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JoNightshade
06-01-2007, 03:02 AM
Okay, I have a character who is perpetually packing a semi-automatic handgun in a shoulder holster, so that the gun is under his arm.

This is going to sound like a stupid question, but does this only work if he's wearing some kind of jacket? Like, if he's only wearing a t-shirt, the holster would go on top and then the gun would be visible. But could he wear a sweater over that? Or would it still be obvious?

Also, what are the basics of cleaning a handgun? Does one oil it?

alleycat
06-01-2007, 03:07 AM
He would either need a jacket, or have it be visible. It wouldn't work to have it under a sweater (and it would look stupid if it did). There are several other options rather than a shoulder holster; there's an ankle holster, a holster that goes inside the pants, etc. And with some of the smaller semi-autos, you can actually carry them in a pants pocket and not be particularly noticeable.

When someone cleans a gun, they usually use a very light amount of machine or gun oil on the metal surfaces and inside the barrel. On a general cleaning, the main thing is to clean and protect the inside of the barrel and any exposed surfaces. On a more detailed cleaning, the gun is taken apart and a more thorough cleaning and oiling is done.

greg 1
06-01-2007, 04:31 AM
A shoulder holster goes over the shirt and under the suit jacket. A tailor will make allowences for the extra bludge. Kind of like the old tounge and cheek humor 'dress right or dress left sir?' for a different part of the anatomy. But why use an automatic? A revolver might be better in certain situations. Just pull the trigger. Just a thought.

On the issue of cleaning a weapon. One word. Solvent, Solvent, Solvent. Think of it this way. When a person fires a gun, residue is left in the chamber and barrel. kind of like carbon buildup in a car engine. Solvent will break down the residue, leaving a clean weapon. Oil is used sparingly in unsure smooth operation of the weapon. It's also a hell of a dust magnet. Use too much oil and you'll be cleaning it again shortly. Hope this helps.

theengel
06-01-2007, 04:43 AM
My dad always cleaned his gun with wd-40. He claimed it was a solvent and oil. I use regular hobbs stuff.

alleycat
06-01-2007, 04:57 AM
My dad always cleaned his gun with wd-40. He claimed it was a solvent and oil. I use regular hobbs stuff.
The gunsmiths all tell me to avoid WD-40 like the plague. I know people who do use it.

Another point about cleaning a semi-auto. The clips needs cleaning as much as the rest of the gun if you've run a lot of rounds through the gun.

rugcat
06-01-2007, 05:34 AM
There are several other options rather than a shoulder holster; there's an ankle holster, a holster that goes inside the pants, etc.

A good option if you want to have your MC wearing a tee shirt, is the type of holster that clips onto the belt and is then worn behind the hip, inside the pants. If you wear a loose tee not tucked in, it's pretty much undetectable.

Also agreed--oil sparingly, if at all.

JoNightshade
06-01-2007, 08:07 AM
A good option if you want to have your MC wearing a tee shirt, is the type of holster that clips onto the belt and is then worn behind the hip, inside the pants. If you wear a loose tee not tucked in, it's pretty much undetectable.

Also agreed--oil sparingly, if at all.

Behind the hip and inside the pants? What would you call that? Also, is it easily accessible? It sounds like you'd have to take off your pants to get at it! I'm looking for something my character can put his gun in and still dress casually. The gun needs to be concealed, but he has to have easy access to it. Now I'm thinking the one on the lower leg is a good idea... he always wears pants.

And thanks to everyone for answering, you addressed all of my concerns and then some. Particularly about over-oiling... I had my character doing it twice! Oops.

sharra
06-01-2007, 12:53 PM
keep in mind that an ankle holster changes the way you walk. and it really isn't comfortable until you get used to it. it also kind of rules out shorts and flip-flops for casual wear. holsters chafe, no matter where you have them.
I've seen small calibers tucked in at the small of the back; fairly inconspicuous as far as guns go, but unless you're used to it, can be slow on the draw.
One other thing; even if you don't see a gun - if you know the smell of gun-oil, you know when someone's carrying.

rugcat
06-01-2007, 07:54 PM
Behind the hip and inside the pants? What would you call that? Also, is it easily accessible? It sounds like you'd have to take off your pants to get at it!This type of holster is often little more than a leather "sleeve" that clips on the belt but rests inside, not outside, the pants. It's not very secure in terms of safety, but is extremely accessible, more so than an ankle holster. Why don't you stop by a gun store and see exactly what I'm talking about, or even visit websites, although it can be hard to visualize how they work if you're not familiar with guns.

Kate Thornton
06-01-2007, 08:40 PM
The Bianchi folks were really helpful when I went to be fitted for a shoulder holster - I had to carry low as the bumps got in the way. I ended up with a waistband holster similar to what Rugcat described but more to the front. Very workable once you got used to it. A suitjacket cut full worked well, but then so did a casual windbreaker or overblouse, as long as it wasn't too long and obstructed access to the weapon.

Different workarounds for women...!

Tiger
06-05-2007, 06:53 AM
The complaint I hear about shoulder holsters is the fact that you're basically sweeping everything to your left when you draw--provided you're right-handed.

The inside the waistband holsters are very good these days. They are customized to fit individual makes/models and are quite secure.

Vanatru
06-05-2007, 07:21 AM
Okay, I have a character who is perpetually packing a semi-automatic handgun in a shoulder holster, so that the gun is under his arm.

This is going to sound like a stupid question, but does this only work if he's wearing some kind of jacket?

No, it works fine with other dress apparel as well. :)



Like, if he's only wearing a t-shirt, the holster would go on top and then the gun would be visible. But could he wear a sweater over that? Or would it still be obvious?

Depends on what your wearing and packing. You could be giving off a profile for the smallest ACP if you had it in a speedo, or nothing at all even if your packing a desert eagle under a parka. It'll vary.

Just try to make your cover appropiate to the locale. Up north, the yankies are used to wearing heavy clothes so it'll be easier to pack. Down south, it may be odd if your wearing a windbreaker.......but if your wearing a sports jersey like some of the hoodrats do, it'll be harder to spot a weapon signature.

Whatever you wear, practice, practice, practice with it in that style of garb.

Sometimes you won't give a rats tail if your profiling. Sometimes it'll be to your advantage to let them know your packing for action. Macho or not, that's life. They might be less inclined to jack you.



Also, what are the basics of cleaning a handgun? Does one oil it?

Unless your planning on writing for the NRA, the average writer won't care.


Sweaters are fine, up north. Again, whether your profiling the signature or shape of the weapon will depend on what type it is and how you carry it.

A smaller or medium frame weapon will have a lower overall shape/profile than a large frame will. A kidney holster or small of back will also be easier to hide if you wear loose baggy clothes. Coats are fine as long as they appropriate for the locale.

They make these new tshirts that have built in holsters that you can wear under a loose over-shirt. Designed for the drug-units down in Dade County/Florida. Those might work for you. They have 'em in small/medium and large frame. They all have sewn in magazine holders. The guy who makes does a special order job for the drug-guys that one sewn in holster under each arm with 4 or more magazines along the lower back. Nice, but they don't work under body armor. Go figure. Reasonably priced at 30-60 bucks U.S..

Kentuk
06-05-2007, 08:12 AM
Is concealment the issue? In the army I found a shoulder holster had advantages over hanging it on my web gear. If you have to sleep wearing a gun then under the arm is the way to go.

JoNightshade
06-05-2007, 10:21 PM
Wow, okay, Vanatru's level of detail is kinda scaring me. :)

Mainly this is how I need to use it: My character is no longer in a profession where he needs to use his gun. However he still feels the need to carry it on his person, both in public and in his house and his dad's house. So for in public, he would prefer it not to be visible at all; however this is San Francisco so it would probably, in general, be appropriate for him to wear some sort of jacket. He's upper-class so he dresses very nicely. At home, his family is aware of his habits, so concealment is not the issue-- but he still wouldn't carry it right in the open where everyone could see. He has a habit, when he feels nervous or upset, of going into his room and cleaning his weapon. Hence the questions about the oiling.

Quick access is probably not an issue at all. He doesn't *expect* to use the weapon, but he wants to have it on him in case the need arises.

Tiger
06-05-2007, 11:17 PM
Okay.

I'd say that inside the waistband is the way to go--if the guy is an habitual type. No matter what the weather, he'll be reasonably comfortable carrying this way. All he'll need is a shirt or something that hangs down past his waist.

A smallish auto with a single stack magazine would have a nice, flat profile that wouldn't be so visible--say, a Sig Sauer P239--would also be more comfortable to wear.

Another thing with IWB carry is that the weapon will get sweaty and will require (the outside of it anyway) to be cleaned off, daily. Sounds like a good excuse for your character to get into his cleaning habit.

For cleaning, I think different people have different habits, but he'll need a basic kit:
1. Solvents
2. Lubricants
3. Bore brush
4. Patches
5. A small nylon brush. Looks like a small toothbrush
6. Some kind of gun scrubbing spray that removes solvents and the like

1. Make sure the weapon is unloaded with the magazine out.

2. Field strip: remove the slide, barrel/recoil spring.

3.Run a patch soaked in solvent through the barrel--always from the breach end--and let it soak for a bit.

4. Use the bore brush to remove any carbon or lead fouling from the barrel. This can take time

5. Spray it with the gun scrubber

6. Run a dry patch through to remove residue.

7. Clean outside of barrel and coat with a light coating of oil

8. Run another patch through it with a light coating of oil to protect it

9. Use the small brush and solvents to clean out the receiver and the slide

10. Remove solvents with the gun scrubbing spray

11. Put light coating of oil on all

12. Use gun grease (sparingly) to lubricate the slide rails and other moving parts... Q tips work great for this.

I'm sure others have different takes on this, but I think these are the basics. Yes, this activity can be very relaxing.

Vanatru
06-06-2007, 05:43 AM
Wow, okay, Vanatru's level of detail is kinda scaring me. :)

Sorry. :) In a previous tour I was an MP, then I went into civilian law enforcement and that's what I'd still be doing if it weren't for my obligation overseas. Most of the gals and guys in my reserve unit are cops as well. So we get all the good info. :)

I"m only scary when I drink and start sharing war stories. As long as your buying, we're good. ;)



Mainly this is how I need to use it: My character is no longer in a profession where he needs to use his gun. However he still feels the need to carry it on his person, both in public and in his house and his dad's house. So for in public, he would prefer it not to be visible at all; however this is San Francisco so it would probably, in general, be appropriate for him to wear some sort of jacket. He's upper-class so he dresses very nicely. At home, his family is aware of his habits, so concealment is not the issue-- but he still wouldn't carry it right in the open where everyone could see. He has a habit, when he feels nervous or upset, of going into his room and cleaning his weapon. Hence the questions about the oiling.

LOVE that city. I was stationed at the Presidio for a year. I had a light London Fog windbreaker then. If I were back there, I'd carry a nice REI (they're in Cali now aren't they?) windbreaker for concealment then.



Quick access is probably not an issue at all. He doesn't *expect* to use the weapon, but he wants to have it on him in case the need arises.

That's pretty much the way it is for most people. Better to have and not need, then need and not have. Kinda like my dating life........of course, it was need and not have. *sigh* Life is never easy.

Tsu Dho Nimh
06-06-2007, 07:35 PM
The behind the hip, inside the pants, holster is just a modification of the "sticking the gun in the waistband of your pants" method.

http://www.smartcarry.com/
http://www.concealedcarryholsters.net/

Kate Thornton
06-06-2007, 07:50 PM
LOVE that city. I was stationed at the Presidio for a year. I had a light London Fog windbreaker then. If I were back there, I'd carry a nice REI (they're in Cali now aren't they?) windbreaker for concealment then.


I loved the Presidio - it was the nicest post I have ever been to (not that the others were much to write home about, except Ft. Shafter in Honolulu.) The officers club was a slice out of time. I was saddened when it closed, and when the Presidio became a public park - but better that it be a park than be gone entirely. And there's always Ft. Mason for cocktails...

Yes, REI is here in CA and still makes that windbreaker. A tallish woman can look good in it, but we of avereage and below height have to avoid "fireplug syndrome" in clothing.

Tsu Dho Nimh
06-06-2007, 07:57 PM
How about "Concealed Carry Jeans"

They look pretty good.

Tiger
06-06-2007, 10:24 PM
[quote=Tsu Dho Nimh;1386030]The behind the hip, inside the pants, holster is just a modification of the "sticking the gun in the waistband of your pants" method.

Yes, much in the way that a shoulder holster would be a modification of "sticking the gun your inside jacket pocket."

With an IWB holster, the weapon wouldn't fly out of your pants (oy, someone could have a field day with that one) or slide down your leg when running.

Rabe
06-21-2007, 07:14 AM
This is going to sound like a stupid question, but does this only work if he's wearing some kind of jacket? Like, if he's only wearing a t-shirt, the holster would go on top and then the gun would be visible. But could he wear a sweater over that? Or would it still be obvious?


When I was larger, and carrying a larger framed gun, I was able to wear it under a dress shirt without any problems. I used the tie, clipped to the button placket, to hide the unbuttoned buttons for easy access.

I wore it this way quite often without anyone ever being the wiser until I was walking out of a bridal couple party and a couple gang members were following us through a casino. After the gang members decided that myself and another guy were onto them and they left, we all went tothe parking garage where a gust of wind blew aside my tie revealing the unbuttoned buttons.

My friend came up and joked about me being unbuttoned for 'quick gun action' and I replied it was. She was amazed to find out I was 'packing' as were the other twenty guests of the party. That was the *only* time I was found out.

Rabe...

freethinker
06-21-2007, 12:45 PM
Another thing you should consider is that if he wears a trench, there are coats made where the holster is built into the coat itself; this can make it easily accessible and still hide the gun outline due to the thickness of the trench material. If he's a constant carry and likes to handle the gun, he may carry it where it's more easily accessible; touching the gun, even in a small way, would probably calm him down, since he seems rather intense/high strung.