An announcement to anyone who hires contractors

badducky · May 4, 2006

If the contractor cuts corners by hiring illegal aliens, they're probably going to cut corners elsewhere, too.

rtilryarms · May 4, 2006

Thank goodness my contractor has all legal workers. now i am assured that he won't cut corners. [/sarcasm]

English Dave · May 4, 2006

Thank goodness my contractor hires illegals who work harder and better than the local dipsh1ts.

Jcomp · May 4, 2006

Thank goodness my contractor.... wait a minute, I don't have a contractor. Nevermind "goodness," I retract my thank you.

badducky · May 4, 2006

rtilryarms said:
Thank goodness my contractor has all legal workers. now i am assured that he won't cut corners. [/sarcasm]

I'm just saying, if you have visible evidence of corners being cut over a few dollars from the moment the contracotr walks through the door, it's just not a good sign...

English Dave · May 4, 2006

If you don't have common sense then that's not a good sign either?

Shadow_Ferret · May 4, 2006

badducky said:
I'm just saying, if you have visible evidence of corners being cut over a few dollars from the moment the contracotr walks through the door, it's just not a good sign...

Couldn't you also assume that because he's saving a few dollars on illegal help that he can then spend MORE on the quality of the materials?

jenngreenleaf · May 4, 2006

. . . or put more hours into the project . . .

maestrowork · May 4, 2006

If your contractor hires illegals, they've broken the law and you should report them.

English Dave · May 4, 2006

maestrowork said:
If your contractor hires illegals, they've broken the law and you should report them.

Okay, I'll do that.

badducky · May 4, 2006

My brother's an electrician, and a general contractor for a Fortune 500 company that often competes with contractors who hire illegal aliens.

Here's how it usually goes.

Client takes bids on a job. My brother as part of his Fortune 500 company makes a bid on the job. Fortune 500 company loses bid to Bubba Ray's Super-Duper Construction Company (motto painted onto the beat-up trucks? "Git 'r Done"). Bubba Ray wires the place so dangerously, that the architect and/or building inspector refuse to allow humans to set foot in the building. Fortune 500 company has to charge Client to clean up Bubba Ray's mess, and the client should have just gone with Fortune 500, or the equivalant, in the first place.

Worse then that is when the Billy Joe Bob Construction firm doesn't get caught using the wrong wires, and wire the building irresponsibly as if the place was meant to be burned down. The service contract usually eventually goes to the Fortune 500 company, or some other legitimate operation. The client ends up paying out the nose to tear open the whole building and get the building up to basic code before it burns down in an orgy of cheap materials and rushed craftsmanship.

This is, of course, commercial construction, not residential. The same things happen on a smaller scale at the local level.

Bear in mind, many who choose to use illegals do so in the understanding that illegals will work however long the boss needs with limited overtime to get the desired project finished in a desired window of time.

I don't know about you, but my concentration lags after four hours with no breaks. After twelve hours, my craftsmanship does seriously decline in quality.

English Dave · May 4, 2006

And Bubba Ray doesn't get hired again? Have a bit more faith in the Capatalist system. Isn't that what America is founded in?

maestrowork · May 4, 2006

badducky said:
Bear in mind, many who choose to use illegals do so in the understanding that illegals will work however long the boss needs with limited overtime to get the desired project finished in a desired window of time.

The whole thing is just wrong on so many levels. We are too blame with our illegal immigrant problems.

badducky · May 4, 2006

Bubba Ray usually changes the color of his trucks, and slips over to a new part of town when cut corners catch up to him.

English Dave · May 4, 2006

I don't get ripped off very often. The few times I have it is because I let some fat lazy d1psh1t talk a good game.

If I could swap 5 million of our deadbeat, world owes me a living layabouts for 5 million 'I want to work and make a go of things and provide a decent living for my family' immigrants, I do it in a heartbeat.

badducky · May 4, 2006

So, you'd rather let these hard-working do-or-die types get taken advantage of by greedy slave-drivers?

They're not the ones ordering your materials. They're not the ones outlining the project, and choosing the priorities.

They're not the ones I'm talking about.

English Dave · May 4, 2006

badducky said:
So, you'd rather let these hard-working do-or-die types get taken advantage of by greedy slave-drivers?

.

Hard working do or die types get on in the world. I value that. Greedy slave drivers, well.... doesn't matter where you come from you'll come up against those types. The only people I've ever been ripped off by are my own countrymen.

The West is getting complacent, lying back and thinking the Governments will take care of us. Where is that pioneer spirit? Where is that feeling that a person is as good as what they contribute emotionally, physically or economically?

I pay for a good job well done. I don't care who does it. But I make sure I know the job will be well done before I contract. Common sense my friend.

Shadow_Ferret · May 4, 2006

If I'm hiring a contractor, who he hires is that last thing I'm concerned about.

I'm concerned with his quality of work, his reputation in the community. I'll check with the BBB to see if there's any complaints against him.

I'm certainly not going to be asking for green cards. I don't care at that point.

Anyway, a Fortune 500 company wouldn't be getting my business anyway.

badducky · May 4, 2006

English Dave said:
The West is getting complacent, lying back and thinking the Governments will take care of us. Where is that pioneer spirit? Where is that feeling that a person is as good as what they contribute emotionally, physically or economically?

You know, I can really tell you're from Europe with that grand statement about "the West".

France and Finland, maybe. Definitely not Tejas. Louisiana, maybe. Definitely not the Dakotas.

And shadow, I'd suggest asking for green cards, too. If he's hiring illegals, he should be reported to the BBB.

English Dave · May 4, 2006

badducky said:
You know, I can really tell you're from Europe with that grand statement about "the West".

.

Ummmmm isn't Europe part of the West?

Maybe not, cowboy.

Lol.

Green cards can be bought for $200. Don't put your faith in them.

badducky · May 4, 2006

$200 is a lot of money when you make 7 bucks an hour, and don't get overtime pay.

English Dave · May 4, 2006

badducky said:
$200 is a lot of money when you make 7 bucks an hour, and don't get overtime pay.

Doh!

Chinese gang masters charge upwards of $20,000 a time to smuggle people into the West.

It's a complicated scenario. Capitalism versus Socialism. Socialism only works if Capitalists are willing to play ball. In general Capitialsts are sceptical about whether that will turn a profit.

What's a girl to do?

robeiae · May 4, 2006

badducky said:
My brother's an electrician, and a general contractor for a Fortune 500 company that often competes with contractors who hire illegal aliens.

I hope you're not talking about a construction company headquartered in Miami, Fla.

I'd rather have Billy Joe Bob do the work than a company that didn't bother to attach roofs to houses (well, they used a handful of nails), as was discovered after Hurricane Andrew.

The way to find a good contractor is to get references, then actually check those references. For big jobs, make sure you can actually visit previous jobs and/or current ones. Also, I'd be more wary of a contractor who asks a question like "are you gonna want to get permits for this?" than one whose workers don't necassarily speak great English.

And frankly, asking for Green Cards is a sure fire way to piss off the guys doing the work, whether they are illegals or not, at least for residential jobs. In a commercial job, contractors are often working for people who are likely to give them more business, if they do well. Thus, the contractor is going to try and satisfy most reasonable requests. In a residential job, it's usually a one-shot deal (unless the contractor is closely allied with an architect who is responsible for the job). I'd much rather make friends with the workers, though I do recommend watching them work as much as possible.

Rob

maestrowork · May 4, 2006

robeiae said:
And frankly, asking for Green Cards is a sure fire way to piss off the guys doing the work, whether they are illegals or not, at least for residential jobs.

There's nothing to be pissed off about. You present your SS card or a green card, you get the job. Every employer I know ask for proof so they can fill in the I9 form -- it is a requirement anyway; it doesn't matter if it's a one-shot deal (I had enough one-shot acting jobs to know it's no big deal). What's there to be upset about? Especially in light of how many illegals are getting hired, I think every legal workers should be happy to oblige, so that the job doesn't go to illegals. Another problem with illegals is that you lose accountability, since you can't track them. What is to stop a guy from not doing his work, getting paid, then disappearing? There's a lot of liability for the contractor who hire illegal transients.

English Dave · May 4, 2006

maestrowork said:
There's nothing to be pissed off about. You present your SS card or a green card, you get the job. Every employer I know ask for proof so they can fill in the I9 form -- it is a requirement anyway; it doesn't matter if it's a one-shot deal (I had enough one-shot acting jobs to know it's no big deal). What's there to be upset about? .

Because real life is a little different?

An announcement to anyone who hires contractors

No Time For Chitchat, Kemosabe.

Crossbows and Handgonnes

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Court Jester

Here to network and learn.

Fear the Death Ray

No Time For Chitchat, Kemosabe.

Fear the Death Ray

No Time For Chitchat, Kemosabe.

No Time For Chitchat, Kemosabe.

Court Jester

No Time For Chitchat, Kemosabe.

No Time For Chitchat, Kemosabe.

Touch and go

Fear the Death Ray