Higher "Education" Jumps the Shark

Forty-six thousand a year, folks.

Their parents must be thrilled.

hmm, journalism. That's not how that works.

http://youtu.be/Aq_1l316ow8

Yeah... no words for this.

regdog said:

Wow they're in college and still haven't grown up.

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Well...yeah.

"College Students Doing Something Stupid" isn't exactly news to me. It wasn't news to me IN college. I went to classes with similar people.

They're dumb, but they'll either grow out of it or get their butts kicked by real life eventually.

I understand their reasons, but unlike in the Mizzou case, I don't think this can be reasonably defended on legal or moral grounds. If nothing else, swearing support means their words are less likely to be taken seriously by those holding opposing views. I think that if you are going to allow reporting, you should let the reporters maintain their independence, and people can judge their reportage on its merits.


I'd suggest cutting back on the self-righteousness a bit, though. Institutions as august as our own freaking government regularly engage in similar tactics. So do plenty of other governments. And not just the ones we oppose, either. It's propaganda 101. They're just not being very sophisticated about it.

I'm fine with this.

CrastersBabies said:

hmm, journalism. That's not how that works.

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Yes it is. Objectivity is boring.

Anyone who thinks journalism is about objectivity is kidding themselves.

It never has been. It never will be.

regdog said:

Wow they're in college and still haven't grown up.

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What makes you say that?

They're doing exactly what adults do.

Zoombie said:

Well...yeah.

"College Students Doing Something Stupid" isn't exactly news to me. It wasn't news to me IN college. I went to classes with similar people.

They're dumb, but they'll either grow out of it or get their butts kicked by real life eventually.

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Yes, even though college students are generally legal adults, I don't expect them to "have grown up."

Celia Cyanide said:

Yes, even though college students are generally legal adults, I don't expect them to "have grown up."

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That's because they're smart.

Growing up is boring.

kuwisdelu said:

I'm fine with this.



Yes it is. Objectivity is boring.

Anyone who thinks journalism is about objectivity is kidding themselves.

It never has been. It never will be.

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Journalism is about getting the scoop. If "objectivity" makes the scoop more prestigious, then certainly they go for it. But it's only a pretense generally.

Journalism, like fiction, is about telling the truth.

Sometimes the truth is biased.

Sometimes you have to lie to tell the truth.

Sometimes objectivity is dishonesty.

Don said:

War is Peace

Slavery is Freedom

Ignorance is Strength

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Hmm. We'll have to agree to disagree on those ones.

They weren't really having a protest; it was more having a rally to protest racism and oppression in general. Considering that the media does often gin up and misrepresent things with the goal of increasing ratings, I can understand.

That is, I can understand if they wanted to bar all media from their gathering. Insisting instead on a pledge of support to obtain access shows an intellectual dishonesty and outright idiocy that seems to be more common than ever on college campuses.

Those clowns seem to forget that those journalists, objective or not, are essential to the fight because nobody cares about a fight nobody hears about.

I'm not sure it's accurate to call it intellectual dishonesty. More likely it's just ignorance.


I'd argue these instances are actually a positive aspect of college campuses, though. What, college kids should just take everyone else's word that their way is the best way? Let 'em test this stuff out and make their own judgements. Experience is how most real learning happens. Maybe they'll learn something from this. And on the gut level that classrooms lectures generally can't achieve.

Journalism as a whole being a flawed practice does not mean we should just expect it.

Believe it or not, it is possible to do it well and in such a way that the public audience who engage with it--and there is one, even if it's increasingly too small to garner big TV attention--becomes more informed, more politically and publicly aware, and so on. It also doesn't have to be sensational, and frequently isn't. I do agree it can be hard to look at American TV news and come to this conclusion, but in other countries and other media it isn't that uncommon. When a gunman attacked Parliament Hill in Ottawa, the CBC was extremely cautious in what it reported, took time to vet facts with multiple sources, and generally just kept calm which in turn helped keep everyone else calm. It probably also had an effect on the political discourse afterwards, too.

I was a student reporter for long enough to have had run-ins with the mindset the students are in here. I also went to classes with it, got upset by it, and now I dunno if I can even care. It's infantile, but the whole college experience is, from the consumer experience of choosing a school based on marketing material and some nebulous "experience" (to the university the idealist crowd and the frat boy crowd is all part of the same "experience"), to the funding models that reward "bums in seats", to grade inflation, which starts in high school. What a 20-year-old was 30 years ago is not what a 20-year-old is now. I don't know if undergrad is the new high school and if that makes workplace training the new undergrad--I hope not but I kind of suspect so--or even if 22-year-olds coming out of college are worse off exactly, but it is annoying if you end up on the receiving end of something like this in the media, the workplace, or so on. But that's always been the case, and there have always been people who can't really cope with stuff and part of society is helping them.

Journalism is for just the facts, ma'am. Except for the op-ed pages. That's where the aforementioned stuff belongs.

VeryBigBeard said:

Journalism as a whole being a flawed practice does not mean we should just expect it.

Believe it or not, it is possible to do it well and in such a way that the public audience who engage with it--and there is one, even if it's increasingly too small to garner big TV attention--becomes more informed, more politically and publicly aware, and so on. It also doesn't have to be sensational, and frequently isn't. I do agree it can be hard to look at American TV news and come to this conclusion, but in other countries and other media it isn't that uncommon. When a gunman attacked Parliament Hill in Ottawa, the CBC was extremely cautious in what it reported, took time to vet facts with multiple sources, and generally just kept calm which in turn helped keep everyone else calm. It probably also had an effect on the political discourse afterwards, too.

I was a student reporter for long enough to have had run-ins with the mindset the students are in here. I also went to classes with it, got upset by it, and now I dunno if I can even care. It's infantile, but the whole college experience is, from the consumer experience of choosing a school based on marketing material and some nebulous "experience" (to the university the idealist crowd and the frat boy crowd is all part of the same "experience"), to the funding models that reward "bums in seats", to grade inflation, which starts in high school. What a 20-year-old was 30 years ago is not what a 20-year-old is now. I don't know if undergrad is the new high school and if that makes workplace training the new undergrad--I hope not but I kind of suspect so--or even if 22-year-olds coming out of college are worse off exactly, but it is annoying if you end up on the receiving end of something like this in the media, the workplace, or so on. But that's always been the case, and there have always been people who can't really cope with stuff and part of society is helping them.

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Now we're playing "it's not like the good old days"? :/

In this world where what is cool today is passe tomorrow, it is reassuring to know even now college students have the ability to freak out and piss off adults by what they say and how they act.

Journalism is supposed to be objective, but Reason.com isn't. Yet their Grandpa McGrumpypants "you goddamn kids get offa my lawn" articles still get referenced and quoted as if they were.

Don't believe the hype.

kuwisdelu said:

Sometimes the truth is biased.

Sometimes you have to lie to tell the truth.

Sometimes objectivity is dishonesty.

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Sometimes, work will set you free.

Liosse de Velishaf said:

Now we're playing "it's not like the good old days"? :/

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That's what most of these threads seem to be.