Punctuation questions

Umgowa · Oct 30, 2016

This is the forum that looked closest for punctuation questions. In the editing my novel two punctuation questions emerged and I'd like your advice about them. Question 1) . . . . I had the following: He went by the nickname "Chip." It was changed to eliminate the quotation marks as follows: He went by the nickname Chip. I strongly feel that when you refer to a word or name in that way that you need quotation marks around it. Please let me know your thoughts.

Question 2) I had the following sentence: They were both wrapped up in the task at hand . . . nailing Peter Smith. It was changed to eliminate the ellipsis and insert a colon as follows: They were both wrapped up in the task at hand: nailing Peter Smith. I vastly prefer the ellipsis, but I would really appreciate your thoughts on this as well. Thanks for your input.

mrsmig · Oct 30, 2016

I think both are a matter of stylistic choice. You don't mention whether you're doing this editing yourself, or someone else is doing it for you. If someone is editing it to fit a particular house style (i.e. a publisher), then house style usually takes precedence over personal preference. If you're doing the edits, or hired an editor to do the work for you with an eye toward self-publishing, then choose the one you prefer.

Two cautions in the latter situation: make certain your stylistic choices are consistent throughout the manuscript, and close up your ellipses so there's not a space between the dots (that is: ... instead of . . .). No need to take up additional space with them!

cmhbob · Oct 30, 2016

On the first one, I'd actually have dropped "the nickname" in the name of tightening things up a little bit. If you're telling us he went by a different name, it's understood to be a nickname.

The second one reads a little better to me with the colon. This may sound odd, but to me, a colon seems to convey a little more tension than the ellipsis does. It's a more abrupt or sudden stop or shift.

blacbird · Oct 30, 2016

close up your ellipses so there's not a space between the dots (that is: ... instead of . . .). No need to take up additional space with them!

Not. In manuscript, leave the spaces in. There's hardly any additional space taken up, for one thing, but more importantly, it's a hell of a lot easier to read. Even in printed books, you'll almost always find ellipses rendered as " . . . "

caw

mrsmig · Oct 30, 2016

blacbird said:
Not. In manuscript, leave the spaces in. There's hardly any additional space taken up, for one thing, but more importantly, it's a hell of a lot easier to read. Even in printed books, you'll almost always find ellipses rendered as " . . . "

caw

That's not been my experience, but YMMV.

StoryG27 · Oct 30, 2016

I think the first one could just be: He went by Chip. Even keeping it as you have it, I don't think quotation marks are necessary.

Elipses read to me as a hesitation or someone trailing off, so I'd go with the colon.

BethS · Oct 30, 2016

Umgowa said:
This is the forum that looked closest for punctuation questions. In the editing my novel two punctuation questions emerged and I'd like your advice about them. Question 1) . . . . I had the following: He went by the nickname "Chip." It was changed to eliminate the quotation marks as follows: He went by the nickname Chip. I strongly feel that when you refer to a word or name in that way that you need quotation marks around it. Please let me know your thoughts.

Question 2) I had the following sentence: They were both wrapped up in the task at hand . . . nailing Peter Smith. It was changed to eliminate the ellipsis and insert a colon as follows: They were both wrapped up in the task at hand: nailing Peter Smith. I vastly prefer the ellipsis, but I would really appreciate your thoughts on this as well. Thanks for your input.

In the second example, the colon would be correct. If you want to be more informal, use an em-dash. But the ellipses look rather strange there. That's not a normal use for them.

As for the first one--I feel sure I've see it both ways, though putting the name in quotemarks could depend on how unusual it was. However, you could just reword it to say "His nickname was Chip," and eliminate the quandry.

King Neptune · Oct 30, 2016

I don't think the nickname needs quotation marks; it isn't strange or something that people aren't often called. If he were called "The Elephant", then I think it would need quotation marks, but Chip is a nickname.

I would use the colon, but I don't like ellipses.

WWWalt · Oct 30, 2016

Umgowa said:
I strongly feel that when you refer to a word or name in that way that you need quotation marks around it.

It would help if you told us more of your thought process. Why do you feel so strongly about this? What do you think that the version with quotation marks communicates differently from the version without?

If you were writing about Chester "Chip" Merriweather, you'd need the quotes to indicate that Chip is a nickname rather than part of his formal name. But if you explicitly say "the nickname Chip," the quotes don't seem to add any information.

I vastly prefer the ellipsis,

It would help if you told us why. What do you think it communicates that is missing from the version with the colon?

As others have said, the colon is the conventional punctuation mark for this type of construction. Defying convention is fine if you can articulate how it makes the sentence stronger. I'm not seeing that here, which is why I'm asking about your thought process.

Umgowa · Oct 30, 2016

I like the advice on the use of the colon rather than the ellipsis and will take it. Here's my thinking on the quotation marks: When you are using a word or a name which is not a natural, dynamic part of the sentence, but referring to it as the word or name itself, it definitely needs to be set off in quotation marks to indicate such. Example: I've always liked the word "run" rather than the word "jump". This reads far better to me than: I've always liked the word run rather than the word jump. Same with a name: I've always liked the name "Chip." As opposed to: I've always liked the name Chip. Your thoughts?

Jason · Oct 30, 2016

As a matter of grammar, I always understood an ellipsis is used when removing words from a quote.

So, for instance, say the full quote is:

"Today, after months of back and forth with agents, editors, and publishers, I finally published my first novel."

An ellipsis could be used as follows:

"Today, ... I finally published my first novel."

So, an ellipsis is supposed to be used to remove words, not for dramatic pause.

That said... I have a habit of using them incorrectly myself...especially in forums! LOL

be frank · Oct 30, 2016

CBJason said:
So, an ellipsis is supposed to be used to remove words, not for dramatic pause.

They're used to show missing words in non-fiction (articles etc), but in fiction they indicate hesitation or trailing off...

FTR, my personal preference is to use non-breaking spaces between and before/after the dots, for ease of reading. But as with everything, consistency is key.

King Neptune · Oct 31, 2016

Umgowa said:
I like the advice on the use of the colon rather than the ellipsis and will take it. Here's my thinking on the quotation marks: When you are using a word or a name which is not a natural, dynamic part of the sentence, but referring to it as the word or name itself, it definitely needs to be set off in quotation marks to indicate such. Example: I've always liked the word "run" rather than the word "jump". This reads far better to me than: I've always liked the word run rather than the word jump. Same with a name: I've always liked the name "Chip." As opposed to: I've always liked the name Chip. Your thoughts?

It appears that you want to use the quotation marks. They aren't necessary in you sentence, but if you really want to use them, then go ahead. But consider that all that sentence does is introduce the name of a character. You simply write: He's was called Chip. This is different from

I've always liked the word "run" rather than the word "jump".

But that sentence doesn't need quotation marks either. It is analogous to

I like chocolate ice cream more than pistachio.

guttersquid · Oct 31, 2016

When referring to a word as a word, it is proper to put the word either in quotation marks or in italics.

The word "absolute" is wrong in this case.

or

The word absolute is wrong in this case.

The reason for doing this to avoid any possible confusion, as in:

The word writer is wrong in this case.

Does that last sentence refer to the word writer or to a person who is a writer of words?

Because there is no such confusion in "He went by the nickname Chip," no punctuation is needed.

Jason · Oct 31, 2016

CBJason said:
As a matter of grammar, I always understood an ellipsis is used when removing words from a quote.

So, for instance, say the full quote is:

"Today, after months of back and forth with agents, editors, and publishers, I finally published my first novel."

An ellipsis could be used as follows:

"Today, ... I finally published my first novel."

So, an ellipsis is supposed to be used to remove words, not for dramatic pause.

That said... I have a habit of using them incorrectly myself...especially in forums! LOL

be frank said:
They're used to show missing words in non-fiction (articles etc), but in fiction they indicate hesitation or trailing off...

FTR, my personal preference is to use non-breaking spaces between and before/after the dots, for ease of reading. But as with everything, consistency is key.

Good catch, my brain was shutting down for the night - used to represent missing words is what I meant, thanks for the clarification!

Punctuation questions

Umgowa

mrsmig

Write. Write. Writey Write Write.

cmhbob

Did...did I do that?

blacbird

mrsmig

Write. Write. Writey Write Write.

StoryG27

Miss Behave

BethS

King Neptune

WWWalt

Umgowa

Jason

Ideas bounce around in my head

be frank

not a bloke, not named frank

King Neptune

guttersquid

I agree with Roxxsmom.

Jason

Ideas bounce around in my head