Said Fred, or Fred Said?

It works either way.

You are obsessing again!

skelly said:

Am I obsessing again?

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Yes.

I think it can work either way, but depends on where the tag is in relation to the dialog.

When the tag follows:
When the tag precedes:
But with pronouns, it always has to be "He said". "Said he" is so far over the top it gives me a nosebleed.

Yes. It can go both ways. I like said to follow, but I think I do the sprinkle thing. You you you...obsesser, you.

According to Self-Editing for Fiction Writers, it should be "Name said." The book explains that "said Name" sounds grammar school-y and that "the phrase 'said he' went out sometime around the Taft administration."

News to me, but that's what the book says. Or says the book.

WendyNYC said:

According to Self-Editing for Fiction Writers, it should be "Name said." The book explains that "said Name" sounds grammar school-y and that "the phrase 'said he' went out sometime around the Taft administration."

News to me, but that's what the book says. Or says the book.

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yes...but first you learn the rules and then you throw them away. besides...every book will tell you something different.

WendyNYC said:

According to Self-Editing for Fiction Writers, it should be "Name said." The book explains that "said Name" sounds grammar school-y and that "the phrase 'said he' went out sometime around the Taft administration."

News to me, but that's what the book says. Or says the book.

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This is what came to mind when I saw this thread. "Taft Administration!" I thought (or, um, thought I). Is it bad when you've got parts of Self-Editing memorized?

I don't mind reading the "said Name," construction, but it hurts me to write it.

I usually prefer Fred said, but sometimes the rhythm just works better the other way around.

Judg said:

I usually prefer Fred said, but sometimes the rhythm just works better the other way around.

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I agree. I let the rhythm of the piece determine placement.
Linnea

Right.

Never use said Fred.
Never write in present tense.
Never use first person.
Never write a book less than a 100,000 words.
Never stick jam up your nose.
Never blink on a Sunday.
Never ask for directions in Wales.
Never tell your cat your middle name.
Never wee on your own head.

And never pay too much attention to the rules.

seun said:

Never use said Fred.
Never write in present tense.
Never use first person.
Never write a book less than a 100,000 words.
Never stick jam up your nose.
Never blink on a Sunday.
Never ask for directions in Wales.
Never tell your cat your middle name.
Never wee on your own head.

And never pay too much attention to the rules.

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But I like jam in my nose.

nessam said:

But I like jam in my nose.

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Freak.

Right Said Fred.

Drop Dead Fred.

Er, said.

I'm too sexy for this thread.

Shadow_Ferret said:

Right Said Fred.

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Beat you by almost 8 hours...

willietheshakes said:

Beat you by almost 8 hours...

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I wasn't sure if your Right was simply agreeing with the post before.

Ah, but such is the beauty, grace and careful craft of my writing that the single word was both a tongue in cheek homage to the glories of early 90's pop excrement AND an acknowledgement of the preceding post...

Noun verb when no clause follows: "Fred said."

Verb noun if you have another clause or other information that follows.

"said Fred, who held the dripping knife close to him."

jst5150 said:

Noun verb when no clause follows: "Fred said."

Verb noun if you have another clause or other information that follows.

"said Fred, who held the dripping knife close to him."

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Good point. But Fred is beginning to frighten me.

clause smause. write it the way it naturally flows. "Intuition," said Kevin.

skelly said:

I'm reading at lunch today, Harry Potter 4, for those who wonder, and I noticed something. Rowling tags dialogue with said so-and-so, not so-and-so said.

Am I doing it backwards? Does it work either way? Do you prefer one over the other? Am I obsessing again?

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Personally, I hate the "said Fred" version. It looks and feels amaturish to me. I read something by Robin Cook, I think, and that's all he ever did. It drove me nuts. Also, i've noticed writers who use "Said Fred" instead of "Fred said" tend to have sloppy prose or use way to many serial adverbs. That's just what i've personally noticed, but yeah.

-Feathers

The "said" portion of any sentence gets ignored by most readers. It's like they're not even there. It's just a tag to denote who the speaker is. There's probably some archaic rule about it (see the clause stuff above), but fundamentally the only thing that governs my personal usage is rhythm and beat of the sentence itself. That and if I've been doing one or the other too much then I eventually change it.

I try to avoid using either. I start off one exchange with one of the "Saids" and then I drop tags and let the conversation take over.