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Samuel Dark
08-30-2006, 08:22 PM
Ok, I have been playing a game over at Ted Dekker's forum, andf it has been a huge success. I would now like to bring this game over here:

The game is this: You must challenege someone, anyone who posts here in this topic, by giving them a plot and at least three characters. You must tell then the POV, as well. The reason for this is to give writers something new to write. If someone usually writes action, give them a action plot with love intangeled in the story, and so on. Same with POV -- sometimes we stay with one POV and yet another one works better for a different story.


You can challenge me, but understand I am a full time student in college all ready working on a challenege, so it may be a while for me to get to yours.

if you are challenged, you must do it -- but we will not make you. How do you win? By learning something new. This is for your gain, not ours, so do what you must to learn something new.

And let the games begin.

(it helps to subscribe to this topic, because ppl seem to post a lot and having 20 pages to surf through is a LOT...so yea.)

persiphone_hellecat
08-30-2006, 11:40 PM
No thanks nothing personal against you but I despise Ted Dekker. You can tell him I'm the one who trashed him at B and N.com for House. When he learns to write complete sentences, instead of stupid pathetic fragments, MAYBE I'll read one of his books again. However, I seriously doubt it. I read House, then returned it and got my money back. The most pathetic, worst book I ever read in my entire life. I shudder at the name Ted Dekker and I on general principles I won't play any game that sham author made up. Sorry. Perhaps others will, but I have no interest in anything to do with Ted Dekker. Sorry.

Samuel Dark
08-31-2006, 02:03 AM
No thanks nothing personal against you but I despise Ted Dekker. You can tell him I'm the one who trashed him at B and N.com for House. When he learns to write complete sentences, instead of stupid pathetic fragments, MAYBE I'll read one of his books again. However, I seriously doubt it. I read House, then returned it and got my money back. The most pathetic, worst book I ever read in my entire life. I shudder at the name Ted Dekker and I on general principles I won't play any game that sham author made up. Sorry. Perhaps others will, but I have no interest in anything to do with Ted Dekker. Sorry.


Fine. Hate Ted Dekker all you want, but this is a GAME. I just stated I started this at Ted Dekker's web site, but I have been doing this with a friend for a while -- way before I started it at Ted Dekker's site. And if you don't want to play this game, then don't post. Notice that it says if you post you agree to play -- but since you obsvasly can't read past the words Ted Dekker, then I'll assume you don't want to play.

And honestly, if you guys are nothing but people who bash people and authors, who don't enjoy learning and getting better, I will happily leave and never come back. But so far, thats all you guys can do. Sorry to the people who aren't like that -- but to the ones who aren't -- stop the judgmental attitude and start having fun. Thats what this forum is for, right? To learn about writing? To get better at the craft? To share your work, and to have a good time?

AND for the record, if you haven't figured it out yet, I came up with this game and I MADE IT and I POSTED it at Ted Dekker's site, why? Because those writers there are some of the best I know, and all of them enjoy writing just because. You guys? Some of you, I don't really know. I think you enjoy pissing people off then you do writing.

persiphone_hellecat
08-31-2006, 02:18 AM
There is a huge difference between bashing and criticizing an author. When you put your work out for the public to read, you put yourself in a position to be either loved or hated. I personally find Ted Dekker to be among the worst authors I have ever read - if not the worst. What truly irked me was that someone kept complaining to Amazon and getting all the negative reviews for House deleted. I posted mine about four times.

I am hardly a rotten apple. Nor as far as I have seen, is anyone else around here. I have found the people here to be creative, fun, pleasant, and we have shared many enjoyable times - both openly and in private messages. I dont enjoy pissing people off unless you count criticizing Ted Dekker as pissing someone off. Otherwise, I exist here quite harmonously, racking up some lovely rep points.

Ted Dekker couldnt write his way out of a wet paper bag. Typical example.

She walked down the corridor. Turned left. Opened the door. Looked inside.

WTF is THAT? Who on earth edited that? House was like a bad version of Deliverance only without the soo-ey parts. It stunk. I read it, and I have the right to say so. If Mr. Dekker doesnt like criticism, he shouldnt publish. The book was CRAP and the promised "ending that would knock your socks off" or whatever it was promised to be was something the average reader knew on page 2.

If I am a rotten apple for criticizing Mr. Dekker, then so be it. Yes, this forum is for learning about writing and getting better at the craft. So why don't you invite Mr. Dekker over here so he can learn how to write complete sentences? There is nothing I can learn from Mr. Dekker. If I want to learn from authors, I shall read Cervantes or Dickens or F. Scott Fitzgerald -- authors whose works have stood the test of time. One week on the best seller list does not a good novel make, believe me.

Also please understand that some authors are reluctant to write too much of in the way of stories here because there are many lurkers and they fear being plagerized. I personlly don't have that problem, but many I have talked to do. They kind of prefer the fast paced three word posts than putting effort into writing the beginning of a story that just may end up somewhere else. Believe me, it has happened to me on other boards. And it didnt make me happy.

I hope you stay and enjoy WEPG, I don't run the show around here, and I'm sure you will find others who are interested, but anything associated with Ted Dekker makes me ill. Not bashing, just honest literary critique from someone who has every right to critique his work. Feel free to have Ted drop me a line. I would tell him the same thing. Persi

Samuel Dark
08-31-2006, 02:48 AM
There is a huge difference between bashing and criticizing an author. When you put your work out for the public to read, you put yourself in a position to be either loved or hated. I personally find Ted Dekker to be among the worst authors I have ever read - if not the worst. What truly irked me was that someone kept complaining to Amazon and getting all the negative reviews for House deleted. I posted mine about four times.

I am hardly a rotten apple. Nor as far as I have seen, is anyone else around here. I have found the people here to be creative, fun, pleasant, and we have shared many enjoyable times - both openly and in private messages. I dont enjoy pissing people off unless you count criticizing Ted Dekker as pissing someone off. Otherwise, I exist here quite harmonously, racking up some lovely rep points.

Ted Dekker couldnt write his way out of a wet paper bag. Typical example.

She walked down the corridor. Turned left. Opened the door. Looked inside.

WTF is THAT? Who on earth edited that? House was like a bad version of Deliverance only without the soo-ey parts. It stunk. I read it, and I have the right to say so. If Mr. Dekker doesnt like criticism, he shouldnt publish. The book was CRAP and the promised "ending that would knock your socks off" or whatever it was promised to be was something the average reader knew on page 2.

If I am a rotten apple for criticizing Mr. Dekker, then so be it. Yes, this forum is for learning about writing and getting better at the craft. So why don't you invite Mr. Dekker over here so he can learn how to write complete sentences? There is nothing I can learn from Mr. Dekker. If I want to learn from authors, I shall read Cervantes or Dickens or F. Scott Fitzgerald -- authors whose works have stood the test of time. One week on the best seller list does not a good novel make, believe me.

Also please understand that some authors are reluctant to write too much of in the way of stories here because there are many lurkers and they fear being plagerized. I personlly don't have that problem, but many I have talked to do. They kind of prefer the fast paced three word posts than putting effort into writing the beginning of a story that just may end up somewhere else. Believe me, it has happened to me on other boards. And it didnt make me happy.

I hope you stay and enjoy WEPG, I don't run the show around here, and I'm sure you will find others who are interested, but anything associated with Ted Dekker makes me ill. Not bashing, just honest literary critique from someone who has every right to critique his work. Feel free to have Ted drop me a line. I would tell him the same thing. Persi


First off, what is the topic of this forum? Please, inform me -- the author of it -- because I honestly have forgotten. I came in here, and saw something about Ted Dekker being the worst author ever? Hmm, I then read the topic -- The Writing Game?

Sorry, but it annoys me when people post off topic. I have been hunded by it so many times at other forums that I no longer do it nor do I enjoy other doing so. But, if it's allowed here, so be it. I am not a mod nor a owner of this site. So, what does it matter?

Second off, you as being a bad apple wasn't meant the way it came out -- I am sorry for that. Its just I have posted four topics, and half of them people went way off topic. And once again, it happened. So, I refrain from saying that and it will be edited out of my post soon enough.

Third off, since we have all ready gotten off topic, I'll answer a few of those questions.

"She walked down the corridor. Turned left. Opened the door. Looked inside."

Honestly, I like that. It has a nice effect, and in my english class I actually learned that sometimes thats a good effect. But, if you don't like it, fine. It's called opinion, and everyone has a different one.

Lastly, Ted Dekker actually doesn't care what you say -- he has an article called Thick Skin -- which talks about how authors should be ready for people calling your work crap. Stephen King -- I am sure -- has heard such things, does it make him a crappy author? And Dean Koontz -- I know many to call him one of the worst authors of all time -- does that make him so? No. I enjoy both Stephen King and Dean Koontz. Why? Good stories. King annoys me from time to time, and Dean Koontz can get too weird and doesn't always hit the nail down when it comes to story -- but both authors I own and will continue to buy their books.

Now I swear, this will be the last time I post off time. God, please, allow this to be the last time...

Anyway, sorry once again, and sorry for being a hypocrite, but I had to in this case. At any rate, I am sorry.

Silver King
08-31-2006, 03:28 AM
Thanks for warning us away from Ted Drekker, Persi. You saved me just in time...

Samuel, I'm having a hard time understanding exactly how this game should be played. What little I can make out suggests the exercise seems like an awful lot of work.

Maybe you can offer a better explanation of how it's played, or even post an example so we can see the game in motion.

Samuel Dark
08-31-2006, 03:56 AM
Thanks for warning us away from Ted Drekker, Persi. You saved me just in time...

Samuel, I'm having a hard time understanding exactly how this game should be played. What little I can make out suggests the exercise seems like an awful lot of work.

Maybe you can offer a better explanation of how it's played, or even post an example so we can see the game in motion.

Sure :-D. Here is one I am currently working on:

Hmm. I'll try. Interesting. I already got the killer's name and personality and everything... Hehe... I like this game.


For you Straith:

Plot: In the Nevada desert a psychopathic killer holds his game: He stands in the center of a large city, then unleashes a virus he bought on the black market two days before. The city is wiped out. The killer is found dead, his body given to the police, then he turns up again very alive. Only now he holds a new game where the police must kill themselves to win.

That's the best I could come up with on the top of my head. Do what you want, conclude it how you want. It can be as short as you want, but not under a page. Have fun.

And here is what I have (so far):


Prologue:

As it seems, death is always one step away. I stand here and I see people. People with shoes, people with boats, people with high heels. All from different ethnic groups, all different religions. I have even seen a priest, apparently late for something. Oh, yes, it is Sunday morning -- I guess he’s late for mass. How queer, a priest late for mass. Guess it happens, though, considering I am a witness to such an event. These people, although on the outside seem to be very different from one to another, have one thing in common: death. They don’t know, most haven’t even thought about it, but they all will die. Sooner the later, if I have anything to say about it.

Why do I talk about such gloomy topics, you ask yourself? Thats a very interesting question, and one I will answer with an action. What action? Well, as is such, as I was busy talking with you I let loose a virus that will destroy this place of beauty -- this city of many different cultures. I will show the world my powers of allusion, and they all will bow down before Master, if all goes according to plan. But it never does, in my experience.

And, in one week, you will see something interesting. Newspapers, all across the United States of America, crying about how a city was destroy by a terrorist. Which isn’t correct -- it was destroyed by a savior.

****

“It doesn’t make since. Why would the terrorist put himself in the city he is about to wipe out with a virus? And how can one create such a virus that will only go so far? It doesn’t add up. What is his motive?” Detective Cues screamed at his partner, Kelly Qu.

“I don’t know. All I know is, they have his body, even with a note which reads, “To all who survived my wrath: You are next.” He signed it, too. He calls himself The Servator, which in Latin means savior. This guy has a huge God complex going on...” Kelly Qu pauses for a second, the continues, “...Maybe he’s just looney and believed he would be able to rise himself from the dead.”

“I don’t like it. I don’t like it at all. Find all the information you can on this guy. As quickly as possible, too.” Detective Cues ordered.


****

END OF STORY FOR NOW

Feel free to critique my work here, though, for those who have seen my other posts. I don't really care right now, and a lot of what will be said just might help me out here.

Finally, this is how it might help you out. A know a lot of what people here would call "young writers". I mean, I was in high school, and a lot of people in high school are young -- including me. But, what I noticed is that they liked to stick with one POV and stick with one type of story. And what they don't understand is sometimes, a certain POV will make a story shine like a brand new car. Maybe mixing genre's will make the story your have more personality.

So it was a simple, fun way to help writers try something new. But, I didn't think about how some would be affraid of someone taking their work. Well, if that happens....its not your plot in the first place, just your writing. But, if such a thing happens, you can say "I do not accept" to any challenge, and only take ones from people you trust -- and PM/email the story to the challenger. That way it's not public knowledge, and your still playing the game.

Does that better explain the game?

persiphone_hellecat
08-31-2006, 06:21 AM
1) If you wish to have your work critiqued, this isnt the place for it. There are sections in this forum for critique.

2) Its ONLY your writing? You are kidding right?

3) Many of us work on very tight schedules. We have deadlines. We write daily. I keep this forum open in the corner of my screen and play as a diversion while I'm working. What you're asking is a LOT for people.

4) I have shown you respect. I have even shown Ted Dekker respect. I have said I despise the way he writes, however I have never once resorted to names or anything else. If he didnt care what people think of him, my review would still be at Amazon. Would you like to read it? Do you dare?? Christian horror is an oxymoron. I will restrain myself from taking the next logical step here. You are young. You say you are only in high school. Perhaps you arent familiar with better quality writing. If you are serious about writing and learning how to write, I strongly urge you to look to the classics and leave Ted Dekker alone. There is nothing for you to learn from his writing except how NOT to write. Learn how to write in complete sentences and thoughts. You will not learn that from Dekker or his pal Perretti or whoever he is. If you would like a reading list, Im sure many people here can recommend quality literature to you. I am interested - what are some of the other things you have read?

5) You are completely wrong about Dean Koontz. Koontz is actually quite good at working with a particular theme - in fact just about ALL of his books have the same theme = care to identify that theme for this old English teacher?

6) If your English teacher told you it was cool to write in sentence fragments, she is wrong. You have to learn the rules before you learn how to successfully break them. Do you know how to diagram sentences? Care to show this old English teacher who believes in zero tolerance grammar how to ?? Unfortunately, from what I have seen of high school English when these students arrive in college is that they are barely capable of writing complete sentences.

If you enjoy 400 pages of sentence fragments, read House. That's what it is. Not a complete sentence in the book. If you enjoy understanding the beauty of pure prose, read F Scott Fitzgerald or Edith Wharton or Toni Morrison or Alice Walker or Joseph Conrad ... I could go on and on ... Those are literature ... Dekker is schlock. Thin skin or thick skin, he's still crap.

Samuel Dark
08-31-2006, 09:03 AM
1) If you wish to have your work critiqued, this isnt the place for it. There are sections in this forum for critique.

2) Its ONLY your writing? You are kidding right?

3) Many of us work on very tight schedules. We have deadlines. We write daily. I keep this forum open in the corner of my screen and play as a diversion while I'm working. What you're asking is a LOT for people.

4) I have shown you respect. I have even shown Ted Dekker respect. I have said I despise the way he writes, however I have never once resorted to names or anything else. If he didnt care what people think of him, my review would still be at Amazon. Would you like to read it? Do you dare?? Christian horror is an oxymoron. I will restrain myself from taking the next logical step here. You are young. You say you are only in high school. Perhaps you arent familiar with better quality writing. If you are serious about writing and learning how to write, I strongly urge you to look to the classics and leave Ted Dekker alone. There is nothing for you to learn from his writing except how NOT to write. Learn how to write in complete sentences and thoughts. You will not learn that from Dekker or his pal Perretti or whoever he is. If you would like a reading list, Im sure many people here can recommend quality literature to you. I am interested - what are some of the other things you have read?

5) You are completely wrong about Dean Koontz. Koontz is actually quite good at working with a particular theme - in fact just about ALL of his books have the same theme = care to identify that theme for this old English teacher?

6) If your English teacher told you it was cool to write in sentence fragments, she is wrong. You have to learn the rules before you learn how to successfully break them. Do you know how to diagram sentences? Care to show this old English teacher who believes in zero tolerance grammar how to ?? Unfortunately, from what I have seen of high school English when these students arrive in college is that they are barely capable of writing complete sentences.

If you enjoy 400 pages of sentence fragments, read House. That's what it is. Not a complete sentence in the book. If you enjoy understanding the beauty of pure prose, read F Scott Fitzgerald or Edith Wharton or Toni Morrison or Alice Walker or Joseph Conrad ... I could go on and on ... Those are literature ... Dekker is schlock. Thin skin or thick skin, he's still crap.

Oh, God I broke my promise.

Sorry, I keep forgetting the rules here. Must forgive me. Second, it is only your writing, you didn't come up with the plot. The characters, their personality, what happens -- that all writing -- thats all you. And, about your busy scheduel -- I understand. What you see with my story I am writing for the challenege is what i just did -- but the challenege was made months ago. No worries, it's only a game. Not one you have to play, only one you might want to.

Thrid, I was reffering when I was in high school, which wasn't too long ago since I just starte college. And yes, actually, PM me that review. I would love to read it. I like reading people's opinions, even if I don't agree with them, because it is one more thing I learn about a person. Their views and how the structure their sentances, how they go about making me believe their beliefs -- it's all there. In that little piece of writing.

Second of all, Christian horror is actually good if you know how to do it. I, being a christian writer, love horror. Although, what most would call a christian writer isn't me -- my stories messages are often hard to see, but you will learn them. You just wont know it. They are small, and I like that. Keeps people reading.

And no, I am not wrong about Dean Koontz. I do love his work, in fact "Strangers" is just perhaps the best work I have read from him -- and I am on page 21. Thats the type of book I like. No, in the case of "The Husband" -- its A great premise, great story, but I hate all the dialague -- and considering my g/f read it and told me that happens a lot -- it annoys me. If one thing I hate is having too much dialogue. I hardly understood how it worked when I was little, and now I just don't like an entire half page of dialogue. And that happened in the first chapter. It's hard for even me to make myself to read it.

Stephen King, as some of you know, is long winded and likes his details. That can get annoying, and I believe his writing style to get rather boring. His best work, The Dark Tower series, is good only for one reason -- The Dark Tower itself. It's so..mysterious...I just can't give up on the story, no matter how much I want to, because I want to know why Roland is searching for it, I want to know what power it has, and mainly, I want to know how Roland plays his Ka-Tet (read the books if you want to know what I mean).

I also read Eragon, although thats hardly a good example of writing. I could give you a detailed review, but why? How can it help you personally? I like DragonLance, as well.

And Frank Peretti? I don't like him -- not at all. In fact, I knew when he was writing, and I knew I hated it. He reminds me of Stephen King, just King is WAY WAY WAY WAY WAY WAY better -- and considering I don't like King very much, I think you can plainly see how much I disslike Peretti. And I read House, I have it back at my home, and I will never let it go. Ted Dekker is my favorite author, mainly because I can't let his books down. DragonLance I can stop reading. In fact, I have. It gets boring. Stephen King's Dark Tower is also been put down. The only other author besides Ted Dekker that I can't put down the book -- unless I never actually got into it -- is Dean Koontz. (And my friend said he was a bad author, not me. He mad fun of me for readinf Frankinstein) But, please, give me some authors. I been slowly looking for new authors but every author I read I don't like.

I guess I am picky about what I read. I don't have the patience to sit down and read something I hate -- and considering I even have less time to read because of college and work I have even less patience to read crap. And a lot is crap to me, sorry. (Not saying my work isn't crap, I usually will consider anything I write crap after a few days of writing it.) But honestly, like my mom says, why should I read something I don't like? Why should I waste my money on something like that? I shouldn't.\

And I have read the classics. I like The Aeneid, love Dante and I hate Shakespear. I like Hommer. But, besides those three, I usually don't like the classics. They were made for their time and I want something from this time.

There is one other author -- he's british -- that I enjoy. I do not, however, remember his name. Oh well, not like it matters.

*breathes* I guess thats it...

(And you did give me a list...I just noticed that...oh well...)

JennaGlatzer
08-31-2006, 09:09 AM
Persi, back off on this-- complaining about Dekker's writing and Amazon reviews has nothing whatsoever to do with the topic at hand. Samuel made up this game, and mentioned that he first played it on another forum. That's all that's relevant. If you want to play, play. If not... enough.

Samuel Dark
08-31-2006, 07:08 PM
Persi, back off on this-- complaining about Dekker's writing and Amazon reviews has nothing whatsoever to do with the topic at hand. Samuel made up this game, and mentioned that he first played it on another forum. That's all that's relevant. If you want to play, play. If not... enough.

Thank you :-D