# of Characters & Naming Characters

# of Characters & Naming Characters

Hi all!

I'm basically a lurker here. Gleaning all the information I can from the more experienced folks that post here. Over the last several days, you guys have said several things that really makes me wonder just have successful my (first) novel can be.

Without going into laborious details, I have approximately 32 characters in my book. They're broken down into about 7 family groups (with the rest thrown in as just single characters). The broad sweeping premise is a love triangle with a pair of killers thrown in for good measure :b .

So from what I've read on the boards, I seem to have two problems...first: too many characters. And second, you can't have 32 characters without a few having names that start with the same letter.

How 'ironclad' are these rules?? I mean, "Strangers" by Dean Koontz was chocked full of characters (not sure there was quite 32 in there), and his novel worked--'course, I will admit he has just a little more experience than I do .

And the name thing--after reading about not naming your characters with the same first letter, I realized I had a Matt, Mitch, and Michael. But those names really fit the characters, at least in my mind. So is that REALLY a big deal???

I'm totally a newbie at this, so advice is always welcome.

Thanks in advance!
Marley

Re: # of Characters & Naming Characters

How many main characters? How many major characters? How many minor/insignificant characters?

If they are insignificant characters, you can lump them together (e.g. instead of saying "Tom and Jerry" you can say "two of the Jackson boys"). Also, if the names do not confuse the main/major characters, they're okay.

Re: # of Characters & Naming Characters

Hello, fellow formerlurker. i can relate to your dilemma.

For some reason, my first reaction to your post is to think of director Robert Altman's two movies "Ready To Wear" and "Short Cuts."

Both movies are ensemble pieces with more actors than the usual fare. And both jumped around across several plot arcs in order to give every character screen time.

However, while "Short Cuts" struck me as inspired and interesting, "Ready to Wear" was garbage. Why? The latter had too many characters on screen, for no other reason than to be on screen... and their stories were distracting to each other, as well as to the movie overall. The end result evoked chaos.

Applying this to your novel... i would say that you can have as many characters as you want. The things to watch for: whether the characters serve a purpose in their "onscreen time", or if they are merely filler; and, whether their parts add to or distract from the story as a whole.

Think of it this way: each person is their own little self-contained story inside your novel. The rule of thumb is, only show the parts of each person's story that are relevant and important to the novel as a whole. That way, none of the individual stories distract from the main show.

However, you have to look ahead also; the more people, the more stories to blend together. Past a certain point, you end up with so many relevant and important bits to weave together, that you either expand the novel to horrendous lengths to give everyone reasonable time, or you keep the novel the same length while paring each bit to the merest nub...

... and unfortunately, the first method risks bloating the novel, while the second risks trivialising the stories. And finding a happy medium is a heap of trouble.

Thus the usual solution is fewer people and fewer bits in the first place. (And in this context, "Ready To Wear" was the worst of all evils: a story bloated with a mass of trivial bits.)

Hope this is helpful.

Re: # of Characters & Naming Characters

What's wrong with characters names starting with the first letter? I don't see anything wrong with that.

Re: # of Characters & Naming Characters

I think Marley meant "starting with the SAME first letter" -- Jack and Joe went to dinner with Jill and Jenny....

Re: # of Characters & Naming Characters

Yeah, I know that, I'm asking what's wrong with it.

Re: # of Characters & Naming Characters

However, you have to look ahead also; the more people, the more stories to blend together. Past a certain point, you end up with so many relevant and important bits to weave together, that you either expand the novel to horrendous lengths to give everyone reasonable time, or you keep the novel the same length while paring each bit to the merest nub...

Click to expand...

This is actually happening. Originally I had thought "add a few plot twists to make it more interesting", but the dang thing has swelled to enormous proportions now, and completing it seems near impossible--while paring it down seems like I'll be losing important elements that are screaming to be told.

*sigh*

Of the 32 characters, they consist basically of:

Nine leading characters

Twelve supporting characters (give or take one or two)

And the rest have minor roles, but their portions contribute heavily to the story lines. With only one or two exceptions, these characters can't be combined simply because their motivations come from their individual family history.

And yes, I did mean 'names that all start with the same first letter". While I can understand the concept of not confusing the reader by naming my characters Tim, Jim, and Slim...do we, as writers, really perceive our readers to be so dim that they can't possibly keep characters named Michael, Mitch, and Matt separate in their minds simply because their names all start with the same first letter??

Re: # of Characters & Naming Characters

There is more to it than the same first letter. Matt and Mike would be bad. Matthew and Michael would be bad. Both are confused easily. Matthew and Mike would not be so easily confused, they would be better.

Of Michael, Mitch, and Matt I would change either Mitch or Matt. Mitchell is way too much like Michael, so I would probably go with Mickey, Mitch, and Matthew. Mitchum would be good as well.

Slim, Jim, and Tim would be worse, in my opinion than Mike, Matt, and Mitch.

Try to keep your characters as separate as possible. With 32 characters you can't avoid doubling up on first letters.


There are ways to handle large numbers of characters.

One is to keep them in groups. They sort of become a group individual in the readers mind, even though the reader knows they are a group of individuals.

Watch its a Mad Mad Mad Mad (OK, I forgot how many mad's) World. Mostly the groups are separate. When they come together they collide as groups.

Another is to have a dominant character in each group. Keep the focus on that one character and it makes it easier for the reader to think of the group as extensions of that character.

So if you have seven families you can deal with the story almost as if you have seven individuals.

After a while not confusing the reader becomes its own art form.

As far as how successful your first novel will be.

With a few notable exceptions no one sells their first novel. Without exception the first novel you sell will be billed as your "first novel."

For most of us the first novel is a learning experience. For many of us the first ten novels are learning experiences. Some of the greatest writers in the world wrote several novels while learning the craft.

So do the best you possibly can, hope for the best, and don't stress on it too much.

Re: # of Characters & Naming Characters

@Marley Sinclair:

This is actually happening. Originally I had thought "add a few plot twists to make it more interesting", but the dang thing has swelled to enormous proportions now, and completing it seems near impossible--while paring it down seems like I'll be losing important elements that are screaming to be told.

i relate strongly. My advice, is to ask yourself: "Am i writing a novel where the fact of having 32 characters is a focal point?"

If so, then keep them all, and pare down some of their 'bits', and expand your novel to suit what you're after--a generational, inter- and intra- familial epic, perhaps.

If not, then axe at least half of them, and here is one way to do it...

Imagine yourself standing in a field, on a warm spring day, with the whole mass of 32 people in front of you.

Sort out your main protagonists and have them stand next to you.

Imagine the remainder of the crowd approaching one at a time, and tell that person: "You're out of the story unless you can explain why you need to be here."

Listen to their spiel, then confer with your protagonists: "Do you guys agree or disagree?"

After the dust settles, take all the axed characters and hold them to one side. You might be able to use them in a sequel or a spinoff or a new novel entirely.

This exercise will not only help you define who needs to leave, but it will make you more aware of each character in general, so you are more certain of why you need the ones who remain.

* * *

Beyond that... the aforementioned idea of grouping around a dominant character seems like a worthy angle to attack, i think it is good advice unless it doesn't fit your current format.

Re: # of Characters & Naming Characters

I'm having much the same problem. My WIP is now so convoluted that I can't even write a decent synopsis that doesn't spill over onto a second page.

As tough as it is, I've got to face this problem head on and streamline the plot. I'm already starting to see ways that this can be done.

Part of the problem (and somebody tell me if this is common to first-time novelists) is that my original inspirations were based on people and events in my real life, and then a layer of fiction and fantasy was super-imposed.

As the fiction develops, I find myself reluctant to let go of the real events and characters, but the truth is, it's this outer framework of reality that is distorting the hell out of the story.

===================

As for character names... it's not just the first letter, but the total of similar letters between two names that makes things confusing. "Matthew" and "Mitchell" are so similar in pattern. They start with "M" they both have an "e" and a "t" and both have a double letter.

[*I read somewhere that the brain processes the first and last letter of a written word and mostly assumes what's in the middle without actually scanning it!]

I don't think it matters whether they are minor characters or main characters, or a mix of the two. If Matthew was Jane's ex boyfriend, and Mitchell is her brother, there's bound to be confusion when Jane is conversing with one or the other.

Tricks I use to differentiate character names are these:

1) DOUGLAS & DANNY - refer to some characters by their shortened, more affectionate monikers, and some by their proper names as appropriate.

2) SQUIRREL - refer to some chars by nickname only

3) FALSTAFF - some folks are always referred to by their last name.

4) ZEKE - give a colorful name to a colorful character.


RULE OF THUMB: Think of a character's name as a pictorial symbol on the printed page. Like a cartoon sketch of a face, it should be distinct from all other faces, and contain visual cues that are easily processed and recognized.

Re: # of Characters & Naming Characters

If you are going to use characters whose names start with the same letter, try to vary them by length, gender or ethnicity. Lou and Ludmilla are not likely to be confused with each other.

Re: # of Characters & Naming Characters

Too many characters can indeed overload a book.

Your primary question should be: Why does this character exist?

And the exact quantity isn't a factor -- a long historical novel (whether realistic or fantasy) will contain many characters. Just look at War and Peace.

But is the character really needed? That's the primary point.

In my screenplays, I've created a character then "killed off" the character during a revision, eliminating the character altogether and letting the other existing characters perform the exposition.

Re: # of Characters & Naming Characters

Two of the challenges of adapting your novel to a screenplay are:

Figuring out what you can get away with NOT doing and still retain the original flavor.

Figuring out what characters you can get away with NOT using and still have the story recognizable.

Re: # of Characters & Naming Characters

If you have 32 characters and you are writing in the English language, it is impossible for you to not have some characters whose names begin with the same letter.

I would not sweat the naming just now. If those character names work for you, keep them. You can worry about changing them when your editor/agent tells you to do so.

Re: # of Characters & Naming Characters

If you're going to have that many characters, then what you should do is to try to introduce them gradually, so that the reader can get used to the characters that are there and get a handle on them, before you go and introduce more. Well, that would make it easier for me to keep track of, though that's generally just how my memory works. If you lump them all into the introduction or beginning, though, then it will make it hard to keep track of, and the reader will pick and choose which characters to focus on, and then will forget about other characters; and then when the book comes back to those forgotten characters and refers to wha they did in the past, then the reader may have trouble even remembering and thus there will be some confusion. At least that's how it is for me.

Re: # of Characters & Naming Characters

You might consider giving some of those characters their own novels.

Re: # of Characters & Naming Characters

Varying the lengths or letters (or genders) of the names would be a great help. It's very confusing if you have Jack and James. But if they are Jack and Julianne, then it would be fine, I suppose.

names

If you lump them all into the introduction or beginning, though, then it will make it hard to keep track of, and the reader will pick and choose which characters to focus on, and then will forget about other characters; and then when the book comes back to those forgotten characters and refers to wha they did in the past, then the reader may have trouble even remembering and thus there will be some confusion.

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Very good point, zero. This is how it is for me as well.

Re: names

I think another important quality is how distinct you make each one. If you introduce them very early on with similar names, their personalities need to be very unique.

While I read, I want to be able to say, "Oh this is Tim. He's always the funny. Jim's just so serious."

Not a great example, but you can get the point. If there is hardly anything to separate them from each other, then I have flip back pages to distinguish who is who.

Re: names

I had another thought:

do we, as writers, really perceive our readers to be so dim that they can't possibly keep characters named Michael, Mitch, and Matt separate in their minds simply because their names all start with the same first letter??

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It's doesn't have anything to do with the intelligence of the reader. Sometimes the brain works in such a way that, you see a letter and you automatically associate it with the character's name, without actually "reading" the word. Our brains don't work that we read the entire word.

So, with instances with similar names, it just may be that the reader gets mixed up. If your main characters all have names starting with the same letter, it may get confusing. Even worse, if your minor characters start with the same first letter. They won't appear often enough to form their own identities, and their names will be much more easily confused - "I thought Matt was married to Jenny? Or was it Mitch? No, he's married to Janine and Michael is married to Jenny..."

Re: # of Characters & Naming Characters

do we, as writers, really perceive our readers to be so dim that they can't possibly keep characters named Michael, Mitch, and Matt separate in their minds simply because their names all start with the same first letter??

Click to expand...

I don;t know about other readers being dim where this is concerned, but I am. Such names do connfuse me, make it harder for me to remember which character is which, and the personality of each character. It confuses the heck out of me at times.

There are an awful lot of names to choose from, so why have a bunch of names that all start with the same letter? As I said, other readers may not be dim enough to let it bother them, but this one is. It doesn't take many names starting with teh same letter to make me say, "To heck with this."

I have several thousand books in my TBR pile. This makes it real easy to put one down and pick another one up.

Re: # of Characters & Naming Characters

I think another important quality is how distinct you make each one. If you introduce them very early on with similar names, their personalities need to be very unique.

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Yeah, but in this situation, making characters have unique (at least somewhat) personalities would make for less confuion regardless of whether or not their names start with the same letter. Case in point: The Lord of the Rings characters Merry and Pippin, who were so similar that I ended up not even being able to keep track of which one of those characters did what. It had nothing to do with the naming of these characters; it was just that they were so similar that they might as well have been the same character. Or maybe it's just me.

As for naming schemes, I rarely think about what names I give them and usually just give them the first name that comes to mind. Though I don't do the whole "Mike and Matt" thing, as that just has always felt weird to me for some reason.

Re: # of Characters & Naming Characters

Even unique personalities with the same-letter name can be confusing. In one of my stories, I have a Jason and a Joel. Not very similar name, and they're very different characters, but they still confuse my readers.

Re: # of Characters & Naming Characters

Maybe my brain works differently than everyone else. I never had problems of confusing Merry and Pippin. In my mind I distinguished them very clearly and very early by the characteristics they showed. Perhaps I just process it differently than others.

Of course I have always known I am different.

:rollin