Concentration Camp Escape

possiblerobot · Jan 19, 2017

This is a continuation of a thread I started here, and I'm trying another thread because the first thread was no longer getting any more replies and I had one last question. I'm trying to get my MC from the Natzweiler-Struthof concentration camp to Paris after escaping. I'm trying to get him to meet up with the Allies, so the escape would have to take place on or after August 20th 1944 or later. He would be on foot, which Google Maps says would take three and a half days. My question is, would this work?

Marlys · Jan 19, 2017

Is Google Maps assuming the person is walking nonstop for 3.5 days? If so, adjust time for sleep, for evading places where he's afraid he might be recaptured, for maybe sometimes avoiding roads and going through the woods instead. Also, if your MC just left a concentration camp, what kind of physical condition is he in? Take that into account when figuring how fast he can walk, and how long before he needs rest and food. How will he get food, by the way? How much time will it take to procure it? Is it safe to try to hitch a ride with vehicles on the road? Would he steal a bicycle? What about river travel? Does he hole up during the day and only move by night?

So, lots of variables to consider.

Helix · Jan 19, 2017

Google Maps says 85 hours, so, as Marlys says, that's going to be longer than 3.5 days in reality. That's a straight route and passes through towns.

possiblerobot · Jan 19, 2017

Marlys said:
Is Google Maps assuming the person is walking nonstop for 3.5 days? If so, adjust time for sleep, for evading places where he's afraid he might be recaptured, for maybe sometimes avoiding roads and going through the woods instead. Also, if your MC just left a concentration camp, what kind of physical condition is he in? Take that into account when figuring how fast he can walk, and how long before he needs rest and food. How will he get food, by the way? How much time will it take to procure it? Is it safe to try to hitch a ride with vehicles on the road? Would he steal a bicycle? What about river travel? Does he hole up during the day and only move by night?

So, lots of variables to consider.

My first post sounded like I was planning for it to actually take three days. I suppose I should have phrased the question more like "How much longer is it going to take him," but I suppose that's my fault. The way I'm planning it, the MC will be just out of a procedure that was intended to make him a sort of human weapon, so he would have been in better condition physically than most normal people, but fairly confused and disoriented, to say the least. He would also be of mixed race, and quite a large guy, so he would stick out a lot to anyone with Nazi sympathies. This takes out getting a ride, and will probably force him into moving more at night. These conditions would force him to forage for food, and maybe steal where he can. He may steal a bike from a farm he passes by if they have one. Anything I would need more info on?

Emermouse · Jan 19, 2017

Also, escapee might take into account that often the Nazis responded to an escaped prisoner, not only by going after them, but by punishing the other inmates for their escape. St. Maximillian Kolbe took the place of someone who was to be punished for an escape. He was imprisoned at Auschwitz and someone managed to escape, so the Nazis decided to pick ten inmates at random and sentence them to death by starvation, in order to be an example to the other inmates. Kolbe took the place of a man named Franciszek Gajowniczek, who had been in despair because he had a wife and children waiting for him on the outside.

I know it probably doesn't help much with the schematics of your character's escape, but I thought it might make an interesting dramatic angle if your escapee has to consider the fact that the Nazis probably proceeded to kill some of the other inmates as punishment for his escape.

possiblerobot · Jan 19, 2017

Emermouse said:
I know it probably doesn't help much with the schematics of your character's escape, but I thought it might make an interesting dramatic angle if your escapee has to consider the fact that the Nazis probably proceeded to kill some of the other inmates as punishment for his escape.

That would make things more interesting. Though I would have to think of a good way to integrate it.

possiblerobot · Jan 22, 2017

Question: would it be possible for him to come into contact with some of the members of the French Resistance? From what I've found, they stopped operating around the end of August, so would it be possible to run into a cell that was just closing up shop and heading back toward the Allied front?

WeaselFire · Jan 23, 2017

What do you need for the story? Faked or stolen papers and he could board a train and be there. Meet up with resistance or friendly locals and he'd have less trouble, on his own over land and out of sight he'd have a tougher time. If he's been in the camp some time, he could face medical or health issues impeding the journey. He may have to cross front lines near serious fighting or he might bypass it altogether.

Frankly, My first inclination would be to head to Switzerland.

Jeff

possiblerobot · Jan 23, 2017

WeaselFire said:
What do you need for the story? Faked or stolen papers and he could board a train and be there. Meet up with resistance or friendly locals and he'd have less trouble, on his own over land and out of sight he'd have a tougher time. If he's been in the camp some time, he could face medical or health issues impeding the journey. He may have to cross front lines near serious fighting or he might bypass it altogether.

Frankly, My first inclination would be to head to Switzerland.

Jeff

Well, I'm planning it going something like this: He escapes into the woods during the night, and evades the search party. When morning comes, the Gestapo begin broadcasting that he's an escaped prisoner. This is picked up by some Resistance fighters, who pick him up when he tries to steal some food from a farm they were operating in. They then have to shuttle him across land to try and get to the Allies before the search party gets to them.

Twick · Jan 23, 2017

If you can get him to the Resistance, then you can do research on escaping POWs, who probably had an easier time than concentration camp inmates, although they had the problem that most of them didn't speak the local language. A camp inmate could possibly pass for a local if they were cleaned up and given appropriate clothes and papers.

My father liked to tell the story of an acquaintance who was an escaping POW travelling through Holland, despite speaking neither Dutch or German. At one point, he was crossing a bridge, and spotted a German checkpoint on the other side. The only other person on the bridge was a young woman with a baby carriage. Without saying anything, he walked up to her and slipped his arm through hers. She talked them through the checkpoint without ever asking who he was or what he was trying to do. She knew.

possiblerobot · Jan 23, 2017

Twick said:
If you can get him to the Resistance, then you can do research on escaping POWs, who probably had an easier time than concentration camp inmates, although they had the problem that most of them didn't speak the local language. A camp inmate could possibly pass for a local if they were cleaned up and given appropriate clothes and papers.

It would take a bit more than clothes and papers to keep my MC under the radar. He's going to be of mixed race, and quite a big guy, so he would stick out in a crowd, especially a crowd of people under Nazi rule.

TravelHat · Jan 23, 2017

Hi

Read up on the Comet Line, an organized "underground railroad" for escaped POWs and downed airmen in France and Belgium. Although the route typically went from Belgium, through France and into Spain, you are probably late enough in your date where it is breaking up as Nazi forces are retreating east.

Good Luck

Also check out the following link of various organized escape routes used by the resistance. I think that trying to bring in the French Resistance into the picture is your best bet,
https://wwii-netherlands-escape-lin...es/map-of-major-escape-routes-through-france/

TravelHat · Jan 23, 2017

Also check out this article, it might give you some historical ideas of how many escaped from concentration camps. I know it isn't what you are planning, but ---

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...escaped-horrors-Nazi-concentration-camps.html

possiblerobot · Jan 23, 2017

TravelHat said:
Hi

Read up on the Comet Line, an organized "underground railroad" for escaped POWs and downed airmen in France and Belgium. Although the route typically went from Belgium, through France and into Spain, you are probably late enough in your date where it is breaking up as Nazi forces are retreating east.

Good Luck

Also check out the following link of various organized escape routes used by the resistance. I think that trying to bring in the French Resistance into the picture is your best bet,
https://wwii-netherlands-escape-lin...es/map-of-major-escape-routes-through-france/

This is gonna help loads, thanks.

possiblerobot · Jan 23, 2017

Now, next important question: what happens when he gets to the Allies?

WeaselFire · Jan 24, 2017

possiblerobot said:
Well, I'm planning it going something like this: He escapes into the woods during the night, and evades the search party. When morning comes, the Gestapo begin broadcasting that he's an escaped prisoner. This is picked up by some Resistance fighters, who pick him up when he tries to steal some food from a farm they were operating in. They then have to shuttle him across land to try and get to the Allies before the search party gets to them.

Then write it that way. Is the story about the journey or is that just a side track? If the story is not about the journey, then just start the next paragraph with "After the resistance dropped him off at Allied Headquarters..." If it's about the journey, write the journey as it unfolds and forget about trying to figure out time lines from modern computer mapping software.

Jeff

possiblerobot · Jan 24, 2017

WeaselFire said:
Then write it that way. Is the story about the journey or is that just a side track? If the story is not about the journey, then just start the next paragraph with "After the resistance dropped him off at Allied Headquarters..." If it's about the journey, write the journey as it unfolds and forget about trying to figure out time lines from modern computer mapping software.

Jeff

The story isn't entirely about the journey, but the journey is a big part of it. Right now, I'm looking for what would happen after meeting up with the Allies.

TravelHat · Jan 24, 2017

possiblerobot said:
Now, next important question: what happens when he gets to the Allies?

That my friend is up to you ...

We couldn't possibly answer that without a developed character and an understanding of why you are trying to have him meet up with the Allies. What are you expecting him to do?

If you haven't already, spend some time on character development .. what is his background (why would would the Allies bring on a civilian?) Does he have important skills (is he a solder, doctor, spy?)

I would also suggest you start with the ending of your story and work backwards. If you don't know where you are going in the end, I am not sure anybody can really help.

As for me, I am an extensive plotter, so I plot out the entire novel (scene by scene) before I begin writing in earnest. There are tons of good tools to help you do this.

Good Luck

possiblerobot · Jan 24, 2017

What I'm trying to ask here is, what would the procedure be for POW's and other people that get picked up by the Army? I'm specifically looking for the United States' procedure on this. The reason they would take him on is the information he has. He wouldn't be able to recall much of his personal information, but he would have been able to give them detailed info on what fortifications they could expect, and obviously the location of the concentration camp he was kept in and what they were doing there.

TravelHat · Jan 24, 2017

possiblerobot said:
What I'm trying to ask here is, what would the procedure be for POW's and other people that get picked up by the Army? I'm specifically looking for the United States' procedure on this. The reason they would take him on is the information he has. He wouldn't be able to recall much of his personal information, but he would have been able to give them detailed info on what fortifications they could expect, and obviously the location of the concentration camp he was kept in and what they were doing there.

I don't really know, but my assumption is that a concentration camp escapee would be sent to medical facilities and be treated. (probably needs much psychological help). If he really knows something, he would probably be "debriefed". However, I would sincerely doubt that the US Army would bring in an unknown into their ranks, no matter their skills or knowledge.

possiblerobot · Jan 24, 2017

I'm not sure if there's a misunderstanding between us, but I was never planning for my MC to join the army, just get there, give him the knowledge he has, then get medical attention and get sent somewhere safe.

Concentration Camp Escape

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