Multiple Submissions

Lauri B · Aug 4, 2006

Hi all,
Something came up here at Nomad fairly recently that is worth sharing with people submitting multiple manuscripts to multiple publishers. About 2 years ago I received a manuscript that was well written, but not right for our list, so I rejected it. Last year a manuscript came in that I started reading and realized I had already read and rejected (because it wasn't right for our list--see above). I emailed the author and told her that she had already submitted the manuscript to us a year earlier and that while it was still well written, it was still not right for our list.

Well, guess what? The manuscript came back again recently. I started reading it, realized it was the same one that had been here twice before, and threw it away.

I understand that oversights happen, and I have no problem with multiple submissions, but this illustrates the dangers of haphazardly recording where you are sending out your manuscript and what the response is. Obviously this author isn't paying careful-enough attention to the administrative aspects of submitting her manuscripts (either that, or she was assuming that the editorial staff at Nomad changes quickly). I recommend to anyone submitting manuscripts on a regular basis that they make a spreadsheet of where it has gone, to which publisher, the contact to which they sent it, the date it went out, and the date of notification of rejection (if it's accepted you won't need to send it out again!). It helps you stay on top of where all of your submissions are, and you'll avoid looking like a big idiot.

I mean it: If I see that manuscript here again I'm going to start a little bonfire in my office.

johnnysannie · Aug 4, 2006

The author's behavior is unprofessional and inexcusable. I keep careful and detailed records of all submissions and I double check before sending anything - of any length - anywhere to ensure that I am not sending something previously rejected.

If I were in your shoes, I doubt I would be as patient as you - my bonfire would have begun with the second submission of the same MS!

stephblake24 · Aug 4, 2006

Not to mention that this sort of negligence clogs up the slush pile and creates problems for people who are researching just the right editor or agent and following the rules.

People who do this are throwing a bunch of stuff at a wall just to see if anything sticks. Annoying.

BarbaraSheridan · Aug 6, 2006

What strikes me most is that this writer is still sending The Same Story out after two years and multiple rejections.

There comes a time when you need to set things aside and move on.

Kristen King · Aug 8, 2006

Oh, for pete's sake! If you've gotten it three times, I wonder how many other publishers have as well. ;]

Kristen

Kristen King · Aug 8, 2006

BarbaraSheridan said:
What strikes me most is that this writer is still sending The Same Story out after two years and multiple rejections.

There comes a time when you need to set things aside and move on.

True, but I don't think two years is nearly long enough for that. Maybe set it aside briefly and come back to it with fresh eyes, but not entirely. Thoughts?

Kristen

Kasey Mackenzie · Aug 8, 2006

If you're still getting multiple rejections after two years--and assuming you've made substantial revisions along the way--it's definitely time to set it aside and work on marketing other, newer works. That's not to say you can't come back to it later when you have sold other books and then revise it yet again based on everything you've learned. It's just to say that if you want to sell your work, you need to admit when something's just not currently marketable and move on. My own, unpublished opinion though. =)

Kristen King · Aug 8, 2006

Kasey Mackenzie said:
If you're still getting multiple rejections after two years--and assuming you've made substantial revisions along the way--it's definitely time to set it aside and work on marketing other, newer works. That's not to say you can't come back to it later when you have sold other books and then revise it yet again based on everything you've learned. It's just to say that if you want to sell your work, you need to admit when something's just not currently marketable and move on. My own, unpublished opinion though. =)

Kasey, if that IF is the case, I'm with you. However, Nomad pointed out that this particular manuscript was well written but not a good fit, so I'm guessing that the author just plain isn't doing his or her homework. In that case, yes, change the approach a bit, but I wouldn't set it aside on the merits of the writing. Follow?

Kristen

Jamesaritchie · Aug 10, 2006

Move on

BarbaraSheridan said:
What strikes me most is that this writer is still sending The Same Story out after two years and multiple rejections.

There comes a time when you need to set things aside and move on.

Only when you can't find another publisher in the world who will look at what you wrote. After ten years and a hundred publishers, maybe you can start to wonder. Until then follow Heinlein's advice and keep it on the market. "The Good Earth" was rejected by 70 publishers, and it doesn't hold the record.

Submitting novels to publishers is not all that difficult, and shouldn't eat up much time. If you quit after two meager years, you might as well not begin.

As for making substantial revisions along teh way, only if an agent or editor has asked you to do so. Otherwise, leave it the heck alone and keep sending it out. It does not harm at all to keep a manuscript on the market, and doesn't take much time or effort. And it's not like you can't write and submit other novels while the first one is making the rounds.

Keep writing other novels, but never, ever pull a manuscript from teh market until there's no place left to submit it. There's never a wise time to sit something aside.

aruna · Aug 10, 2006

Kasey Mackenzie said:
If you're still getting multiple rejections after two years--and assuming you've made substantial revisions along the way--it's definitely time to set it aside and work on marketing other, newer works. That's not to say you can't come back to it later when you have sold other books and then revise it yet again based on everything you've learned. It's just to say that if you want to sell your work, you need to admit when something's just not currently marketable and move on. My own, unpublished opinion though. =)

I agree with you. Last year I tried to sell a novel but I soon realised it was not the time for it. I put it aside and started another one - after nine months of effort.

I don't want to have several different types of mss out at the same time. If this newer one sells the others will as well.

Lauri B · Aug 10, 2006

I think in our particular case that the manuscript that we received three times IS publishable, but not by us, right now. I'm sure there are subject cycles in fiction (I don't know the market), but the subject cycles in nonfiction are very pronounced, and her book was on a subject that had already peaked.

Sesselja · Aug 10, 2006

stephblake24 said:
Not to mention that this sort of negligence clogs up the slush pile

But to look at it from a positive angle: with writers like that around, at least the real slush piles are not quite as massive as we think.

Valona · Aug 10, 2006

I'd like to jump in here with another idea. I've been trying to market my book for more than a couple of years now and I'm certainly not giving up. What I'm finding, however, is that I've gotten a lot of form rejection notices to my query letter, which means the agents and editors never got past my query. Perhaps, more work on our queries would be in order before giving up, as they are crucial to selling the book. Then, after an author has received a lot of requests for partials or the entire manuscript and is still getting rejected, perhaps it would be time to reconsider either the subject matter or the writing style, or some other kind of fatal flaw.

Lauri B · Aug 10, 2006

I think there is a huge difference between having a terrific query for fiction as opposed to nonfiction. I will read through a query and think about a book if it is appropriate to consider for our list, regardless of whether the query is funny or snappy or whatever. With that said, if the query is sloppily written, doesn't go into specific-enough detail, or is for a book that we wouldn't publish regardless of circumstances, then I'll reject it. I guess what I'm trying to say is that for nonfiction (for me), I'm pretty flexible on what I consider for a query, and it sounds like a lot of fiction publishers aren't.

Valona · Aug 10, 2006

Nomad said:
. . . it sounds like a lot of fiction publishers aren't.

That's what I'm getting at. I could probably write a good query for a non-fiction book. I write non-fiction, technical publications all the time, but a novel is a beast of another color, and agents and editors judge a writer's novel based on the prose style of the query. I don't think it's fair, but I can understand why they do it. They have to cut down their slush somehow.

Kristen King · Aug 10, 2006

Valona said:
I'd like to jump in here with another idea. I've been trying to market my book for more than a couple of years now and I'm certainly not giving up. What I'm finding, however, is that I've gotten a lot of form rejection notices to my query letter, which means the agents and editors never got past my query. Perhaps, more work on our queries would be in order before giving up, as they are crucial to selling the book. Then, after an author has received a lot of requests for partials or the entire manuscript and is still getting rejected, perhaps it would be time to reconsider either the subject matter or the writing style, or some other kind of fatal flaw.

I think this is an excellent point, and I completely agree. I'm working with an author right now whose book is really outstanding. Honest, it's awesome. She's queried more than 50 agents, and no one has so much as requested a partial. I don't know yet who she's been querying, nor have I seen her letter, but I suggested that she get some feedback here in the Query Letter Critique board, and I'm really hoping that she does it. It would be a real shame if a not-so-great letter kept a really great book from getting published, or even seen at all. Granted, this point is a departure from the original point of the thread, but it's a good one, and one I think is worth talking about. Maybe we should start a new thread?

Kristen

dantem42 · Aug 11, 2006

Kristen King said:
I think this is an excellent point, and I completely agree. I'm working with an author right now whose book is really outstanding. Honest, it's awesome. She's queried more than 50 agents, and no one has so much as requested a partial. I don't know yet who she's been querying, nor have I seen her letter, but I suggested that she get some feedback here in the Query Letter Critique board, and I'm really hoping that she does it. It would be a real shame if a not-so-great letter kept a really great book from getting published, or even seen at all. Granted, this point is a departure from the original point of the thread, but it's a good one, and one I think is worth talking about. Maybe we should start a new thread?

Kristen

Fifty queries without even a request for partial is definitely not a good sign.

But the reasons may be more complex than the issue of the query letter. Assuming in the case of fiction that a lot of the query packages include a query letter, a brief synopsis, and some sample pages, most of the better agents will do a quick run through the material unless the query letter is just abysmal (multiple misspellings, "their" instead of "there" etc.). They are aware that some people may be great writers, but second rate on the type of "pitch" involved in a query letter.

There may be other issues at work here. The manuscript may be of a type that's good, but very difficult to sell. Or it may be topically like fifty other things out there. In the case of genre fiction, it may be very difficult for the agent and the editor to figure out where it "fits" because it crosses multiple genres or it doesn't follow the traditional rules that exist for each genre. On and on.

Even if the query isn't at the top of the mark, at least in the case of fiction, if the synopsis bangs out a compelling, original plot line and interesting character ideas, and the first five or ten pages draw in the reader, then you'll get requests for partials and manuscripts. So you should be looking at the entire package, not just the letter.

One agent told me that the first ten or fifteen pages of your manuscript should be the best writing you've ever done. They are also "make or break" in the fiction area in terms of getting responses to queries.

Kristen King · Aug 12, 2006

In her case, my understanding is that it has been only queries that she's sent. I'm honestly not sure, though. I'll generalize and pass along your observations, along with others I've received on this situation. Thank you for your comments!

Kristen

PS Or maybe she's just targeting way wrong agents.

Multiple Submissions

Lauri B

I Heart Mac

johnnysannie

stephblake24

BarbaraSheridan

insert catchy phrase here

Kristen King

Kristen King

Kasey Mackenzie

One Hit Wonder?

Kristen King

Jamesaritchie

aruna

On a wing and a prayer

Lauri B

I Heart Mac

Sesselja

Valona

Lauri B

I Heart Mac

Valona

Kristen King

dantem42

Kristen King

Multiple Submissions

I Heart Mac

*insert catchy phrase here*

One Hit Wonder?

On a wing and a prayer

I Heart Mac

Sesselja

I Heart Mac

insert catchy phrase here