Who really wrote the screenplay?

Reading Syd Field's excellent book: "Screenwriter's Problem Solver." In it, he mentions the problem of weak dialog and how directors often hire on new screenwriters to liven up or enrich the weak dialog. In one interesting case, 12 screenwriters eventually had their thumbprints on the screenplay.

A case study he mentions is the film, "The Rock," which had several writers. And, there were even arguments regarding whose name should be in the credits. The rule he gave is that if over 50% of the script was rewritten, then the rewriter can claim top billing.

I kinda doubt that any screenwriter would like to have his/her work rewritten. I suppose if you press me, I would mind; but as long as I got my pay, it would mitigate any hard feelings, except for bruised ego.

How do you feel about having your work rewritten? Do you feel that's just the way things are and that it's out of your hands, or do you feel that if your work is strong enough, it will not be rewritten? My understanding is that even the best writers have their work rewritten from time to time.

fj/g

all scripts are rewritten. every one. either by the original writer or someone else or by the actors and director on the set right before the camera starts.

writing is rewriting and the process is never finished. even after movie is made, there is usually something that could have been improved

if you think you write the script, turn it in, everybody falls in love with it, it gets made verbatim, you're not in touch. rewriting is central to the process and comprises most of the work done, most of the money made, time spent, etc


zilla

"writing is rewriting and the process is never finished."

Not true. If that were the case, none of us would ever have more than one screenplay.

Of course rewriting is also a part of the process in which you learn how to write. And after the script is sold, rewrites and changes are made.

Changes and rewrites are not made for the hell of it. Scripts are adapted to budgets, to locations, to which directors and actors are going to be in the movie, to overall market conditions, and a whole lot of factors.

The idea is not to get a perfect movie. A movie is not like a paper that you're going to have graded. The idea is to produce a movie that will sell well as the box office. Rewrites and changes occur along those lines.

"The idea is not to get a perfect movie."

Speak for yourself. There are producers out there that want to make genuinely good movies, that care more about quality than raking in the dough. Obviously you've got to gross enough at the theater and on video to recoup the investment and pay your cast and crew. But that doesn't mean you have to sell your soul to a production company that only looks for dollar signs.

It would be nice to get rich. If I got the chance to make a big sale, I'd almost definitely take it (knowing the chances that my script will never see the light of day, or at least barely resemble what I wrote). That said, I wouldn't spurn working with a production company that I felt wanted to make the best film possible, even if it meant a smaller paycheck and audience.

I'm not talking about creative control. I'm talking about trusting the people that will make the film.

"Speak for yourself. There are producers out there that want to make genuinely good movies, that care more about quality than raking in the dough."

If these are legit producers, then yes, at the of the day have to care more about raking in the dough. When you produce a movie, you are spending your money along with the money of others.

Things will not look to good for you if it is a flop.

"Obviously you've got to gross enough at the theater and on video to recoup the investment and pay your cast and crew. But that doesn't mean you have to sell your soul to a production company that only looks for dollar signs."

I don't know what you're talking about. I said in my earlier post that this idea one's work is never finished is nonsense. At some point your script should get as good as it's going to get, and then it is time to move on. Whenever you sell the script, they aren't going to give you forever to rewrite it. After you do your rewrite, any other changes will be made by other writers, the director, actors etc. I'm merely pointing out the producers, studios, directors, etc request changes to make the project a more commercially viable film. Having writers rewrite costs quite a bit of money, and isn't going to be done in the name of some strange and vague perfection.

"It would be nice to get rich. If I got the chance to make a big sale, I'd almost definitely take it (knowing the chances that my script will never see the light of day, or at least barely resemble what I wrote). That said, I wouldn't spurn working with a production company that I felt wanted to make the best film possible, even if it meant a smaller paycheck and audience."

Not too optimistic about your chances, eh?

"I'm not talking about creative control. I'm talking about trusting the people that will make the film."

I really don't get what you're talking about at all.

"I really don't get what you're talking about at all."

I can live with that.

First I would not discourage anyone from reading Syd Field. I've read him myself and learned things.

Second I would remind the reader that there are lots and lots of more up to date, better books, by more qualified people on screen writing out there. Please look at him, and any other writer realistically. Much of what they say is opinion, and you should study those opinions with a view toward developing your own.

Kojled says a script is never really finished.

Justin says if that were true no one would ever finish a script.

I say you never finish raising a child either, but at some point you have to let it out into the world on its own. You worry about it, sure, but you have other things to do and other children to raise.



As to the rest:

Ever been on a movie lot? It is not a hard thing to do. I did it long before I got interested in writing screenplays.

Scripts are rewritten almost daily, sometimes hourly based on things that may or may not have anything to do with producing a good movie.

Sometimes the rewrites are for the reasons Justin depicts. Other times it is debates over whether a character would act this way. While at other times it is sheer ego and power.

When you discuss what a producer, or a director wants, you are assuming the producer or director is the most powerful person on the lot. This may not be the case.

It is possible for an actor who is not the star to have more power than anyone else on the set if they have just been in a block buster. They may, or may not, have excellent judgement and great story sense.

As for minding that your material is being rewritten?

Only a few ever make it far enough to get rewritten: Most never have to worry about it: Consider being rewritten a mark of excellence.

"I say you never finish raising a child either, but at some point you have to let it out into the world on its own. You worry about it, sure, but you have other things to do and other children to raise."

A parent most certainly does get done with raising a child. The dynamics between an adult child and his/her parents, and a small child certainly is not the same.

And there are parents who after a certain age no longer provide financial support for a child.

When something is done, it is DONE.

On the set, if a character is named Michael Tucker and they find out that there is a Michael Tucker who lives in the vicinity of the area, for legal reasons they will change the name. In order to prevent lawsuits, in case Michael Tucker says that the film ruined his life.

And yes, actors can cause changes. But by the time the movie is filming, most of the changes that will be made are minor. At that stage, screenplays are not truly rewritten, instead, they are tweaked.

Rewrite implies the script is literally rewritten, from scratch.

Rewrite implies the script is literally rewritten, from scratch.

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The word "rewrite" may imply that, but the dictionary gives the word "revise" as one of the definitions, and to revise also means to edit.

Words are slippery things and usually have more than one meaning and or implication.



I am sorry that you see the need to mention the dynamics of the child / parent relationship apropos the adult child / parent relationship: That you see the need to mention the financial relationship between them: That you do not see the need to mention the love, affection, caring; the need for respect and understanding and advice and counseling and consoling that exists between the child and the parent: For that never ends, it is never done, and it never changes.

When your child is three and her dolly has a broken arm, you hold her while she cries: when she is twenty and her son has a broken arm you hold her while she cries: When she is forty and her son is wounded in Iraq you hold her; and sometimes her husband as well, because his parents aren't there.

Perhaps they finished raising him.


I stand by my statement: Nothing is ever truly finished, completed, perfected, done: Everything is merely given the best treatment we can, the best we know how, at the time: Then it is sent upon its way, as good as we can do for now: Hopefully we will do better next time.

"That you see the need to mention the financial relationship between them: That you do not see the need to mention the love, affection, caring;"

Blah, blah, blah. I've know enough parents who basically cut their kids off finacially at 18. And in a lot of cases, children grow up and move somewhere else. Their parents don't see them on a regular basis, because their offspring is in a different city/state/or country living an entirely different life.

Or maybe mommy and daddy have grown old, and the kids have their parents locked away in the NURSING home.

That's the way life goes.

Screenplays and scripts are finished. Period.

When writing under work for hire, you are given a definite time period in which the producer or studio wants your contribution to be FINISHED. When doing a rewrite for a studio or prodco of a script that you sold them, they are still going to have DEADLINES.

No one is interested in an indefinite project. The only people have heard spout this kind of artistic nonsense that a writer is never done on a script are those who are not professional writers, and who have little chance of becoming such.

I've had a work for hire assignment, and my contributions had to be FINISHED in two weeks. The director is now wrapping up his revisions of it, and then it goes to the investors.

And obviously when a movie is in post production, the script has long since be FINISHED. Even more so when it is in theatrical release.

When it comes to family, Justino, you are a hard man--Definately no relative of mine.



As you very well know I am not a professional screenwriter: I am a newbie learning about scriptwriting.

As to my ever becoming a professional script writer, well, that may or may not happen. But if it does it will depend upon the story and the presentation; upon my mastery of the craft, and that alone: Not upon your opinion of my life's philosophy and personal beliefs.

It will also depend on the amount of time I can devote to the study after working full time, dealing with a large, loveing family (We are over 100 strong with a crisis almost daily) and the writing of novels. Novels, as I've said before, are my primary writing activity.

By the way, many non professional writers, and hobby writers, face deadlines and are paid for their work. The most common "hobby writers" who face deadlines and are paid for their work are stringers for newspapers, magazine article writers, short story writers, poets. These are people who do not intend to quit their day job.

We have all met our share of deadlines.

If you are given two weeks you do the best you can in two weeks.

I personally can do a lot in two weeks. I can produce a good short story or the first draft of a novel. A movie script? I could not do my best, although someday I may be able to do something acceptable.

And obviously when a movie is in post production, the script has long since be FINISHED. Even more so when it is in theatrical release.

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Lord of the Rings was written as a novel. You may say it was done and finished, but it was later made into a movie: You may say it was done, but it was also turned into a radio program: You may say it was done, but it was also turned into a Musical on stage. You may say it is done, but 20 years from now it may be turned into a remake.

But tell me, is this difference in POV worth us agruing over?

Is either belief going to make one of us a better writer than the other? More professional than the other? Isn't what really counts what winds up on the page?

I think the point is being lost.

Many writers (especially new ones) have a tendency to show their work after a first draft.

We all have to remember that a script can always be improved, honed, changed and scrutinized. Our job as a good writer is to rewrite and rewrite until we are satisfied that we have written the best we can under the time and artistic constraints we place upon ourselves.

Of course, if a producer, agent, manager is interested in your work but wants certain changes, we should be happy to do it. It's their vision too and film is a collaborative work.

Whether or not we should make changes before getting a check, that's a personal decision, but I at least make it look like I'm a team player, even without the deal closed.

My last work for hire, I was well into the third draft of producer requested changes (and three months into it) before the deal was even signed and the first check was cashed. A lot of this industry seems to work on a promise and a handshake. But, you got to take each situation as they come and make an honest choice.



My two cents.

"Lord of the Rings was written as a novel. You may say it was done and finished, but it was later made into a movie: You may say it was done, but it was also turned into a radio program: You may say it was done, but it was also turned into a Musical on stage. You may say it is done, but 20 years from now it may be turned into a remake."

Yes, the novel WAS FINISHED AND PUBLISHED.

The screenplay was FINISHED AND PRODUCED.

The RADIO PROGRAM IS A WHOLE DIFFERENT ANIMAL.

Ditto for the STAGE PLAY.

"Our job as a good writer is to rewrite and rewrite until we are satisfied that we have written the best we can under the time and artistic constraints we place upon ourselves."

And at that point, you are finished.

Joe Calabrese,

I think you sum up the point extremely well. Thank you.

We all have to remember that a script can always be improved, honed, changed and scrutinized. Our job as a good writer is to rewrite and rewrite until we are satisfied that we have written the best we can under the time and artistic constraints we place upon ourselves.

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At which point you start working on one of your next projects.

I always have several projects in the bonepile: not everyone does, but I suggest a person have at least one that you have spent some time with so there is no lag between one project and the next.