robotlike dialogue

what do we call dialogue that sounds too computer-ish/impersonal?

like - "Hello Senator Smith. What a surprise to see you here. How are you?"
"I am grande. Thank you for asking. Please call me Greg. You see, the President has decided to hold a special banquet in two nights in your honor We would prefer that you be there. Here is your official invitation."

Stilted.

Lori, you're gooooooood.

:clap

dialogue

Bad. Some writers have a tin ear for dialogue. Simple as that. A tin ear means the dialogue is bad.

Re: dialogue

I'm told a tone deaf person can learn to sing.

If that is true then a writer with a tin ear can learn to write passable dialog.

Lots of books out there on dialog, study hard.

deaf

I'm told a tone deaf person can learn to sing, too, but I've heard them and it doesn't sound all that much like singing to me.

And while it may be possible for a writer with a tin ear for dialogue to learn how to write great dialogue, I'd say it's also possible to hit the lottery two weeks in a row.

Re: deaf

James, I am very disappointed in you.

learning dialogue

Perhaps if you think that dialogue is your weak point you could try:
1. avoiding direct dialogue and let the reader have the inside-the-character's head dialogue written as thoughts.
2. Listening to good plays and classic films that are noted for their clever/funny/brilliant dialogue. What you hear sounds like real speech but it was written as dialogue.
3. Develop an ear for speech rhythms. Listen to children arguing, playing singing games and fooling about. Volunteer at your local playgroup or kindergarten. Little children have very strong speech patterns and you may be able to understand how they structure sentences as they use simple language and do not often use language to hide their real feelings or to misdirect.
You might never become a brilliant dialogue writer but you could become good enough for your readers.

Re: learning dialogue

This may or may not be apropos, but most people use contractions when speaking. The stilted dialogue used as an example in the first post has none. It can be used to indicate very proper, stuffy characters but it ain't gonna work if Hazel the waitress is joshing with her customers.

Re: learning dialogue

I see a lot of advice there that may not be needed. joseph23 didn't say he writes dialogue like that. He only asked what you call it.

Re: learning dialogue

i think in that example you could get away without describing the conversation, especially if there's nothing worth noting about the exchange. the only time i consciously put in hello conversations is when it's between main characters. if you're just saying hi to the pilot and all he's got to say is you should have good weather, no need to detail that, is there?

not that you do, but some people have lots of trouble writing good dialogue, which, for those people (myself included), that's where writing becomes more of a craft than relying on talent. there's absolutely no reason to lose heart, it just means someone has to learn how to do it as opposed to having that innate skill (assuming it's a framework issue and not the actual content). honestly, though, i doubt there's more than a handful of modern dialogue masters out there: one competent author's dialogue structure is hardly different than another's (again, this isn't about the content of the dialogue), i'd say.

i don't know if this is right or wrong, but the way i reason it is if you wouldn't want to see it acted out in a movie you probably don't want to read it in a book. as a rough outline for me, that's seemed to work. at least no one has ever complained my dialogue was bad. maybe they were being nice, like when a new girlfriend says size doesn't matter.

Re: learning dialogue

But reph! We're writers! God made tangents specifically for us so we could veer off on them.

Re: learning dialogue

God made tangents specifically for us so we could veer off on them

gotta use that one on my wife....

Re: learning dialogue

Allow me to present you with my patented cure-all for perfectly inorganic dialogue: steal it. Get a Flash Pass and ride around on a metro bus for a month or two, with a tape recorder in your purse/wallet, note pad on your lap, and take intricate notes. Try to ride in the morning, around 7 in the a.m., and at 3 in the p.m., when all of the inner-city kids are going to and from school: it's like listening to the nasty side of Allen Ginsberg. Or talk to the bus drivers themselves. Let me tell you, bus drivers are wellsprings of gab and palaver. Cabbies, too. Eavesdrop, be a fly on every wall, a bug under every table. Become the ultimate spook. Penetrate all inner social circles, turn every clique inside out. Get yourself an adhesive pair of ears, transmogrify into a banter lode stone. Life's a monologue, companero. Too many of us are so dulled by the cataract of syllables we miss the gold for the avalanche of dross. Take a page from Professor Seagull's fictitious "Oral History": natural conversation is the ultimate tutor for the tin-eared writer. Luck:hat

Re: learning dialogue

That's why I like writing at coffee shops. I'd hear a lot of conversations.

Re: learning dialogue

One thing I've learned about writing dialogue is to speak very little, and listen a lot.
Now if only my other parts of writing were as strong as my dialogue.

Re: learning dialogue

In general, observation is an asset and blessed skill for writers.

Wheels

I think you can make a musical comparison. Bad dialog is like a droning cadence of a tire wheel, thu-dump, thu-dump, thu-dump.

It's hypnotic repetitiveness puts the mind to sleep.

He went to the store. He bought diapers. He remembered that his wife also wanted toothpaste.

The droning rhythm that the mind hears:
"He went to the store (STOP) He bought diapers (Stop) He remembered that his wife also wanted toothpaste (Stop)

You hear: thu-dump, thu-dump, thu-dump.

A good sentence is like a waterfall or a flowing stream, smooth with a hint of randomness. And it isn't always the content, but often the construction that makes all the difference.

He went to the store to buy diapers, when he remembered that is wife also wanted toothpaste. "Why can't I seem to remember anything?" He wondered aloud. "Sure, I know what will happen now; I'll walk in the door, and there will be ten things that I've forgotten, and she'll ask, 'Why didn't you just look at the list I gave you?' Then what do I tell her, that I forgot the list?"

Re: Wheels

One of the best advices I've learned about dialogue is this:

People rarely speak in long, complete sentences.


Listen to how others speak, and see if that's true. Of course, it depends on the characters and periods and genres -- obviously if it's a college professor in 1921, he might speak very properly. Fantasy characters usually talk differently than modern day real-life people. Also, some literary works have characters who talk very poetically... But if you find yourself writing this dialogue for a housewife in Ohio in 1998:

"Do you not think I am a good wife to you and a good daugher-in-law to your family, to which I seldom complain? You have to understand, delivering boxes of cookies to grandchildren and office supplies to businesses is not me. What about my dream? My dream to concentrate on me for the first time in my life so I can achieve the only thing I ever really wanted."



It's not going to work...

Also, seeing movies helps. In movies, since the actors would actually say the words, in character, you get to see what sounds bad and what sounds like a real conversation. Then read the script and see how the dialogue is written. Then read your own dialogue out loud and see if they sound like what you would hear in a movie of your book...


p.s. I find the book Writing Dialogue by Tom Chiarella very enlightening.