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View Full Version : Australian Crime Scenes Analysis vs American Crime Scenes.



meg_b
02-09-2018, 06:08 AM
Hi, I am currently researching for a series I'm writing based on an Australian detective who investigates a series of murders in a Queensland city. I've found some amazing information on American crime scene analysis and autopsies, but there isn't a huge amount of information on Australian processes. I have heard the Australia's legal system is very different from America's, but I'm not so much focused on the outcome of the eventual arrest in the book, but rather the detective figuring out who the serial killer is. I've been trying to find a police officer in my local area to help me, but to no avail. I'm wondering if anyone has any experience with Australian crime scenes and whether they are very similar to the way American scenes are processed? Or if you know a great resource, I'd really appreciate it! Thank you!

ironmikezero
02-09-2018, 09:24 PM
Don't overthink it . . . the science involved is the same. There will be some procedural differences based upon differing rules of evidence, but the underlying science is shared globally.

ajaye
02-10-2018, 12:08 AM
This might be of some help? https://www.police.qld.gov.au/corporatedocs/OperationalPolicies/Documents/OPM/Chapter2.pdf

WeaselFire
02-10-2018, 01:26 AM
Don't they do everything upside down there? :)

Yeah, the evidence processes and rules may differ, but the CSI stuff is pretty much the same. Some changes with not having the US Constitution's Bill of Rights, but not a vast difference in law.

Jeff

blacbird
02-10-2018, 09:15 AM
(never mind; weasel beat me to it)

caw

meg_b
02-11-2018, 09:43 AM
This might be of some help? https://www.police.qld.gov.au/corporatedocs/OperationalPolicies/Documents/OPM/Chapter2.pdf


This is absolutely perfect!! Thank you so much!! This means the world to me!

- - - Updated - - -

And thank you to everyone for your advice!! I really appreciate it!

ajaye
02-11-2018, 02:33 PM
This is absolutely perfect!! Thank you so much!! This means the world to me!

:Thumbs:

Norman Mjadwesch
03-21-2018, 08:16 AM
I live in the next state down from you and though I am not a copper I have had dealings with them from time to time. In my experience, their procedures are not at all similar to any of the crime programs on the TV!

e.g. 1: A lad I once taught was mugged at the local show by a gang of thugs who were actually known to the police for all of the wrong reasons. They beat him up in a toilet block and stole his phone and wallet. It was reported straight away and the lads were caught within minutes. Result: wallet returned but not the phone. Unbelievably, the police were unable to think of a way to determine ownership of the phone, such as something as simple as asking for a list of contacts in the phone’s menu (or ringing from the phone and asking the person who answered it to provide the name of the caller - anything!).

e.g.2: A long time ago someone fired shots at my house from the road (I live in a rural area, that sort of thing used to happen around here all of the time) and I rang the police. They advised me that they were unable to do anything if I did not give them the vehicle’s registration plate. I asked if that required me to walk down my driveway directly into the gunfire to get the piece of information that they needed. Response? “Err, umm… maybe on second thoughts that might not be a good idea.”

e.g.3: My neighbour died last year (he was only in his forties). He had been ill for a long time and was in a dispute with someone who was trying to steal his girlfriend (not sure what her views were in this regard). He was found dead in his bed (no wounds or anything like that) when no one had seen him for a week and reported him missing, and then his g/f died a couple of weeks later; the “interested party” skipped town and has not been seen since. Because my neighbour had a pre-existing medical condition, there were “no suspicious circumstances that warranted investigation.”

That’s only three examples - I have heaps more, they just don’t care and never have! I can only suggest to you that however you want your book to pan out, if the crime gets solved it might just possibly be despite the efforts of the constabulary. Or maybe the Qld crew have a better ethic than their NSW brothers? (Rodney Rude certainly didn’t think so.)

Helix
03-21-2018, 09:05 AM
I live in the next state down from you and though I am not a copper I have had dealings with them from time to time. In my experience, their procedures are not at all similar to any of the crime programs on the TV!

e.g. 1: A lad I once taught was mugged at the local show by a gang of thugs who were actually known to the police for all of the wrong reasons. They beat him up in a toilet block and stole his phone and wallet. It was reported straight away and the lads were caught within minutes. Result: wallet returned but not the phone. Unbelievably, the police were unable to think of a way to determine ownership of the phone, such as something as simple as asking for a list of contacts in the phone’s menu (or ringing from the phone and asking the person who answered it to provide the name of the caller - anything!).

e.g.2: A long time ago someone fired shots at my house from the road (I live in a rural area, that sort of thing used to happen around here all of the time) and I rang the police. They advised me that they were unable to do anything if I did not give them the vehicle’s registration plate. I asked if that required me to walk down my driveway directly into the gunfire to get the piece of information that they needed. Response? “Err, umm… maybe on second thoughts that might not be a good idea.”

e.g.3: My neighbour died last year (he was only in his forties). He had been ill for a long time and was in a dispute with someone who was trying to steal his girlfriend (not sure what her views were in this regard). He was found dead in his bed (no wounds or anything like that) when no one had seen him for a week and reported him missing, and then his g/f died a couple of weeks later; the “interested party” skipped town and has not been seen since. Because my neighbour had a pre-existing medical condition, there were “no suspicious circumstances that warranted investigation.”

That’s only three examples - I have heaps more, they just don’t care and never have! I can only suggest to you that however you want your book to pan out, if the crime gets solved it might just possibly be despite the efforts of the constabulary. Or maybe the Qld crew have a better ethic than their NSW brothers? (Rodney Rude certainly didn’t think so.)


The OP's asking about detectives, not uniformed plod. There's a small number of detectives in the regions, but if it's a major crime they'll usually hand over to specialist Ds from Brisbane.

Not sure about NSW, but in Queensland there are women in the police service too.

Norman Mjadwesch
03-21-2018, 03:03 PM
The OP's asking about detectives, not uniformed plod. There's a small number of detectives in the regions, but if it's a major crime they'll usually hand over to specialist Ds from Brisbane.

Not sure about NSW, but in Queensland there are women in the police service too.

Hello Helix,

Yep we have female police officers down here as well, it's just that my examples applied to the male ones I know about. What you say is true regarding the availability of detectives in each area, but it raises two points:

1. They are sourced from the same pool that their less motivated colleagues come from, which is not to say that they are made in the same way but if enough of the garden variety are too lazy then are selection standards lowered in order to fill vacancies that occur or do more Ds just have to shoulder a greater workload? (I am only speculating here - I knew a Det Sr Const a long time ago and he was OK, but then again he was my friend so I would say that, hey?)

2. Regardless of the qualifications of individual detectives, surely their job is more difficult to perform if the first responders to call-outs are failing to take down basic information, e.g. witness statements and so forth. Surely that would be compounded if they simply file a report (or not!) and fail to inform a higher authority? Again, not being part of the set-up I am not sure what police procedure is when it comes to prioritising action, though local anecdotal evidence (i.e. hearsay) seems to paint a pretty poor picture of our mob. Can so many opinions be wrong? Maybe!

Either way, at least I hope it gives meg_b heaps of food for thought for some plot development.

Are there any police looking at this thread? They would probably be a more reliable source of information than the rest of us. They could also show everyone how much of a goose I am!

WeaselFire
03-24-2018, 07:32 AM
2. Regardless of the qualifications of individual detectives, surely their job is more difficult to perform if the first responders to call-outs are failing to take down basic information, e.g. witness statements and so forth. Surely that would be compounded if they simply file a report (or not!) and fail to inform a higher authority? Again, not being part of the set-up I am not sure what police procedure is when it comes to prioritising action, though local anecdotal evidence (i.e. hearsay) seems to paint a pretty poor picture of our mob. Can so many opinions be wrong? Maybe!

First on scene secures the scene and takes names and contact info. Detectives use the con tact info if the witnesses are no longer on scene and any beat cop is trained to preserve and document evidence, as well as keep a log of all who enter or leave the scene.

No report is ever written and filed away. Every single one is reviewed, forwarded to appropriate personnel and acted on. Period. This is for virtually any police force in the western world, some in the Far East and Middle East act differently, but not much.

Are there bad actors? Sure. About the same percentage as the population as a whole. If 80% of the population is committing crimes, then 80% of the police force is as well. Australia runs less than 3%. Life ain't like the movies.

Jeff

Norman Mjadwesch
03-29-2018, 05:12 PM
[QUOTE=If 80% of the population is committing crimes, then 80% of the police force is as well. Australia runs less than 3%. Life ain't like the movies.

Jeff[/QUOTE]

Duly noted. I prefer stats to opinions every time!

I haven't been avoided everyone, but my leg blew up like a balloon a week ago and I've been looking at my computer from across the room, all alone and unable to connect to the world...