Writing Freak?

Writing

Well, your query letter is writing, too. A query letter must be written in a way that makes whoever read it want to see more. And it must make an agent smell money. Which isn't very helpful, I know.

Are you sending the first two to five pages of your manuscript along with the query? Sometimes this can make a real difference. Are you looking for agents who will accept a partial instead of a query? This, too, can make a real difference. If it doesn't, then the writing usually is to blame.

I don't know what to tell you, Pisarz. Keep swinging?

That sucks Pisarz. I don't know what to say other than keep trying or work on your new project and hope for better luck with that one.

Ah, there's the rub. You can write like a sonofafemaledog, but you can't get them with the query. Pain in the arse that it is, it's true that the query is also a sample of your writing. The hardest part, for sure.

I'd suggest trying those who accept a few pages, or a chapter or two along with -- if you send it (per their guidelines) they'll read them. Some advocate sending 5 pages along anyway . . . not sure about that, but the worst it'll get you is a rejection.

Hang in there! Maybe it's time to work story #2 and put #1 on the to-try-again-later list?

Pisarz said:

Just got rejection number who-knows-what, somewhere between 75 and 100.

My question has gone from "Will I ever get an agent and get published? " .

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there is a time for everything. it will come. keep at it.

I'll just chime in on the lead hook line, as I see it. Btw, keep your courage and spirit up. It's no bed of roses out there for sure. I have certainly been through what you describe.

When an ex-priest survives a shooting massacre at a church on Good Friday, his quiet life is overtaken by guilt, fear, and much to his own surprise, love.

This lead line is a bit incomprehensible. After a massacre, you explain three different emotions that I do not think are synonomous. For the life of me I can't understand the guilt factor, unless it is the "death guilt" phenomenon. I understand the fear part. But as an afterthought, you seem to throw in the love aspect. No biggie here, I'm just really confused as to how these opposing emotions can all tie in at once to the overall plot in equal shares. I think what I'm saying is that I would have fear and shock as the main contributing emotion in that first sentence, and leave it at that.

Worse yet, denying his faith to evade his would-be killer’s fury plunges Stefan into an abyss of tormented self-reflection. Why did he verbally disown the faith to which he once had pious devotion? Is his moral composition one of weakness or, as he’d always assumed, integrity? He always considered himself sensitive . . . but perhaps he’s actually quite aloof to the world around him. At least Stefan is sure of himself, of his identity, and of the line that divides reason from paranoia. Or is he?

Okay (decided to continue on), you start off strong with a massacre, but almost instantly go into a philosophical bent about his inner demons, when I would like to have known the hows and why of this tragedy, and how it affected him. I want to know more about who tried to kill him and why, and what this priest is going to do about it. What you have in this paragraph is character backstory, which should be in your book somewhere, preferably up front. You also give us a shopping list of his emotions and inner turmoils here, and ask the reader to decide which one he represents, which is confusing. All of this self-relection can be stated quite simply "He's confused", but I would go a step futher and say that he is terrorized about this event.

Stefan’s emotional turmoil, partly quelled when the Black Apostles are finally captured, is further challenged when he bonds with the vivacious Diana. She is passionate, honest, and the only person with whom Stefan can reveal his complicated struggle with guilt. Here is his opportunity to pursue love, but will he seize it? True, he feels an intense repressed affection for her. Learning the tragic turning point of Diana’s childhood—the suicide of her 13-year-old brother, who had suffered abuse at the hands of a priest—only amplifies this feeling. But his last relationship, the one for which he left the priesthood, didn’t work out so well. The choice between risk-taking and rejecting the unknown path of love stands before him. Little does he know that what he chooses and why will determine, once and for all, whether or not he can be redeemed of his guilt. And as for that enigmatic letter and the Black Apostles that Stefan had long ago dismissed, could it be that he relaxed his vigilance too soon?

(Okay, the black apostals are captured and Stephan is quelled. I'm still looking for the plot. What does Stephan do in this story besides survive a massacre, self-doubt himself, and find a lady love? You've put him on the stage but given him nothing to do, in this query)

Whoops, you next go into a love story! His association with this female partner should only garner a few sentences. I'm terribly intrigued with the Black Apostles--this is the setup--this is the plot--how is the priest involved with this diabolical agency--why isn't he actively trying to right this wrong--bring those to justice? Why can't he solve the riddle of this massacre, serving as the amateur detective? Now THERE, in my eyes in the real story. Show the real danger and conflict that Stefan is in when he confronts these sinister figures.

Also, I don't know what genre this is, since its not mentioned in your post here. If it's a mystery or thriller, then I would advise that your main points of the query concentrate on your priest and what he has to do to avoid being assasinated by this cult, or what he has to do to track them down and bring them to justice. That is the really interesting hook to this query. Unless the genre literary, which I suffer to comment on since I'm woefully inept with that genre and style.

I want to know the politics and inner motivation of the Black Apostles more, because that is what hooked me here. Explain what Stephan's major role in this story is--what real, exciting conflict must he overcome?

Now these are just my views, and I'm not really good at this type of critique. So wait for some other replies, and the best of hard work and luck to you. Don't give up.

Tri

Pisarz said:

For example, I just (five minutes ago) got an e-mail rejection to a snail mail query, in which the agent wrote: "Your novel sounds interesting and you sound like you're an intelligent writer." Sigh.

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I'd cling to that bit of praise and use it to motivate future revisions and submissions. You'll find the right fit eventually.

Pisarz said:

Thank you very much everyone, for your kind words and support. It is appreciated more than you know. A few encouraging words go a long way, they truly do. For example, I just (five minutes ago) got an e-mail rejection to a snail mail query, in which the agent wrote: "Your novel sounds interesting and you sound like you're an intelligent writer." Sigh.

To those of you who asked about sending in a few pages: I think three or four of my 75+ submissions have included a sample. My negative disposition has factored into this, because my (erroneous?) thinking at this point is that if I can't hook them on the query, they won't even bother to read the sample. Based on your collective suggestions, perhaps I should reconsider that line of thinking.

I'm posting the "summary" part of my query here. I won't post the whole letter, as I realize that belongs in the Query Critique forum. Right now I'm having doubst about the story itself, which must in some way be unmarketable. If the following screams bad writing or poor story idea, don't be shy in letting me know. I don't know if I'm having bad luck or if I'm so far out of my writing league (compared to "real" writers) that I should pick up my toys and go home. Reality check time.

When an ex-priest survives a shooting massacre at a church on Good Friday, his quiet life is overtaken by guilt, fear, and much to his own surprise, love.

TITLE XYZ is an 80,000-word novel that explores the existential predicament of Stefan, former priest and sole survivor of the tragedy. Framing his worldview is a fear of the remaining Black Apostles—the group responsible for the shooting—thanks to a mysterious letter in the mail. Worse yet, denying his faith to evade his would-be killer’s fury plunges Stefan into an abyss of tormented self-reflection. Why did he verbally disown the faith to which he once had pious devotion? Is his moral composition one of weakness or, as he’d always assumed, integrity? He always considered himself sensitive . . . but perhaps he’s actually quite aloof to the world around him. At least Stefan is sure of himself, of his identity, and of the line that divides reason from paranoia. Or is he?

Stefan’s emotional turmoil, partly quelled when the Black Apostles are finally captured, is further challenged when he bonds with the vivacious Diana. She is passionate, honest, and the only person with whom Stefan can reveal his complicated struggle with guilt. Here is his opportunity to pursue love, but will he seize it? True, he feels an intense repressed affection for her. Learning the tragic turning point of Diana’s childhood—the suicide of her 13-year-old brother, who had suffered abuse at the hands of a priest—only amplifies this feeling. But his last relationship, the one for which he left the priesthood, didn’t work out so well. The choice between risk-taking and rejecting the unknown path of love stands before him. Little does he know that what he chooses and why will determine, once and for all, whether or not he can be redeemed of his guilt. And as for that enigmatic letter and the Black Apostles that Stefan had long ago dismissed, could it be that he relaxed his vigilance too soon?

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To be blunt, your query/synopsis isn't very good. I was confused after the first two sentences. What is it about? There doesn't seem to be a story in there, just a jumble of emotions and things about Black Apostles?!?

I'd be tempted to just write down in sequence events that happen in the story and who they happen to.

The church is bombed. Priest is the only survivor. While trying to recover, he receives a letter. This scares him.

Then I'd use that to write a synopsis that actually shows there's a beginning, middle and end... and how events in the story relate to the characters...

Keep writing until the writing excites you and you know you have a genuine winner. You'll know it when you cant wait to show your work to everyone, and the responses will be wild exclamations of joy, grief, fear or whatever is appropriate for your book. There will be no "That's nice, dear" comments.

I hate typing responses that just say "what he/she said," but triceritops and Flapdoodle nailed my thoughts. I want to know more about the link between the priest and the Black Apostles. Why did the shooting massacre occur, and how is the priest connected? Who are the Black Apostles? What is the conflict between them and the priest? I see that as the main storyline and the love relationship as playing only a supporting role. What is Diana's inner conflict, and how does that relate to the priest's own conflict and the main storyline? Right now, the query sounds like a story where the priest is either navel-gazing or talking to Diana. I'd like to see what he DOES to confront the Black Apostles and how his inner demons make that difficult.

This is just my inexpert opinion, so take it for what it's worth. Keep plugging along. I think you have something here....

I agree with the others on what you need to show in your query. Right now it all seems so vague and flowery or something.

But for what it's worth, I think it sounds like it could be a great, marketable story. Don't give up on it.

Pisarz, your latest post grabbed me more than your draft query. Now I REALLY want to know what happens in your story. You may want to consider redrafting your query letter using your post as the starting point (just my uneducated suggestion).

Does the priest know or suspect that his student is a Black Apostle? If so, that could heap even more guilt on his shoulders (teacher blaming himself for student's failings).

Sometimes, a query facelift is just the medicine a constantly-rejected writer needs.

Hang in there, Pisarz. Your story definitely sounds interesting and I'm rooting for you to land a publisher with it!

My 2cents: The original query sounded forced and melodramatic with all the questions (Or is he? but will he seize it? Why did he...? Could it be...?) My initial reaction was don't know-don't care!
When you wrote to clarify the story, I was much more interested because you sounded professional and confident.

I agree with Meowgirl: consider redrafting your query letter using your post as the starting point. It was a great start and made a huge difference in how I responded to the idea!

Hey, I've had nothing at all to do with this thread, but it's moments like this that make me proud to be associated with AW. Good work, guys.

One other thought (and I've ranted about this before): Forgetting the query and the writing and all that, don't forget that it's a matter of timing as well. You may send out the query again next year and get five requests in a row. Publishing can be such a crap shoot. Pat Walsh discusses this in his book much more eloquently (A Million Reasons You Peons Won't Get Published--er, okay, that is so not the title but it's a great book).

So allow yourself some feelings of discouragement but if you have a story that will make money then it should find a home *if* you don't give up.

I just had a thought: if the priest is the main POV character, should he die in the end. In other words, who's told this story then?

Tri

Some advice I was given was to write the query blurb like the blurb on the back of the book. Short, in the tone of the piece, and without giving the whole plot away (this of course is not the same with the synopsis in which there should be no cliffhanger). So maybe you could read a few back covers and then, as a game, try to emulate the style and tone, and practice being concise. I dunno. Just an idea.

My main question re understanding the plot, is what is the motivation behind the Black Apostles? I don't know if anyone else is curious, but perhaps you could add a simple phrase, ". . . shot by the Black Apostles, a vigilante group who hate people who wear black . . . " Well you get the idea!

Pisarz said:

Wow! Thank you for the positive feedback! I'm very glad to learn that once I fully explained my premise, you found it interesting and worth a try. What a lift! Thanks for the inspiration--I will undoubtedly be revising the query accordingly. Wow. Maybe I will enjoy a similar positive response from future agents, too.

Thanks again. Nothing like a boot in the booty to get me moving.

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Just wanted to add my encouragement - sounds like you have a fascinating novel, one I'd love to read. Don't give up! Query writing is a pain in the butt, but if you attack it a step at a time, you'll get there.

I like the suggestion others have offered to start from your post explaining your story, then work from there to build the query. And take breaks when you need to as you work on this - I've found, in honing my own query, that stepping back occasionally for breathing room does wonders for renewing perspective and keeping enthusiasm high.

Best of luck, and I hope to read your published novel soon!

And one more suggestion: that name the Black Apostles is a little too simplistic for me. Let's you know right off the bat they are the bad guys. Who named them that, themselves? If they think they are righteous wouldn't they call themselves the Righteous Brothers or something similarly complimentary?