This sort of thing seems to crop up quite a lot, but there's a new article on the BBC News website I thought might interest you.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/magazine/6250184.stm
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/magazine/6250184.stm
Noo way of speling?
- Thread starter JimmyB27
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If we use phonetic spelling, what happens with regional variations of accent?
Having said that, we've only standardised English fairly recently.
But if people find it hard to read or spell, should we pander to them by saying, "Spelling doesn't matter?"
I mean should we do away with standards some people find difficult? Or make them work harder? Seems a bit namby-pamby to me. I fail to see how this could aid literacy which is already at a shocking standard in the UK.
Having said that, we've only standardised English fairly recently.
But if people find it hard to read or spell, should we pander to them by saying, "Spelling doesn't matter?"
I mean should we do away with standards some people find difficult? Or make them work harder? Seems a bit namby-pamby to me. I fail to see how this could aid literacy which is already at a shocking standard in the UK.
I don't get this. I know a few people who think that nonsense like this is part of the "evolution" of language, but I don't buy it.
Does anyone really have that much trouble learning the language properly that the best we can do is dumb it down?
Might as well save some time and start printing Newspeak dictionaries.
Does anyone really have that much trouble learning the language properly that the best we can do is dumb it down?
Might as well save some time and start printing Newspeak dictionaries.
I see this pop up every so often. Apparently there is a society that holds to phonetic spelling being the next great movement in language. Like others have already pointed out, I don't think it will work. If anything, it will become more confusing than helpful.
All in my opinion, of course.
This is a horrible idea. I fail to see how intelligent people, well-meaning or not, could possibly think this is worth pursuing.
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purfikt eggsampel ov how a reejionel aksent cud kompleetlee confuze peepull.
(Perfect example of how a regional accent could completely confuse people. )
I had no idea what "fogit" meant, at first.
I'm completely appalled that I could read the first sentence pretty quickly. Almost as quickly as the second.
Got me thinking - how do you punctuate a language that's purely phonetic?
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I really hope this doesn't happen. It reminds me of the "Low Speech" in the Dark Tower series, or the fucked up world at the end of A Sound of Thunder.
Does this simplified spelling thing have anything connection to phonics? I've heard about phonics off and on for decades, and it appears to have been around for a much longer time:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phonics
You weren't taught to read using phonics in gradeschool? I was. I didn't know this had been taken out of the schools.
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I was taught to use phonics in Grade School as well. The thing is, the phonics only went so far with similar sounds being attributed to multiple spellings. 'Wait', for example, was easy for me as a child to understand, whereas 'Weight' came as a shock to me. The same thing can be said for the word 'Gross', which I thought rhymed with 'Loss'. I didn't start pronouncing that word properly until I got in trouble with the teacher for mispronouncing it too much. A threat of being sent to the principal's office was more an incentive to me to pronounce it right than anything else.
The thing is, that was Grade School in the 1970's. I can't say what schools teach now, as I don't go to Grade School anymore. Phonics was a good system, but it had its limitations. This, I think, is partially due to the different spellings with similar or exactly the same, pronunciations.
No phonics for me. We learned phonograms, and they also taught us about such things as homonyms so "weight/wait" and so on wouldn't be too much of a problem.
Phonics and homonyms aren't mutually exclusive - at least, I can't imagine that they would be. I learned homonyms with spelling and grammar. Reading was a different subject.
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I don't really remember learning how to spell...I know we had to have learned (learnt?) it some time, I just don't remember. I do know that I was really good at spelling, but I had terrible pronunciation. I had a speech impediment when I was younger, so I don't think I ever associated the actually spelling of a word with the way I, or anyone else, pronounced it.
Even when I read now I see a word as a picture, in a way. Good for learning Eastern languages, not so great for the Western ones...
Even when I read now I see a word as a picture, in a way. Good for learning Eastern languages, not so great for the Western ones...
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I'd like to see someone push for genuinely phonetic spelling. Including distinction between the nasalised vowel in 'man' and the oral vowel in 'mat', and the three different L sounds in English, and all the other such allophonic differences which we don't even consciously notice.
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I had the impression it had yet to be ADDED to the schools where I went (Atlanta, circa early 1960's) - as I said, I've "heard of" phonics for decades... I remember we used the "Dick-and-Jane reader," and that the very first word of it was "help." I happened to know that word because I remebered the older girl two doors down had once spelled a few words for me and one was "h e l p spells help." I think I impressed the teacher by knowing it in the very first day of reading class...
In so moche that in my dayes happened that certayn marchauntes were in a shippe in tamyse, for to haue sayled ouer the see into zelande and for lack of wynde, thei taryed atte forlond, and wente to lande for to refreshe them; And one of theym named sheffelde, a mercer, cam in-to an hows and exed for mete; and specyally he axyd after eggys; And the goode wyf answerde, that she coude speke no frenshe. And the marchaunt was angry, for he also coude speke no frenshe, but wolde haue hadde egges and she vnderstode hym not And thenne at laste a nother sayd that he wolde haue eyren then the good wyf sayd that she vnderstod hym wel Loo, what sholde a man in thyse dayes now wryte, egges or eyren certaynly it is harde to playse euery man by cause of dyuersite & chaunge of langage.
John of Trevisa as printed by William Caxton, 1482
John of Trevisa as printed by William Caxton, 1482
Genuine phonetic spelling exists, & has existed for a loooooong time.
Problem is, to do it right you'd need to have access to more than the standard 26 English letters, & the same lazyasses who plump for "simplicity" cannot be bothered to learn the other characters. How many know how to type a schwa...?
(Back in the 1980s I wanted to learn APL but my college's computer system couldn't handle the extra operators, so that idea died a-borning.)
The best example I've seen to date is the lyric sheet for Shriekback's Oil & Gold. Anyone who's serious about phonetic spelling should try to read a few lines aloud before spinning the CD.
Problem is, to do it right you'd need to have access to more than the standard 26 English letters, & the same lazyasses who plump for "simplicity" cannot be bothered to learn the other characters. How many know how to type a schwa...?
(Back in the 1980s I wanted to learn APL but my college's computer system couldn't handle the extra operators, so that idea died a-borning.)
The best example I've seen to date is the lyric sheet for Shriekback's Oil & Gold. Anyone who's serious about phonetic spelling should try to read a few lines aloud before spinning the CD.
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