Birds and Bees may be gay- a museum exhibition

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bloemmarc

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http//news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20061012/...mosexuality_dc
I've heard alot of strange things, but never in my life could I have come up with the far out ideas in this article.
I guess it takes all kinds.
 

Forbidden Snowflake

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May I ask you what kind of ideas we're talking about?

Because as far as I know, there's not a person, that suddenly had the idea that lion might be gay, but more researchers that studied the lion and spotted gay behaviour during those studies. Which makes it more a fact than an idea.

Or am I getting you wrong?

Please, explain.

Btw, article here.
 

bloemmarc

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Whatever animals do, they do by reacting by instincts. Being gay is more a personal choise in lifestyle.
on any animal kingdom show you can watch how the female and male species interact. The spiders and insects mate male and female, sure the female eats the male after, but they do mate.
Whatever they are researching in these animals is because of instinct in them.
Lions have an instinct to search our other female lions and mate with them to have cubs. I'ts inbred into their genes to want this, and wil die fighting over a female lion.
I ail to see how this research would be correct, other than for comic relief.
 

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bloemmarc said:
Whatever animals do, they do by reacting by instincts. Being gay is more a personal choise in lifestyle.
on any animal kingdom show you can watch how the female and male species interact. The spiders and insects mate male and female, sure the female eats the male after, but they do mate.
Whatever they are researching in these animals is because of instinct in them.
Lions have an instinct to search our other female lions and mate with them to have cubs. I'ts inbred into their genes to want this, and wil die fighting over a female lion.
I think you are missing the point. Animals do react to their instincts, and, as research has shown, some animals prefer to mate with others of the same sex. Anyone who says that homosexuality is not found in "nature" (in quotes because some people seem to use the term to exclude humans) is simply wrong. Based on the responses of some of the people quoted in this article, it's an important exhibit.
I ail to see how this research would be correct, other than for comic relief.
So, do you think the researchers are just making up their observations? The point of doing research is to find out if our hypotheses and assumptions are correct or not.
 

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bloemmarc said:
Whatever animals do, they do by reacting by instincts. Being gay is more a personal choise in lifestyle.

No, no it's not.

It's hard-wired, possibly genetically determined before birth.

There are homosexual mammals, birds and reptiles.

Heck, our neighbor had a homosexual stud bull.

I ail to see how this research would be correct, other than for comic relief.

You need to either spend more time observing animals, or read more. Probably both.

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2004/07/0722_040722_gayanimal.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homosexuality_in_animals#Homosexual_behavior

With respect to humans and other mammals, the inability of a given male individual to achieve and maintain an erection when engaging with sexual behavior with a female while experiencing no erectile dysfunction while engaging in sexual behavior with a female is hardly a matter of a "life style choice."
 

bloemmarc

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Well to be honest, I didn't post it to argue with anyone. I disagre with it, but I just wanted to see what people's reactions would be to research like this. I had never heard of anything being reported like this before.
 

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Anyone who watches social animals for extended periods and can tell male from female has seen homosexual animal behavior. We had a cosy and very sexually active pair of gay hedgehogs in our garden for years.

As for why gay people and animals are gay, who cares. Really. Who cares, and why? I don't tell other people who to shack up with anymore than I did the hedgehogs.

As for the research, there are three separate books out reviewing homosexuality in non-human animals. I suggest you pick any one of them to get up to speed on the subject. Posting your "disagreement" is something any reasonable person could predict would start an argument.

We've had more than enough threads already on how gays are self-inflicted perverse sinful freaks and I, for one, am sick of it.
 
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bloemmarc

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Well actually like I said, I had never heard of research like this before. I was just wondering what people's reactions would be to it.
I am not trying tell others what to do with their lives. As a metter of fact, I am not even talking about human gays at all.


veinglory said:
Anyone who watches social animals for extended periods and can tell male from female has seen homosexual animal behavior. We had a cosy and very sexually active pair of gay hedgehogs in our garden for years.

As for why gay people and animals are gay, who cares. Really. Who cares, and why? I don't tell other people who to shack up with anymore than I did the hedgehogs.

As for the research, there are three separate books out reviewing homosexuality in non-human animals. I suggest you pick any one of them. Posting your "disagreement" is something any reasonable person could predict would start an argument.

We've had more than enough threads already on how gay's are self-inflicted perverse sinful freaks and I, for one, am sick of it.
 

bloemmarc

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yes, but I wasn't trying to tell them how to live their lives or anything, or calling them names like you mentioned. I am sorry.
i was just trying to make a comparison there, a small one.

veinglory said:
This is you mentioning people.
 

veinglory

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As a queer and animal psychologist allow me to suggest that was a false comparsion. Animals do things for more or less the same reasons as humans. And gay people don't decide to join a discriminated minority because they like the clothes or the decor.
 

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Oh my God. I can't believe people.

It is not a bloody choice in lifestyle. How many times does one have to repeat that.

It is NOT a lifestyle. And it is NOT a choice.

Do you think I got up one morning and decided I am gay, just because I figured, oh yeah, how cool would that be?

It is who I am. Me. Not a lifestyle. Not a choice. Just me.
 

bloemmarc

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ok, I am very very sorry for that, but truth I didn't post this to talk about humans, but animals because I myself have never heard of this in animals before, and am only curious if more people know about this.
I don't see it in animals myself, but am interested in how others see it. Sure, I did see it as comic relief, bit am interested in how others view this in nature.


Forbidden Snowflake said:
Oh my God. I can't believe people.

It is not a bloody choice in lifestyle. How many times does one have to repeat that.

It is NOT a lifestyle. And it is NOT a choice.

Do you think I got up one morning and decided I am gay, just because I figured, oh yeah, how cool would that be?

It is who I am. Me. Not a lifestyle. Not a choice. Just me.
 

veinglory

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I see it as another example of continuity between human and animal behavior. It became very obvious when we took the trouble to observe animals closely in the wild rather than just in small pens. Which, as an aside, is why the praying mantises eat their mate. It is an abnormal behaviour caused by captivity. Unlike homosexual bonds and acts which are a normal part of the continuium of sexual behavior observed in both wild and domestic contexts. I am not sure exactly what makes it funny, though.
 

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It's been long known in science that homosexuality is nothing uncommon in the Animalkingdom.

Which in my opinion shows that it's actually quite natural, unlike what some people try to preach.

Because how could those animals all be unnatural?

And I'm terribly sorry for getting offended at words like lifestyle and choice [/sarcasm]
 

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The fact that I'm a human male who is sexually attracted to human females is no more a choice than two people of the same gender being sexually attracted to each other. I did not choose to be heterosexual, I just am.

Nobody picks their sexual orientation like choosing the upholstery in a new car, no matter what that orientation might be.

ETA: bloemmarc, if you really wanted to have a discussion on how interesting it is that so many of the patterns of human behaviour -- such as homosexuality -- are mirrored in other species, fair enough. It is quite a fascinating subject.
 
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maestrowork

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People do research on animal (and human) behaviors all the time. So what's so far out about trying to figure out if birds and bees exhibit gay behaviors or engage in same-sex relationships? That's how we understand nature. The OP's assertion:

I've heard alot of strange things, but never in my life could I have come up with the far out ideas in this article.
I guess it takes all kinds.

... and..

it's a personal choice of lifestyle

and this:

I [f]ail to see how this research would be correct, other than for comic relief.

... clearly showed a contempt to homosexuality and any research on its "naturalness." Then the OP begins to retract his comments by saying he meant no harm.

As for choice... let me ask you, bloemarc, did you, at one point in your life, decide/choose whether you like girls or boys? I certainly didn't. It's not quite the same as vanilla vs. chocolate.

If anything, people choose to live a heterosexual lifestyle even if they are gay because of societal prejudice from people like you. Not the other way around.
 
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bloemmarc

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Look I did think they were far out ideas because animal behavior is different than humans. Now I know you say being gay is not a personal choice, it's what you're born into, and I respect that, I really do. I was just having a hard time with this article because it referred to animal behavior. I mean I was taught in school that animals mate basically as an instinct to survive. Most times whether you be homosexual or hetro, you mate with the one you love out of a personal choice for the one you want to be with.
same with food, I was taught in school that animals eat to survive out of instinct, and all srtos of things.
look, I said I was sorry about what I said before, and wanted to talk about what I posted, the article because it is an interesting study, whch I was taught differently on when I was younger. That is why I thought it was far outght. I do not have contempt for anyone, and I said I was sorry for maybe sating something rude before, but obviously you aren't looking at that.


maestrowork said:
People do research on animal (and human) behaviors all the time. So what's so far out about trying to figure out if birds and bees exhibit gay behaviors or engage in same-sex relationships? That's how we understand nature. The OP's assertion:



... and..



and this:



... clearly showed a contempt to homosexuality and any research on its "naturalness." Then the OP begins to retract his comments by saying he meant no harm.

As for choice... let me ask you, bloemarc, did you, at one point in your life, decide/choose whether you like girls or boys? I certainly didn't. It's not quite the same as vanilla vs. chocolate.

If anything, people choose to live a heterosexual lifestyle even if they are gay because of societal prejudice from people like you. Not the other way around.
 

bloemmarc

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Like I keep saying, I really didn't even want to talk about humans at all.

I am sorry if I made it seem like that with one simple off the wall comment, but human sexuality was not what I was wondering about in this discussion.
If humans are happy with homosexuality, that's great, and I whish them all the happiness truly.
 
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ColoradoGuy

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bloemmarc said:
Look I did think they were far out ideas because animal behavior is different than humans.
Why are you surprised to find that behavior as basic to our inner being as sexuality spans the entire animal kingdom? Most of biology shows extraordinary conservation of genetic energy. Why would sexuality be any different from that?
 
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