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wyzguy
03-15-2007, 11:21 PM
Okay. I think this is the last question. Sarge has his 9mm Beretta and Angel has a Uzi. What is the maximum comfortable range for Sarge to be standing with confidence in his own shot? Assume high skill level. Again, thanks for all past and future replies. You guys rock.

rugcat
03-15-2007, 11:59 PM
I'm a reasonably good pistol shot. On the range, with a 9mm, I'm confident up to about 25 yards, but I have friends who are competition shooters and SWAT members who almost never miss a silhouette target at 50 yards, the furthest our range went to.

It's different in the field. If there were a hostage situation, for example, where a miss would be a disaster, I don't know of anyone who would try even a twenty five yard shot with a pistol.

wordmonkey
03-16-2007, 12:01 AM
15 yards.

I've not read this, but I think it will tell you what you want...

http://www.handgunsmag.com/tactics_training/shot_022305/

I just googled - glock shot distance

I tried - glock range - but that just gave me a bunch of glock accesories for going to a shooting range.

Remember, google is your friend.

Tiger
03-16-2007, 03:20 AM
The closer the better. Our local municipal range has targets at 25 yards. That's fine, when you're shooting slowly and deliberately (with no one shooting back).

Think I read somewhere though that most police shootings occur within 10 feet or so.

alleycat
03-16-2007, 03:26 AM
I agree with rugcat. Around 25 yards if he's skilled and trained for those types of events. Of course, further out is completely possible, but 25 yards or less would make me more comfortable if I was in a stress situation (and assuming there weren't hostages or others nearby). Of course, anyone in that situation would prefer a closer shot . . . and also that the other guy doesn't start firing that Uzi first.

I own a 9mm S&W, by the way.

rugcat
03-16-2007, 03:44 AM
I agree with rugcat.Well, you should. We're both cats. (Although my avatar begs to differ.)

alleycat
03-16-2007, 03:47 AM
Well, you should. We're both cats. (Although my avatar begs to differ.)
So does mine at the moment.

Pancakes, anyone?

alleycat
03-16-2007, 03:53 AM
Another point you might want to keep in mind, the 9mm isn't known for it's great "stopping power". In other words, unless someone is hit in a vital area, they can keep coming. With something like a big, flat-nose .45, it can cause enough blood loss and trauma to stop someone even if it doesn't hit a vital area directly. Of course, in combat, people have been known to keep coming regardless.

rugcat
03-16-2007, 04:23 AM
I would guess OP picked a Beretta 9mm because his MC is ex-army, and (I believe) that's the standard issued army sidearm. But there's no reason he couldn't have a more specialized sidearm if the plot requires it.

Vanatru
03-16-2007, 06:36 AM
Okay. I think this is the last question. Sarge has his 9mm Beretta and Angel has a Uzi. What is the maximum comfortable range for Sarge to be standing with confidence in his own shot? Assume high skill level. Again, thanks for all past and future replies. You guys rock.

Some of the guys in SOCOM are using 10mm and .45's. Some can whistle off stats for this that and the other. 9mm does just fine. IMO. In the end, it's all personal prefrence.

I've killed guys out to 30 yards (90feet aprox) but only because we'd run out of rifle ammo. Personally, unless I"m clearing a room/building I wouldn't go that distance if I didn't have to. I'd rather have a pistol then than a SMG at close range. Rifle at distance.

Some guys can have buttloads of training and do really well........others have natural luck. Some have both. Unless your guy has both.........well, go with the rifle.

I'd use his 16 if it's over 30 feet (10 yards aprox).

There's something sweetier and more personal when ya kill the bastard with a pistol or knife. Specially if you think they need killing. Might make better copy for ya.

I use two 9mms for up close and personal killing. One of my left hip and one my right. Both standard 9mm. It's the most common round in the world next to the .22. More soldiers and cops have experience with that than any other round. It's more belieavable if you use it. IMO.

Unless your bad ass is prior SpecOps I'd go with standard issue 9mm. Some of those guys practice, practice, practice, practice, and practice with ALL kinds of weapons. They could knock the nuts off a fly at "excessive" range with little effort. The average dogface can't.

Otherwise, go for no more than 30 feet killing zone with handgun.

Just my thoughts.

Head shots are worth "F'ing Kudos'" if you use 'em. It's always a sweet kill when done with handgun.

-Bill

Tiger
03-16-2007, 08:05 AM
Is "Sarge" a cop or a soldier?

Kentuk
03-16-2007, 08:42 AM
Please not too close! Its a gun! You got it so you would have to touch the man you are going to kill. Also you don't want him to touch you, people get upset when you point to shoot and are likely to try and do you first.

wyzguy
03-16-2007, 11:38 AM
Sarge, the MC, is ex-army. Bad guy (Angel) is LA street thug. And Angel definitely deserves to be seriously dead.

Vanatru
03-16-2007, 05:43 PM
Please not too close! Its a gun! You got it so you would have to touch the man you are going to kill. Also you don't want him to touch you, people get upset when you point to shoot and are likely to try and do you first.

That's in line with that old saying "If the enemy is in range, so are you."

:)

ideagirl
03-17-2007, 06:54 PM
Another point you might want to keep in mind, the 9mm isn't known for it's great "stopping power". In other words, unless someone is hit in a vital area, they can keep coming. With something like a big, flat-nose .45, it can cause enough blood loss and trauma to stop someone even if it doesn't hit a vital area directly.

The stopping power depends greatly on what kind of bullet you use. If you use a regular "full metal jacket" (FMJ) type bullet, it has less stopping power (unless you happen to hit a vital area) because quite often it just goes right through the person, so the actual impact is not felt very much. But a hollow-point or similar type of bullet is designed to expand when it hits something, so it stops inside the person, which makes the person feel the full force of the bullet, and also is more likely to hit something important because it's expanded to two or more times its normal diameter, so the chances of its hitting something important are greater. Here's a rundown on bullet types:
http://matrix.dumpshock.com/raygun/basics/bullets.html

I have a 9mm kurz ("9mm short"), also known as a .380, or a European 9mm. The bullets are 9mm wide but slightly shorter than American 9mm, so they contain less gunpowder and thus don't fly as fast, so they have less impact. I got a .380, as opposed to a 9mm, because I have tiny hands and can't hold a big gun. But I carry hollowpoints in it, precisely because they make sure the full impact is felt by the person I'm aiming at. (Also because the other downside of FMJ bullets is that, since they tend to go right through the target, they can hit people standing anywhere behind the target.)

Tiger
03-20-2007, 12:13 AM
I think it depends on where the round enters among other things...

I mean, unless you're going to do a Frederick Forsythe-type description about how the firing pin hits the primer, the gases expand, the round travels out of barrel, and the little bitty details of what it does from the time it breaks the skin...:)

Tiger
03-20-2007, 12:13 AM
That's in line with that old saying "If the enemy is in range, so are you."

:)


Always liked the one about tracers pointing both ways

Popeyesays
03-20-2007, 01:04 AM
I would guess OP picked a Beretta 9mm because his MC is ex-army, and (I believe) that's the standard issued army sidearm. But there's no reason he couldn't have a more specialized sidearm if the plot requires it.

It's the standard NOW. Before 1995 or so the .45 M1911A1 was the standard issue side arm. The old WW2 M3 Grease Gun SMG was also still standard issue for tank crew -- usually one per vehicle. I think the M4 is standard now, but only recently.

Pistol practice and qualification is on a twenty meter target.

Special Ops folks usually shoot daily, so they get very good and competition amongst them is vicious and quite often for high dollar bets.

Regards,
Scott

Popeyesays
03-20-2007, 01:07 AM
"A line of sight works both ways."

"Remember your weapon was diligently built by the lowest bidder."

"When in doubt do SOMETHING. Doing nothing will get you killed faster."

Regards,
Scott

Vanatru
03-20-2007, 07:26 AM
"A line of sight works both ways."

"Remember your weapon was diligently built by the lowest bidder."

"When in doubt do SOMETHING. Doing nothing will get you killed faster."

Regards,
Scott

Agreed......and drawing fire will ALWAYS piss off your team mates.

JimmyB27
03-20-2007, 08:56 PM
It's different in the field. If there were a hostage situation, for example, where a miss would be a disaster, I don't know of anyone who would try even a twenty five yard shot with a pistol.

Jack Bauer