Is Joe Swanson offensive?

First of all Joe is not an ex-cop. He is actually one of the top cops on the force, at least from the few times you see him interact with his peers.

But it is a tricky thing. I'll use feminism as an example. I am huge into female equality, but I am sick to death of every movie having to have a kick ass female in it. To me that is just as offensive as having a girl who has to be rescued, because it isn't treating women as people, but as a necessary element to put into a film. These kick ass females can't lose, they have no weaknesses, they are so still not being percieved as individuals. They are still seen as "the woman".

Same thing I would imagine for the disabled question. You don't want to make every disabled character noble and perfect because you are afraid of offending someone. To me that is just as offensive. At the same time you don't want to make a character disabled just because you think it would be funny. Let's just say, it ain't easy. I think that's why Joe works so well. Family Guy is making fun of the people who try to make disabled people perfect, and at the same time it also just makes fun of him like they make fun of everyone on the show:

(I can't remember verbatim but: )

Brian: Officer Smith does a great impression of you.
Joe: Let's see it.
Officer: Oh well, it's just I do this, "I'm Joe, I am in a wheelchair but have a really strong upper body"
Joe: (laughs) Yeah I do say that!

In the Batman comic books, Batgirl became a paraplegic...she changed her pseudonym to Oracle and still fights crime and still beats the crap out of people.

Ummm, I am not physically disabled, but I do have a step son that is mentally disabled. If you exchanged being paraplegic for being Autistic, I think that it would have to be carefully done, but could be both touching, serious, and even humorous. My stepson HATES getting in trouble and becomes very upset and over dramatic when he is in trouble. It is very frustrating, and some days I feel like I may go crazy. On other days he runs away from me screaming, "I'm running for my life!! Help!!" and although I am upset, it is really pretty funny. Especially cause he runs in semi-slow motion (don't ask). So just because there is a disability doesn't mean that there can't be humor too. You would just have to be careful not to be too humorous or too serious, as a previous poster mentioned.

WittyandorIronic said:

Ummm, I am not physically disabled, but I do have a step son that is mentally disabled. If you exchanged being paraplegic for being Autistic, I think that it would have to be carefully done, but could be both touching, serious, and even humorous. My stepson HATES getting in trouble and becomes very upset and over dramatic when he is in trouble. It is very frustrating, and some days I feel like I may go crazy. On other days he runs away from me screaming, "I'm running for my life!! Help!!" and although I am upset, it is really pretty funny. Especially cause he runs in semi-slow motion (don't ask). So just because there is a disability doesn't mean that there can't be humor too. You would just have to be careful not to be too humorous or too serious, as a previous poster mentioned.

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Adding to this, have you read The Curious Incident of the Dog in the Night Time? I think it's a great example of taking something serious (autism) and looking at it in a way that is wry, touching, and funny all at the same time. Throughout the book, the MC's thinking is so unlike how any "normal" person would approach a problem that it makes you look at the world differently. It's funny because it IS bizarre, but it's also touching because the book enables you to understand WHY he's thinking like this, so you sympathize with him.

Oh, and for a great example of using a disability for purposes of humor... watch House.

In the end, though, no matter what you are probably going to offend someone, and you will probably have to live with that. I think it's the nature of writing humor.

I think also if you are making fun of everyone, and not just "the guy in the wheelchair" that alone can be enough to make it not offensive.

Family Guy itself is offensive, ergo any character on it is offensive.

thanks for the suggestion Jo, I will have to check out that book. My whole family swear that Austin, my step son, is possibly the funniest kid they have ever met. He likes jokes, and he likes funny things, but he parrots them all incessantly. So he will say it 10,000 times and it runs from funny the first time, not so funny the 200th time, funny that he is STILL doing it the 500th time, back to not funny, and back and forth until the 10,000th time you are still cracking up at his perseverance. He is also very bizarre in his word choices. I was making him help pick up outside (in Arizona) and he was whining that it was hot. But instead of saying "it's hot", he says, "I am on fire. Why are you making me be on fire? I don't like fire! I feel red. Am I burning up?" lol.

WittyandorIronic said:

I was making him help pick up outside (in Arizona) and he was whining that it was hot. But instead of saying "it's hot", he says, "I am on fire. Why are you making me be on fire? I don't like fire! I feel red. Am I burning up?" lol.

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Oh crap, does this mean my husband is autistic?

But yeah, the book is quite good. It was written by a guy who worked with autistic students I think. I've loaned it to a couple of people, and some people really like it and other people just don't get it. I think you would probably get it.

Also a huge fan of The Curious Incident of the Dog in the Night-Time.

See also: the Johnny Knoxville film The Ringer, which I thought was surprisingly well-done. The handicapped characters were real; they were not actors portraying the mentally handicapped. This made a huge difference. And also, they poked fun at themselves. Some hilarious, quick-witted scenes completely played out in that film by folks who are usually labeled as "slow."

I'd also recommend the documentary Murderball, which has quite a few scenes where the characters make fun of themselves. (Their discussion of sex is hilarious.)

You know...I didn't want to see the Ringer, because if it had been done poorly I would have been seriously pissed. But, I might have to see it now.
and can I just tell you that the title of that book is EXACTLY how my step son talks sometimes. lol.

Other books that you could look into to see how disability is dealt with humorously are any of the Terry Pratchett books with Cohen the Barbarian and his band of "thugs". There's one character - I can't remember the name right off hand - who is very old, mostly deaf and in a wheelchair. He's a barbarian, and sticks with Cohen out of sheer stubborn-ness; he's too old to be doing what he's doing, but by Georgie, he's still a barbarian and he's gonna hack and slash until the very, very end. Since you write fantasy, and the Pratchett books are fantasy-satire, they may help you in forming up your character who just happens to be disabled.

Hope that helped!

Toothpaste said:

But it is a tricky thing. I'll use feminism as an example. I am huge into female equality, but I am sick to death of every movie having to have a kick ass female in it. To me that is just as offensive as having a girl who has to be rescued, because it isn't treating women as people, but as a necessary element to put into a film. These kick ass females can't lose, they have no weaknesses, they are so still not being percieved as individuals. They are still seen as "the woman".

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So glad I'm not the only one that this bothers. I mean, can you say boring?

Will Lavender said:

See also: the Johnny Knoxville film The Ringer, which I thought was surprisingly well-done. The handicapped characters were real; they were not actors portraying the mentally handicapped. This made a huge difference. And also, they poked fun at themselves. Some hilarious, quick-witted scenes completely played out in that film by folks who are usually labeled as "slow."

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I felt guilty laughing at that. And although many of the actors are indeed handicapped, mentally or physically, the main character is not and I found the overall story offensive how he was trying to compete in the Special Olympics. (I forget now what his motivation was.)

My husband and I loved The Ringer (not the actual plotline, but the S.O. actors in it.) Our oldest son is special needs, and participates in Special Olympics. I've never laughed so hard. They got it spot-on.

Here's the thing, why shouldn't you write about a character in a wheelchair ? My son's 15 yrs old. I'd love for him to see/read about other literary disabled characters. Yes. Even negative depictions. It's their absence that bothers me more.

Will Lavender said:

Also a huge fan of The Curious Incident of the Dog in the Night-Time.

See also: the Johnny Knoxville film The Ringer, which I thought was surprisingly well-done. The handicapped characters were real; they were not actors portraying the mentally handicapped. This made a huge difference. And also, they poked fun at themselves. Some hilarious, quick-witted scenes completely played out in that film by folks who are usually labeled as "slow."

I'd also recommend the documentary Murderball, which has quite a few scenes where the characters make fun of themselves. (Their discussion of sex is hilarious.)

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First, ditto on Curious Incident. That book is awesome. I also enjoyed The Ringer, and I know many of the quads from Murderball. Great bunch of guys. The coach from the movie (the good one) is actually one of my track coaches at the moment. As for the sex discussion, the dude that talks about using the towel (Will), boy, he's a nut in RL too. I hung out with him a lot back at the '96 Paralympics and you don't want to know the kind of literature I had to roll over to smack him awake with a towel in the mornings. That guy is alarm clock deaf. LOL

Anyway, I'm a paraplegic and I admit I'm a sucker for gimp humor. Most of us are. Joe Swanson is awesome. That being said, I agree that if you're making fun of a disability, make sure other people are being made fun of as well. For me, that's why Joe Swanson is such a great char. No character in that show is spared. If it was just a show where 90% of the humor was at the expense of the paraplegic, that'd be completely different. Another way you could get away with this, is if you had the disability you were making fun of, but then again 1) you don't and 2) it's a novel, so it's not like people would know you had the disability unless you plaster a pic of yourself popping a wheelie on the front cover.

Just my thoughts. BTW, put your Para Pally in Lightbringer and have him carry around the Hand of Ragnaros.

I wasn't a fan of the curious incident. I thought I would be. I wanted to be. I read it twice to make sure. I wasn't.

Anyway...I say go for it. I don't think about sensibilities while writing. The way I look at it is a guy in a wheelchair would think...."Finally, somebody isn't pussyfooting around. We're people too. We can laugh at ourselves just like everybody else can."

Do it. Don't consider feelings while you're writing.

KTC, just curious, what was the turnoff for you? I'm still not sure why so many of us love this book and then it just goes flat for others. People I thought would really like it didn't.

JoNightshade said:

KTC, just curious, what was the turnoff for you? I'm still not sure why so many of us love this book and then it just goes flat for others. People I thought would really like it didn't.

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I wish I knew. I have a copy of every quirky book known to man. I thought this one would be front and centre on that shelf. I think what it is...it seemed to trite, like he wanted us to see this handicapped boy...but the language was like a writer trying to create that appearance...it didn't fall down for me to the level where I bought it. I don't think it was authentic. It was like I could see the writer's attempt to manipulate the reader into believing it instead of just falling into believing it. It was disappointing.

Don't forget the world's first physically handicapped super hero, Handi-man, from In Living Color with Jamie Fox, Jim Carrey et al. That was outrageous, and outrageously funny.

Little Britain is a comedy show in which two actors play most of the main parts. They make fun of everything. The premise is that they are documentary following the lives of various folks in Britain with a few spotlights on British culture. One segment follows a supposed mentally handicapped paraplegic...I say supposedly because he tends to get out of his chair a lot and beat the crap out people or run from the cops after he's done something. He has a devoted friend who performs all kinds of things for the guy. But the person doesn't respect the friend or what he does at all.

It's funny but it's only a small part of the show...which goes after everyone even the Prime Minister.

It's about as offensive as Family guy.