)

Now, all that said---is this realistic for a mid-sized town? Not being African-American myself, I want to give him a background that I can write easily, while not making it too urban jungle. But, I DO want to describe a typical party in the first chapter that winds up getting out of hand. It needs to turn into something of a gang brawl where the MC gets shot. He winds up dying and then comes back (hence the paranormal angle.)

I'm setting the opening on the last day of school, and his buddies talk him into going to a party at someone's house---one of those "friend of a friend" kind where they don't really know anyone.

Would appreciate hints about what the party should look like, slang currently used at mid-sized high schools and such. Some things NEVER change, so I probably won't have any problem with the sexual tension or drug aspects---because there's always that. Has anyone wound up at a party that went wrong? How did it start and what did people do?

Thanks! Naturally offering your real/board name on the acknowledgment page!

Dreamer3702 · Feb 5, 2008

I was ready to help you, but I've been out of HS for 6 years. I don't know if my advice or whatever would be any good.

gastave · Feb 5, 2008

I would say it depends where this takes place; I grew up in a small town in Ohio and we had very few "affluent" families and even fewer black ones. I went to high school in a fair to middling city in Florida, however, and it was the complete opposite. Football was definitely a big attraction in both places, although I think the high schoolers in Ohio liked to lean towards soccer as well.

Hope that helped!

GirlLit · Feb 5, 2008

I went to high school outside of Philly and football was HUGE—Friday night lights and all. It was a mid-to-large school; I graduated with 400+. IMO, if you're going to have a gun show up at a high school party, you should place the school closer to a major urban city or at least give a very good reason for it to be there. I don't think that's a typical everyday-America type of occurrence, at least I hope not. The most fighting I ever saw at a party was a fistfight. There were drunk driving issues, but no guns or weapons of any kind. But this was admittedly several years ago (I'm in my late 20s).

We did have a couple of deaths that resulted from parties but they were all alcohol related--drunk driving, "huffing" and driving, and an intoxicated student ending up disoriented on train tracks. It was really sad.

That said, I also don't think the NFL drafts athletes out of high school. The NBA does, but most pro football teams want their athletes to go through a good collegiate program. My former high school went to the state finals this year and the game was aired on TV--trust me, it looks nothing like a pro football game, the rules are even different. It would be more realistic if your MC were being scouted by Big 10 schools, maybe have gifts involved and his parents pushing him to go to an Ivy or something (there are players in the NFL from Harvard and Stanford).

Just my thoughts. Best of luck!

KVL · Feb 5, 2008

Cathy C said:
Would appreciate hints about what the party should look like, slang currently used at mid-sized high schools and such. Some things NEVER change, so I probably won't have any problem with the sexual tension or drug aspects---because there's always that. Has anyone wound up at a party that went wrong? How did it start and what did people do?

I'm not a teen, and it's been 6 years since I graduated HS (I grew up in America and moved to England a year and a half ago to clear up any confusion), so I'm not sure if I'm 100% current on slang, but I do have some commentary if it's any help to you.

You say Isaac's family is upper middle class. If he's hanging out with people who are likely to be involved in gang brawls, are his parents overly permissive or is he going behind their backs to stick with his friends? If his friends are gang members they're likely to suck him into that culture, so you could be getting the MC into an interesting situation where he has to juggle friends vs. family while maintaining two different attitudes (thuggish vs. normal/polite).

You can get kids identifying with gangs (mostly through cousins or other relatives who probably live in urban areas) even in small towns. I had a friend who claimed Rollin 60's because she had a relative in it even though she lived near SF and the 60's are a subset of the Crips in LA. At the same time another girl in the school claimed Bloods, but there was no real tension between them since it was mostly just for show/nomenclature since it was a small town. (There WAS tension later, but that was between adults - one death later it was resolved.)

Parties that go wrong... mostly it starts with booze and male posturing (no offense/stereotyping meant). You get the "yo, I heard Jay was talkin shit about your ride/mama/girl, what you gonna do about it, dog? I got your back, 'member that." Mix that in with a 40 of crap beer and you've got yourself something brewing. If Jay is packing heat (carrying a gun) then that's a definite recipe for disaster.

I don't think, however, that you'll be able to carry off a party going so horrendously wrong in the suburbs/small town. I agree with GirlLit on that point. Maybe you could have them hear about something going down in the nearby urban area and have them drive to get there/plan to spend the night.

Boyz in the Hood is a pretty good movie to watch if you want to get into the mood/work on background stuff. It's quite violent, but Tre has that kind of "middle class" aura about him that might be inspiring to you. Lastly, is this set on the east coast or the west coast? Customs/slang vary.

If I can help further, feel free to PM me! Good luck with the project, it sounds very exciting.

Dreamer3702 · Feb 5, 2008

I think you need to consider the possibility of the gun already being in the house. We used to throw party's at my friends house (she lived with her grandparents) and her grandfather had a gun collection in his study. He was a retired cop. We always kept the door blocked off... I swear her grandpa would knew if someone even thought about stepping foot into his "sanctuary". Anyway, I can think of 5 people I know that have guns in their houses. Don't rule it out.

Provrb1810meggy · Feb 5, 2008

Man, I wish I was not a nerd and actually went to parties so I could help you out.

But alas...

Cathy C · Feb 6, 2008

GirlLit said:
I went to high school outside of Philly and football was HUGE—Friday night lights and all. It was a mid-to-large school; I graduated with 400+. IMO, if you're going to have a gun show up at a high school party, you should place the school closer to a major urban city or at least give a very good reason for it to be there. I don't think that's a typical everyday-America type of occurrence, at least I hope not. The most fighting I ever saw at a party was a fistfight. There were drunk driving issues, but no guns or weapons of any kind. But this was admittedly several years ago (I'm in my late 20s).

Thanks. Yeah, my school was also 400+ graduating, but was in a smaller town that drew from a county-wide region. The fights were generally fistfights, which is why I was thinking it would be interesting to have some "imports" show up at the party---something that's never happened before. That could make it interesting how people would deal with it.

We did have a couple of deaths that resulted from parties but they were all alcohol related--drunk driving, "huffing" and driving, and an intoxicated student ending up disoriented on train tracks. It was really sad.

Yeah, I figured the party would be in full swing when they arrived, leading the MC to think that maybe it hadn't been such a good idea to come. But if there was a cute girl who started to hang on him, he might change his mind. Something like that...

That said, I also don't think the NFL drafts athletes out of high school. The NBA does, but most pro football teams want their athletes to go through a good collegiate program. My former high school went to the state finals this year and the game was aired on TV--trust me, it looks nothing like a pro football game, the rules are even different. It would be more realistic if your MC were being scouted by Big 10 schools, maybe have gifts involved and his parents pushing him to go to an Ivy or something (there are players in the NFL from Harvard and Stanford).

That would work really well! Thanks. It would also help with the subplot of him not doing well in a couple of courses and panicking that he might not GET an Ivy League nod, or even have a scout tell him he's got to get his grades up because they're under more scrutiny.

KVL said:
You say Isaac's family is upper middle class. If he's hanging out with people who are likely to be involved in gang brawls, are his parents overly permissive or is he going behind their backs to stick with his friends? If his friends are gang members they're likely to suck him into that culture, so you could be getting the MC into an interesting situation where he has to juggle friends vs. family while maintaining two different attitudes (thuggish vs. normal/polite).

It's actually both. They're permissive, because they've been ABLE to be, so it's not too difficult to sneak out for the party. He figures it'll be no big deal to go for a few minutes and then head home. But eventually his friends are going to be possessed by demons and then they WILL turn bad---criminal stuff, drugs, violence, etc. Saving them, bringing them back to the way he remembered them, is part of the plot.

You can get kids identifying with gangs (mostly through cousins or other relatives who probably live in urban areas) even in small towns. I had a friend who claimed Rollin 60's because she had a relative in it even though she lived near SF and the 60's are a subset of the Crips in LA. At the same time another girl in the school claimed Bloods, but there was no real tension between them since it was mostly just for show/nomenclature since it was a small town. (There WAS tension later, but that was between adults - one death later it was resolved.)

Don't know much about Rollin 60's. Will have to look that one up. Thanks!

Parties that go wrong... mostly it starts with booze and male posturing (no offense/stereotyping meant). You get the "yo, I heard Jay was talkin shit about your ride/mama/girl, what you gonna do about it, dog? I got your back, 'member that." Mix that in with a 40 of crap beer and you've got yourself something brewing. If Jay is packing heat (carrying a gun) then that's a definite recipe for disaster.

That's sort of the plan. But since it's a "friend of a friend" sort of party, I figured these guys would be invaders, possibly from a rival school in the city.

I don't think, however, that you'll be able to carry off a party going so horrendously wrong in the suburbs/small town. I agree with GirlLit on that point. Maybe you could have them hear about something going down in the nearby urban area and have them drive to get there/plan to spend the night.

I COULD have them drive for awhile, and have him wonder where in the heck they're going. Then they could be both fish out of water at the party, AND up to their necks in trouble.

Boyz in the Hood is a pretty good movie to watch if you want to get into the mood/work on background stuff. It's quite violent, but Tre has that kind of "middle class" aura about him that might be inspiring to you. Lastly, is this set on the east coast or the west coast? Customs/slang vary.

Midwestern, I was thinking, or even the south. Somewhere that gangs are just getting started, so it's startling. The "I've heard about this stuff, but have never seen it" so when the demons take over briefly, it throws everyone for a loop.

If I can help further, feel free to PM me! Good luck with the project, it sounds very exciting.

Thanks! I may do that!

Dreamer3702 said:
I think you need to consider the possibility of the gun already being in the house. We used to throw party's at my friends house (she lived with her grandparents) and her grandfather had a gun collection in his study. He was a retired cop. We always kept the door blocked off... I swear her grandpa would knew if someone even thought about stepping foot into his "sanctuary". Anyway, I can think of 5 people I know that have guns in their houses. Don't rule it out.

Possible. Definitely possible. But I think it would work better if it was imported. Something nobody planned and these guys just showed up out of the blue. Maybe already gunning for someone, or maybe even just a random thing, like a drive-by. Still, it's a thought.

Thanks all! Feel free to keep adding things. I'm off to rent a movie!

Caveman · Feb 26, 2008

First some background: I am 45 years old, so I haven't been a student for quite some time. Having said that, I work in a small school. My oldest son is a Junior at a major university, and 3 others attend the school where I work.
Might I suggest that his father be a teacher at the school, this keeps his grades up, as well as the head/assistant football coach. Instead of a party away from his normal stomping grounds, have them win the State Championship, and have a party in his town. Have some kids from a rival town, could come from anywhere in the state, show up upset that they lost the big game or something to that effect. Keeps you from having to figure out how to get him to some outside party. It could even happen immediately after the game, while he is in some other town.
Just some thoughts. Might even be too late. Feel free to PM me if I can clarify or help in any other way.

You know the old saying about there being 7 million stories in the naked city?
There are 20 million in a school.

Gina_Marie · Feb 26, 2008

Well I guess how "small town" do youw ant this? Below is a suggestion for a really small school.

I worked at a very small school. The middle and high school was together because there was only 200 kids. I dunno if you want this type of small town feel. Anyway, the kids would have field parties because they lived out in the country. Because they lived in the country they could get a whole bunch of cheimicals(from the farmers) and create their own drugs.

That aside, I can tell you recently there was a bust at one of the parties in my town. The kids were foolish enough to walk outside and off the porch with open bottles. They got snagged first.

ebenstone · Feb 27, 2008

Okay, I'm a HS English teacher and football coach who works at a mid-sized urban school, but I've spent time teaching in a small, rural district as well. The thing I've noticed about small town schools is everyone knows everyone in the town. It was one of the things I liked about teaching in the small school, there were no "cliques" or anything like that. It was kind of neat. But, gangs aren't just a "urban" problem...places like Little Rock, Arkansas and Davenport, Iowa have had gang problems as well. You could make the party in a neighboring district/ football rivals kind of thing. That's big in the "north country" here in NYS.

Gina_Marie · Feb 27, 2008

To piggyback off of what ebenstone said. yes everyone does know each other, also families have tended to live their for generations. The school I worked for looked upon me as an outsider. I wasnt welcomed in fact I was treated quite poorly and I really had to work to win people over.

ebenstone · Feb 27, 2008

Also, as to location, it depends on where you are setting the story. Texas life goes in this order: football, church, everything else. Similar in places like Ohio, Florida, Pennsylvania and Alabama. If you can somehow watch this, it's a great representation of HS football...a bit bigger than I think you mean, but still, it's a great representation:

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B000JBXP20/?tag=absolutewritedm-20

MandyP · Mar 4, 2008

one more thing... i coach in a mid-sized high school in Wisconsin.. (at least it is considered mid-sized around here) hunting is very big, so guns are a reality.. people have them, people have accidents. We have had shootings in our small town of 5000. Also, there is some minor gang activity, even here, with the nearest "big city" being over an hour away. Just to let you know that guns and violence are still a reality in small midwestern towns.

romancewriter · Mar 13, 2008

Not sure if this is even relevant, but I've always gone to small town schools and it's been my experience that the smaller school the tighter the cliques. In the smallest (under 3,000 town population) it usually boils to you're in or you're out. Not a lot of middle ground. Also in my corner of the world - central Illinois - the small towns are all prodominately white. Not to say they don't have semi-affluent African American families, but it would be more of the exception than the rule. Around here you would see more Arabic families (mostly doctors) doing well in the smaller towns.

lakotagirl · Mar 18, 2008

I haven't been in high school for many, many years - but in a small town you know everyone's business.

The kids today party just like we did. Many parties are in "grandpa's back 40". Grandpa may or may not be aware that a "few friends" are coming out.

We now live on a dead end road. The road ends at a large creek. This is a very popular spot for parties as the owner lives in Chicago and doesn't pay too much attention to what happens on his property. Of course all the kids know this.

Our community lost four teens last year to a horrific car crash on a curve in the road. They were heading back from a beer run.

There are many ways your MC can die. Car crash. Fall. Car as a weapon.

If you are in a city, a gun would be a good choice - but we don't get many rural kids who misuse guns. Rural kids respect guns.

My nine year old neighbor has gotten a deer the last two years.

Another neighbor has a 14 year old that has come down to kill a possum that I thought might be rabid - and my husband was gone on business.

Unless you want to make a statement about the dangers of guns, I'd kill him another way if it is a rural setting.

City kids use guns to get in trouble. Rural kids use guns the way guns were meant to be used.

Mythica · Mar 20, 2008

I think I might be able to help you a lot here, actually. If you have any specific questions, just ask me! I grew up in a town that matches your description, so I'd love to help!

I went through school in a town of less than 10,000 people in it and less than 800 students in my high school. We had three elementary schools, one middle school and one high school. There were about 250 people in my class but a little over half actually graduated. The town was definitely predominantly white lower class families. We had a couple Asian families, and two pairs of Asian brothers and sisters who were adopted by white parents, and we had two black families. I think our biggest minority was Latinos and I know for sure I was the only Sicilian/Italian.

In a small town like I grew up in, sex and drugs were pretty much all there was for extracurricular activities besides poorly funded school sports. We didn't even have freshman teams because they couldn't be funded and the average family in town couldn't afford to pay for everything. We had girls in the sixth grade get pregnant, 14-year-olds dealing coke and meth, and police bringing in drug dogs once a week.

I rarely socialized with people in my town, since all of my friends were people I rode horses with and only saw at the stable or at shows. I avoided people from my town like the plague and now I am very happy to say I'm one of the few girls who doesn't have 3 kids in a cramped apartment wasting away from drugs and alcohol.

As far as gangs go, we didn't have a huge issue with those. We were far enough away from the city that it wasn't a problem. I've noticed though that violent crimes have increased in my hometown since I graduated: beatings and attempted murder, rape accusations, and a girl was murdered that I graduated with. There is a lot of people I graduated with who are in prison for various violent crimes and drugs. My favorite teacher from high school is actually going to prison for extortion and a few other things.

We've definitely had our share of tragic deaths. When I was in the fifth grade, my best friend's older sister's boyfriend who was the star quarterback on the high school team died of a heart attack. When I was 8, I saw my friend get hit by a car and killed. My little brother's best friend was hit by a car and killed while jogging. One of my good friends since first grade died from leukemia a week before senior year after fighting it nearly her entire life. We had a couple kids die from street racing accidents. One boy died in a hunting accident (his dad shot him and killed him). So.... there are lots of ways to die in a small town. All are very shocking and traumatic and everyone is affected.

Sorry for writing a novel! I'm bored right now at my boyfriend's frat so I have nothing to do lol.

MichaelDeVere · Apr 7, 2008

There were 167 kids in my graduating class in rural SW Ohio, population 7000 +/-. There weren't any ethnic kids in my entire class. There were maybe 15 ethnic kids in the entire K-12 system.

Parties were big, but not so much with athletes. Most schools now have an athletic conduct policy, some so draconian that if you are even accused of attending a party where drugs or alcohol are allegedly present, you will be suspended for the season from play. Some of the football guys and wrestlers bucked the system and showed up at parties, but that was the exception. The huge parties were pretty well-behaved because nobody wanted to get busted by the cops. It was about 50/50 that they showed up.

There always was at least one fight, generally some grudge thing between some drunks, or you'd have the occasional miscreant who would not be capable of holding their alcohol and go off on some poor, unsuspecting kid. Strangers & kids from other schools were at most risk unless accompanied by friends.

Little Red Barn · Apr 7, 2008

A small town will have one good Greasy Spoon Diner, a fast food 'hop', mine was Dog N' Suds and at least one good pool hall, most def, a bowling alley and somewhere on the back roads should be a Walmart with kids gathered and where the parking lot is visited every few hours by the sheriff, moving kids off. Kids in small town settings will generally be moving between these points on weekend nights--lather, rinse, repeat.

Now if the town happens to be a river town

this makes for some very good partying, as it is hard for the deputy sheriff to keep up with the kids if they are partying down at the river. Given its topography and all.

Things really don't change too much in a small towns. Drugs, booze and slang just gets new names but lifestyle stays and history repeats. And if you're real lucky a second new Walmart might pop up, thus more cruisn' opportunities.

SmartAsh · Apr 9, 2008

Most of my teenage years were spent in a small town -- in many ways, there are more chances for trouble because there's little to do. No movie theater, no bowling alley, no Wal-Mart. We did have a few fast food places. Sports were a big deal. Partying was a bigger deal.

Most of the parties were field parties. Find a stretch of land; set up shop. My town also had a man-made lake, so a lot of the rivers were drained or redirected toward the lake, leaving many empty river beds. Those were great for partying because they were large, flat pieces of land, with really high walls in many places (so, bon-fires and things couldn't be seen from any roads, etc).

Ghost stories are also spookier in small towns... no street noise, just the sounds of coyotes and things...

As an adult, I prefer the city... but I do miss good times at the lake, and being able to see the stars

Question on small town schools/sports

Cathy C

Ooo! Shiny new cover!

Dreamer3702

a real life cupcake

gastave

GirlLit

KVL

Dreamer3702

a real life cupcake

Provrb1810meggy

Cathy C

Ooo! Shiny new cover!

Caveman

Gina_Marie

ebenstone

Gina_Marie

ebenstone

MandyP

romancewriter

lakotagirl

Forgot what I was gonna say

Mythica

Expert Gerbil Wrangler

MichaelDeVere

Little Red Barn

haz own threads

SmartAsh