Sex, cigarettes and the mob

Warp · Dec 4, 2006

Okay, all of my other books are solidly YA but with my new WIP I'm not so sure. It's an urban fantasy set in Las Vegas (not totally modern Vegas, more of a retro Vegas with all of the old casinos they knocked down. You know, back when the Strip wasn't all Disneyfied. BTW, I love Disney but it didn't work for my story). My MC is a 15 year old street kid who smokes cigarettes, runs jobs for the mob and falls in love with a young hooker. There's some violence and fade out kinda sex scenes, but I'm actually more worried about the cigarettes. It's not like I want to promote tobacco usage. I smoked as a teenager though (quit in college), so I know how it is. Also, I suppose the sex and violence could be a problem. I know there are plenty of other YA books with these issues (Kevin Brooks comes to mind), but mine isn't a problem novel, they're just things that happen while the main plot is getting sorted out.

I don't want to censor my story, so what do you all think? Should I keep it YA or try for an adult book?

Thanks!

Stew21 · Dec 4, 2006

I'd keep exactly as it is. Then when you are finished writing your story, uncensored and exactly as you see it, you could always submit to YA and Adult fiction agents/publishers and let them decide.
Just my opinion. I think you should write the book you set out to write.

truelyana · Dec 4, 2006

Yes, go for it

TwentyFour · Dec 4, 2006

I agree with everyone here. My novel is a southern YA novel set in VA in the late fifties. The teens drag race, smoke, drink, sell moonshine, and have sex. I didn't grow up then but I know how teens are, they experiment, they smoke, drink, they're horny as hell...

I should put that in my signature "Teenagers are horny as hell..." Now you see why the teens here named me Official Corruptor of Youth

Soccer Mom · Dec 4, 2006

I have a teenager that smokes in my Middle Grade novel. he's trying to quit, but it's a reality for kids. I say as long as you don't glorify it, it belongs. I don't mean you have to preach that it's evil, just not present it in a way that necessarily advocates it. If he's a street kid, then let him be a street kid.

Jamesaritchie · Dec 4, 2006

book

You should do what the publisher requires. Each publisher has a set of restrictions for what is and isn't allowed, and how it has to be presented when it is allowed. The writer isn't the boss here, the publisher is, so it's always best to know who youre writing for, what it is they want, and how they want it.

The wirter's choice is really to decide whether these restrictions are okay, or whether it might be better to write for adults. Either way, you really need to read enough publisher's guidelines, and enough books released by given publishers, to know what it is they allow before you write it, not after.

TwentyFour · Dec 4, 2006

No offense Jamesaritchie, but if you only write by guidelines, how can you truly be creative? I was always told by writing books to write what you want, then edit it to the guidelines. Not every publisher will have the same guidelines or want the same things...its very confusing to go by the diff. guidelines.

SLake · Dec 4, 2006

SouthernWriter1978 said:
I agree with everyone here. My novel is a southern YA novel set in VA in the late fifties. The teens drag race, smoke, drink, sell moonshine, and have sex. I didn't grow up then but I know how teens are, the experiment, the smoke, drink, they're horny as hell...

I should put that in my signature "Teenagers are horny as hell..." Now you see why the teens here named me Official Corruptor of Youth

Woohoo, wine, whiskey and wild, wild women! I think the bible's Ecclesiastes (at least I spelled bible correctly) mentioned something about having a life, and he got published. In fact he's in reprint.

Re censorship, I'd suggest you write it first--get every little detail written and then see how you feel. What fits, what doesn't.

moondance · Dec 5, 2006

I agree with SouthernWriter1978. Every publisher will have different guidelines and some of those guidelines are very flexible. If you try to write to the market all the time, it can be creatively stifling.

Warp, write it how you like. Kevin Brooks is one of my favourite writers

Melissa_Marr · Dec 5, 2006

My .02--
Write the story you have in your head. Do not write to an abstract idea of a publisher's guidelines. If there are details that are problematic, your eventual editor will tell you. Publishers don't refuse to buy stories based on the minutia: it's the larger text that matters. Details can be revised, deleted, or altered. That said, remember that your eventual editor might request changes.

Based on your details, I see nothing here that would need changed. Current YA can handle some pretty tough topics without flinching--just like current YA readers.

Just keep writing it. If you get to the end and something feels wrong to you (in terms of ethics, plot, or anything else), change it. If it doesn't but you're worried, bring it up with your eventual editor. They know the market & rules.

Melissa

PS And fwiw, the details you cite--alt Vegas, street life, mob, urban fantasy--sound like ingredients for an intriguing YA.

Warp · Dec 5, 2006

Thanks a lot for the input! You guys totally rock. All of the other books I've written are classical fantasy YA so I really wanted to try something different. I've lived in Vegas for almost 20 yrs. (ahh, I feel old now) and thought it would be the perfect back drop.

Okay, now back to the story!

James D. Macdonald · Dec 6, 2006

Write the best book you can and let the publisher figure out how -- and to whom -- to market it.

Grey Malkin · Dec 6, 2006

Not sure I agree with that last statement. Write the best book you can, but you should really know from the outset your audience, especially if you are writing a Young Adult novel because if you are writing from a teen POV, it will change the language you use, the way you touch on more racy scenes and how you include such things as smoking.

I wouldn't go too PC on this either, if you're striving for realism. Some teens love smoking. Why wouldn't they when so many influential pop stars/movie stars that still smoke?

Grey

Zolah · Dec 6, 2006

Tithe by Holly Black. Bloodtide by Melvin Burgess. Blood and Chocolate by Annette Curtis Klaus. Candy by Kevin Brooks. Suger Rush by Julie Birchill. Go out and read these guys, because not only can they write a heck of a book, but their protagonists drink, smoke, do drugs, have sex with prostitutes, kill people...and have a lot of fun doing it. These days if you write well you can write nearly anything you want in the YA genre. Be fearless. Your editor will tell you if you go too far.

Warp · Dec 7, 2006

Thanks Zolah! I have several of those books on my 'to read' list, but I haven't gotten around to buying them yet. Now I have a good idea of what to ask for for Christmas. Hooray!

WerenCole · Dec 7, 2006

Of course Uncle Jim said exactly what I was thinking. . . but then again I got it from him in the first place. If this book doesn't fit into your "market" then make this an exception. You can always go back to what your publisher wants with the next book. Who knows, maybe this turns out to be your master piece that you never intended. Dahl didn't write only childrens books, some of his best writing is very adult.

I just thought it was funny. . . kids runs for the mob, hookers, Vegas. . . and your worried about the cigarettes?

Young adults read Catcher in the Rye. . . Holden smokes all the time.

Grey Malkin · Dec 17, 2006

Just thought I'd add a note to this. Busy reading "Lucas" by Kevin Brooks. Smoking all the way through and no moral issues regarding it at all - it's just a reflection of how it is. There's lots of drinking too, violence, attempted murder and attempted rape. Good book. 30 pages to go!

emsuniverse · Jan 1, 2007

I write what I want to write. My YA MC is sixteen, but the girl's already been through hell and back and I don't mince words describing it. I don't glorify her past, but I don't gloss over it, either.

Just tell the story like you want to tell it; if you censor it too much, it's not going to seem realistic to the reader.

AllyWoof · Feb 11, 2007

I had that in one of my drafts. I didn't use that draft(not because of that.) I'd put it in, but moderate it a bit. Being too graphic to me is like handing a young ago cigs and condoms and saying doing these things are appropriette for them. For those of you that smoke, don't worry I am not ordering you to qit(unless you're a male wanting to kiss my lips).

A.M. Wildman · Feb 11, 2007

Warp said:
My MC is a 15 year old street kid who smokes cigarettes, runs jobs for the mob and falls in love with a young hooker. There's some violence and fade out kinda sex scenes, but I'm actually more worried about the cigarettes. It's not like I want to promote tobacco usage.
Thanks!

I'm sorry, I just find that hilariously ironic. Like running around with hookers and the mob isn't near as dangerous as smoking? :Shrug:

I'd agree with everyone else. Write it out and you can always edit it later if you feel the need to.

writermom · Feb 11, 2007

A.M. Wildman said:
I'm sorry, I just find that hilariously ironic. Like running around with hookers and the mob isn't near as dangerous as smoking?

*chuckle*

It’s faster to die of a $0.33 bullet than in 20 years of emphysema.

AllyWoof · Feb 11, 2007

Let me guess, writer mom, you are a smoker?

writermom · Feb 11, 2007

writerdog said:
Let me guess, writer mom, you are a smoker?

Nope. Just couldn't resist.

AllyWoof · Feb 11, 2007

Sex, cigarettes and the mob

So many boys, so little time

Set yourself free

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