Credentials = successful query ;-)

I certainly didn't find this to be true. I have no credentials, nothing published, nada, and I had many requests for partials, fulls, and signed with an agent.

So it can be done!

Stick with it.

IMO, credentials surely don't hurt. I noticed a marked increase in requests once I was able to list a high placement in a nation-wide, well-respected contest as well as a couple article credits.

That being said, I also learned a lot about query writing in general, and have no doubt that reworking my query made a huge impact as well.

Bottom line: Creds may get you "noticed", but a good hook and great writing will close the deal!

Good luck to you!

Credentials help . . . but they certainly are not everything. I have no writing credentials and have a fabulous agent.

And I'll echo the general consensus. No credentials at all here either. Have a great agent, and am being published in the fall.

Funny...I was just thinking this same thing this morning.

I'm noticing more and more agents saying they won't accept queries unless you:
1) have been published by a royalty paying publisher
2) met the agent at a writing conference
or
3) are being referred by another agented author

Very frustrating.

But I think this just means you're going about this correctly. Starting with the cream of the agency crop and working your way down. The ones that want nothing to do with uncredentialed authors (if this is the case) are probably acting that way because they CAN act that way. They have published authors banging on their doors already, so why risk their time on an unknown entity?

Eventually, though, you and I will have all the PMA's, Tridents, Maass', Folios, Curtis Browns, and other top names in the industry crossed off our list. At that point, we'll start querying the smaller, hungrier agencies who are more willing to take a risk on a new author with a fresh voice and no credentials.

I think the key is in not getting too discouraged as the big guys weed you out....take each rejection as knowledge that you're one step closer to querying the agent who's willing to take a chance on you. In the meantime, include your first 5 pages even if they say they only want a query letter. If you don't have credentials, your writing is the only thing you've got.

Anyway, that's my take on things.

Untrue.

I had a couple of publications, but I'd say nobody in New York would have ever heard of those journals.

Good book. Original idea. Solid query letter. Patience.

Many first novelists have no credentials to speak of, I'd guess, except the fact that they've written a publishable and marketable novel.

Everyone starts somewhere and every novelist has been a first-timer (yes, even JK Rowling). I think it's bull to say that if you don't have credentials, no one will take you seriously. Let the work speaks for itself. If it sucks, then no amount of credentials is going to save it. And if you've written a great book, agents and publishers will come knocking.

Not everyone has credentials to get an agent. I have friends that the biggest credential in their query was "I am a member of OWW" (an online writing workshop).

I had zero credentials, but I got an agent. Credentials may help, but if your book catches someone's eye, it won't really matter.

It's obviously not impossible to get an agent without credentials, but it certainly seems to help. It seems like every time I read an agent's example of a "good" or "outstanding" query letter, it includes past publications in prestigious magazines and/or references from published authors. The rest of the letter, most of the time, looks like nothing special.

~JM.

I don't think it's necessary to have credentials, but I don't think there's any harm in trying to get some. Often a chapter in a novel will work well as a stand-alone story, and you can try sending that off to a magazine. Worst comes to worst, you make a connection with a literary editor. Also, you can try writing a non-fiction article about some aspect of the novel that gave you trouble and try to sell that. (I had an article in The Writer about my difficulties writing an opening paragraph.) I think one big benefit of having writing credentials is that when a marketing department is looking at your work, (assuming an editor already likes it), it shows them that there are venues out there where your name is known. Maybe these are all crass considerations, but I figure everything helps.

Dear agent,

I just finished a new book. Care to take a look?

Harper Lee

Credentials

Credentials, good credits, certainly do clear a number of roadblocks. They get you read by a higher placed agent or editor, which means you won't be rejected by an assistant.

I sold my first novel solely because I had good short story credits, and I've made two novel deals since that came about only because I had good credits.

And all things being equal, and agent or editor is much more likely to ask for a manuscript from a writer with credits.

So credits can be extremely valuable.

But writers without credits make novel sales each and every year. If you have credits, great, they are valuable, and can move mountains. But you can still sell a novel without credits, and writers do on a fairly regular basis.

I know how you feel. I have scoured many websites on the subject and the in formation I find seems like the classic catch 22. You can’t get a job without experience and you can’t get experience without a job or, in this case, you can’t get published without an agent and you can’t get an agent unless you’re previously published. I guess we’ll have to just keep trying and, as most of the form letters I receive say, “We wish you the best in your search for an agent and publisher for your work,” or “Good luck with all your publishing endeavors,” and the ever popular “Our team appreciated the chance to hear about your project.”

Just Me said:

It seems like every time I read an agent's example of a "good" or "outstanding" query letter, it includes past publications in prestigious magazines and/or references from published authors. The rest of the letter, most of the time, looks like nothing special.

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I was just saying the same thing on a different thread! Yeah, it's easy to be outstanding in the slushpile when you're being recced by Michael Ondaatje, close family friend. Hee! We probably saw the same queries.

I know it's still possible to get an agent if you're a publishing virgin...but everything that shaves another percentage point off the odds is so depressing. ::drinks heavily::

PS Look! I'm now One of the Locals instead of an Esteemed New Member! That makes me embarrassingly pleased.

argenianpoet said:

Everything I read pertaining to a successful query is bunk if they don't show a successful query letter from a previously unpublished author without any credentials. Why don't they show that? It seems they are encouraging published writers with credits rather than the majority who have never been published. See what I mean? I'm not saying that I disagree with the fact that people get published every year without credits, but what does that query look and sound like? That's the well kept secret I think. Anyway, I think my query is pretty solid and so far it has been rejected by every agent I send it to, so, how can they base their rejection on a letter if they've never read your story? The chances of getting a top tier agent are against you, at least that's the way I see it. Ah, the frustration!

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What does such a letter look like? I can only tell you what I like to see in a query letter. Short, specific, friendly, and exciting. Now, I've never been an agent, but I have been an editor, and still am on occasion, and I have helped a couple of agents with slush.

It probably won't help at all, but here's the thing. I really want to see five things in a query letter that has no credits.

1. Something that tells me this isn't a shotgun query. If you can do no more than change the name of the agent/editor and send the same query to another agent or editor, it's probably not a query that will interest me.

2. Short and friendly. I hate using the word friendly, but I don't know another word that fits. Maybe pleasant, is better. Business-pleasant, business-friendly, but still friendly and pleasant. Any good business writes such letters to customers, but this probably doesn't help, either. So many queries are too deadly serious, and so business-like, so cold, that you have to wear gloves to read them.

3. This goes hand in hand with number three. Good writing in every sentence. It's hard to write a great sentence when you're being to cold and professional. This makes every query sound alike. There should be rhythm and flow and structure to every sentence.

4. An exciting, well-written synopsis. Whether it's one paragraph or two pages, I want it to grab me. Far too many writers think you should just give a list of the highlights, and that's enough. I think the synopsis should be as exciting as the novel. Read the jacket copy of a published novel. There you'll usually find a great synopsis. Jacket copy is a synopsis written by the publisher, and it's purpose is to make readers buy the book. Your synopsis should make an agent or editor want to do the same. Unlike a jacket copy synopsis, you should include the ending of the novel, but other than this, it's perfect.

5. The first three or four pages of the manuscript. This really tells me something about the way you write, and if these pages grab me, I'll want to see more.

But, really, if you've sold stories to good magazines, the only thing a query has to do is tell me you've written a novel that's appropriate for what I need. But if you have no great credits, you have to do more.

So many queries are shotgunned, and it's tough to find anything interesting if you think twenty other agents are reading the same thing. Even if you do send to twenty agents, the query should sound like you think I'm the only one for the job, and you wouldn't dream of trying anyone else.

So many other queries/synopses are so business-like and impersonal that you can't tell anything about the writer or the story. If a query and synopsis bores me, there's no reason to think the novel won't bore me just as much.

The trick, of course, is finding the right balance. You can be too friendly, and the writing can turn to overblown, purple prose if you try to by too exciting. But good writing stands out just as much in a query as in a novel. A natural flow and rhythm stands out just as much in a query as in a novel.

In a sense, I think the biggest mistake writers make in writing queries and synopses is trying too hard to sound professional. In doing so they produce query letters and synopses that sound like something a computer program would spit out. They might as well be telephone bills. Dear John, James, or whomever, I'm sending this phone bill for your perusal. Hope you enjoy the enclosed, synopsis of December's phone calls. Sincerely, XXXXX

And the synopsis does have all the excitement of the list of phone calls you made last month.

Making me think I'm the only agent you queried counts, even if I'm not. Personality counts. Good writing that shows both your style and your personality all the way through counts. A brief, exciting synopsis counts. Including a wonderful couple of opening pages counts.

argenianpoet said:

Everything I read pertaining to a successful query is bunk if they don't show a successful query letter from a previously unpublished author without any credentials. Why don't they show that? It seems they are encouraging published writers with credits rather than the majority who have never been published. See what I mean? I'm not saying that I disagree with the fact that people get published every year without credits, but what does that query look and sound like? That's the well kept secret I think. Anyway, I think my query is pretty solid and so far it has been rejected by every agent I send it to, so, how can they base their rejection on a letter if they've never read your story? The chances of getting a top tier agent are against you, at least that's the way I see it. Ah, the frustration!

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It is frustrating.

But what you're saying is also not true.

I'm not sure what you're reading, but what you're reading doesn't match up with real life. Trust me. I signed with a major NY agency and consequently signed a deal with Crown Books with absolutely NO major credentials.

It's about the book.

argenianpoet said:

Anyway, I think my query is pretty solid and so far it has been rejected by every agent I send it to, so, how can they base their rejection on a letter if they've never read your story?

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If this is the Noomsville query you posted, it's not going to fly. In particular, the 250k length will mean instant rejection from the majority of agents.

Wow, 250k. From someone with a long book, I still think that is probaly your kiss of death. Terry Goodkind did it as a debut author, but if we all pooled our resources, I'll bet we could come up with a thousand authors who didn't. Not great odds.

argenianpoet -

Go further down this ask the agent section and you'll find one started by orion requesting people to post their successful queries. Which they do. She also posts hers. She was a first time novelest and now with a top agency and is about to become huge.

What would such a query look like? How about like every other query but without the credentials at the end. I would post my query but it wouldn't be much help as queries in the UK are different than american ones.

And I agree with the 250k comment.

Of course, to get those credentials, it helps if you have credentials.

caw

argenianpoet said:

What if they don't ask for that, just a query, then what?

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If their website says "NOTHING BUT THE QUERY, YOU IDIOTS", I just send the query. Everybody else who says "query with SASE" also gets the first five pages. The worst they can do is toss them without reading them...but I figure most agents will probably take a peek.