Database of never-convicted suspects?

Captcha · Aug 19, 2015

Montana, present day

I'm trying to set up a situation in which a character would be tempted to act as a vigilante because the criminal justice system has failed.

I want my character to know another character killed a prostitute, and it isn't the first time. But there's no real proof - in fact, there's fairly persuasive proof that someone else did it (because the real killer framed him). I want my character to consider vigilantism because the killer is leaving the state, and my character believes the killer will kill someone else in his new location (wherever that may be).

This motive will be somewhat weakened if there's an efficient system of communication between police forces regarding people merely suspected of crimes, with no arrests or charges laid. My character is a sheriff's deputy, used to work as a homicide detective in LA, and he has contacts with various federal law enforcement agencies. So if there's a database or other system he could use, he would probably know about it.

Right now, he just knows that the killer is leaving town. He has no idea where he's going, so he wouldn't be able to call ahead and warn the police there. The killer has two school-aged kids, and my character will have traced a previous town for them based on the kids' school records, so it's possible he could find out where they're moving to by asking the school to tell him where the records are transferred to, but I'm going to try to set it up so the killer just takes the records himself, without the school's permission or knowledge.

So - would my character be able to warn others about this killer, or would it be out of his hands once the guy leaves the state?

Thanks for any help!

King Neptune · Aug 19, 2015

In various places there are people who are thought to be very suspicious, and people, police and others, wonder whether they were the perpetrators of various acts. There doesn't seem to be an organized database of such people, but the word usually gets around.

Have your character communicate with the police in the guy's former residence and future residence. Someone might have had suspicions about him before, and there might be some evidence, or something.

Captcha · Aug 19, 2015

King Neptune said:
In various places there are people who are thought to be very suspicious, and people, police and others, wonder whether they were the perpetrators of various acts. There doesn't seem to be an organized database of such people, but the word usually gets around.

Have your character communicate with the police in the guy's former residence and future residence. Someone might have had suspicions about him before, and there might be some evidence, or something.

Yeah, I've got the former residence covered, but my character has no idea where the future residence will be. So it's going to be pretty hard for my character to contact those people directly...

King Neptune · Aug 19, 2015

Captcha said:
Yeah, I've got the former residence covered, but my character has no idea where the future residence will be. So it's going to be pretty hard for my character to contact those people directly...

Yes, you have a problem. You'll have to have him find out where the guy's going. The school records would have been nice, but . . . Does he have a good friend in the post office? They don't usually give out new addresses, but they might casually for a friend. What does the evildoer do for a living? There might be some contact that he would have to make.

Captcha · Aug 19, 2015

King Neptune said:
Yes, you have a problem. You'll have to have him find out where the guy's going. The school records would have been nice, but . . . Does he have a good friend in the post office? They don't usually give out new addresses, but they might casually for a friend. What does the evildoer do for a living? There might be some contact that he would have to make.

Well, I actually want him to NOT be able to track him forward, so... him having a problem is good for me!

frimble3 · Aug 20, 2015

That doesn't sound like a 'data base of never-convicted suspects', nothing was ever proven, he was never accused, there was no trial, etc. What you'd get is a 'data base of rumors and innuendo', full of ex-friends, spouses and business partners who someone is trying to get back at, not to mention every shifty-looking or oddly behaving person that the neighbours suspect of ... something. And probably too big to be searchable.
Not to say that this wouldn't/doesn't happen, but I'd bet it would be on a case-by-case, LEO-to-LEO basis, where one officer would tell a friend-officer who would assess the information based on his reading of the other officer's instincts. Nothing official.

Captcha · Aug 20, 2015

frimble3 said:
That doesn't sound like a 'data base of never-convicted suspects', nothing was ever proven, he was never accused, there was no trial, etc. What you'd get is a 'data base of rumors and innuendo', full of ex-friends, spouses and business partners who someone is trying to get back at, not to mention every shifty-looking or oddly behaving person that the neighbours suspect of ... something. And probably too big to be searchable.
Not to say that this wouldn't/doesn't happen, but I'd bet it would be on a case-by-case, LEO-to-LEO basis, where one officer would tell a friend-officer who would assess the information based on his reading of the other officer's instincts. Nothing official.

Excellent! That's what I was hoping for!

King Neptune · Aug 20, 2015

Where there's a will there's a way. In addition to checking with his pal in the post office, there is the matter of change of address for the driver's license and for the pistol permit. Does anyone in the family use perscription drugs? Do they have a physician?

ironmikezero · Aug 20, 2015

If your actual killer was ever considered a suspect or person of interest in a case, he would very likely have been interviewed. That would generate a report that becomes part of the investigative file. Cops network with one another (formally and informally) across agency & jurisdictional lines all the time (multi-agency training opportunities, social events, retirements, etc.), so discussions about frustrating cases are not the least unusual. Good intel is often communicated in the course of such fraternal commiseration. The spark of a new lead may prompt an investigator to request a review of another agency's case file--it happens rather frequently in open cases.

As for other records . . . All state/local agencies maintain records of investigations. At the national level, criminal records and histories are kept in NCIC files; this includes arrests and dispositions (convictions). Access is restricted to LE.

https://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ncic

ViCAP maintains records of open/unsovled cases that may identify subjects/persons of interest/etc. Access is restricted to LE. Querying agencies/investigators are advised whom to contact (original jurisdiction) for specific case data.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Violent_Criminal_Apprehension_Program

Keep in mind that misuse of federal data files is serious, and may cost a cop his badge--or worse.

I like the informal networking approach; it's simple and credible.

Captcha · Aug 20, 2015

ironmikezero said:
If your actual killer was ever considered a suspect or person of interest in a case, he would very likely have been interviewed. That would generate a report that becomes part of the investigative file. Cops network with one another (formally and informally) across agency & jurisdictional lines all the time (multi-agency training opportunities, social events, retirements, etc.), so discussions about frustrating cases are not the least unusual. Good intel is often communicated in the course of such fraternal commiseration. The spark of a new lead may prompt an investigator to request a review of another agency's case file--it happens rather frequently in open cases.

As for other records . . . All state/local agencies maintain records of investigations. At the national level, criminal records and histories are kept in NCIC files; this includes arrests and dispositions (convictions). Access is restricted to LE.

https://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ncic

ViCAP maintains records of open/unsovled cases that may identify subjects/persons of interest/etc. Access is restricted to LE. Querying agencies/investigators are advised whom to contact (original jurisdiction) for specific case data.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Violent_Criminal_Apprehension_Program

Keep in mind that misuse of federal data files is serious, and may cost a cop his badge--or worse.

I like the informal networking approach; it's simple and credible.

But I'm trying to make the connection NOT happen. So... is it credible that my character might truly believe that the killer was about to be 'lost' to the system? Is there anything I could change that would make that more credible?

WeaselFire · Aug 20, 2015

Captcha said:
But I'm trying to make the connection NOT happen. So... is it credible that my character might truly believe that the killer was about to be 'lost' to the system? Is there anything I could change that would make that more credible?

Well, the State of New York once had an abandoned bank account, which, after seven years of no activity, reverted to state ownership. They are required to make every effort to trace the account before simply absorbing the account funds into the state treasury. They were unable, after the required three years, to find the owner and took control of the money.

The owner was Johnny Carson, he was still living at the same address listed on the account and he was appearing every night on The Tonight Show. Anything is plausible.

Any decent detective could do a skip trace on the guy and find him after he moved and established a new address, bank account, phone, etc. But your character just needs to be motivated to act before he leaves town and it takes six months to track him down again.

Jeff

ironmikezero · Aug 20, 2015

I may be a bit confused by "lost to the system" . . . If the killer's name doesn't show up in any documentation (case file, database, etc.) and is only known to your MC, well then . . . If he doesn't communicate what he knows or suspects, there is no connection with any other LE personnel. Is that what you're going for?

BTW, by "LA" did you mean Los Angeles? Without the periods (L.A.) the abbreviation means Louisiana.

Captcha · Aug 20, 2015

I want my character to do everything he could reasonably do to keep track of the killer, but realize that it wasn't enough. (I'm setting up a temptation-to-be-a-vigilante scenario - I don't want him to RUSH to vigilantism by ignoring tools he should be using; I want him to feel DRIVEN to it because the tools aren't enough.)

And, yes, Los Angeles.

charlene · Aug 26, 2015

Anyone in law enforcement would know to try to attempt to track the person through the Department of Motor Vehicles because of the statutory requirement of registering a change of address for a driver's license. Of course, the killer could allow his/her driver's license to lapse without renewing it or ignore the requirement to register the new address.

Also, you can solve your school problem if the killer homeschools the kids.

blacbird · Aug 26, 2015

Even with today's technology, I don't think it's that hard for an astute person to "get off the grid". The Feds searched for gangster Whitey Bulger for years, in a big way, following up all manner of rumors that he had fled abroad somewhere; ultimately they found him, living under his own name, in Santa Monica, California.

John Walsh profiles lots of fugitives on his TV program, and many of them have been able to evade detection for a very long time, even after being convicted of major crimes. Chasing around somebody who is only suspected of a crime, but never even charged, has to be more iffy and difficult. Not to mention that there have been plenty of cases where somebody "suspected" of committing a crime has been exonerated.

caw

Fingers · Aug 26, 2015

Im confused. School records are kept on computers. How is the bad guy going to be able to take the records with no one noticing? He is either going to have to hack into the system (or whatever you call computer break ins nowadays) or he is going to have to break into the school to directly access their computers. Its not like he can just break in and steal a paper file like he could if this was thirty years ago.

charlene · Aug 26, 2015

So true. A lot of people go undetected for years, mostly because of the limited budgets of law enforcement agencies. The most common way fugitives seem to be discovered is in traffic stops.

Captcha · Aug 26, 2015

Fingers said:
Im confused. School records are kept on computers. How is the bad guy going to be able to take the records with no one noticing? He is either going to have to hack into the system (or whatever you call computer break ins nowadays) or he is going to have to break into the school to directly access their computers. Its not like he can just break in and steal a paper file like he could if this was thirty years ago.

Is this true right across the country? (It's one of the things I was going to have to look up). I'm in Canada, and as backwards as it seems, the only real file that we have that crosses jurisdictions is the paper file - the different school districts all have computer files, of course, but when a student goes from one board to another, the board sends a paper file to the new school.

Calder · Aug 27, 2015

Captcha said:
Right now, he just knows that the killer is leaving town. He has no idea where he's going, so he wouldn't be able to call ahead and warn the police there. The killer has two school-aged kids, and my character will have traced a previous town for them based on the kids' school records, so it's possible he could find out where they're moving to by asking the school to tell him where the records are transferred to, but I'm going to try to set it up so the killer just takes the records himself, without the school's permission or knowledge.
Thanks for any help!

If the killer has two school-aged children, surely the simplest way for your character to find out where they're going would be to talk informally to some of their school friends. I would have him watch the school to identify a) the killer's children and b) their friends. He's a Deputy Sherriff, so could legitimately visit the school on the pretext of investigating a crime (drugs, an assault, hit & run, a missing person etc.) During his 'investigations' he could speak to the friends, among others, and casually elicit from them where the killer's family was moving to without rousing anyone's suspicions. I can't imagine the killer's children not knowing where they were moving to and telling their friends.

If the killer's children are at High School, this makes the pretext of an investigation easier, but it could still work with younger children. Your character could visit the school saying the Sherrriff's Dept. had received a report of a suspicious stranger seen hanging around outside the school. He'd explain to the Principal and ask his/her permission to talk to some of the children during recess, quietly and in a non-alarming way, to see if any of them had noticed, or been approached by a 'stranger.'

Captcha · Aug 27, 2015

The kids don't know. It's possible the father doesn't know, at the time he's leaving town. He's getting out fast, more or less running from the investigation.

waylander · Aug 27, 2015

Follow the kids on Facebook or some other social media?

jclarkdawe · Aug 27, 2015

If you want to disappear in the US, it's both difficult and easy to do. What you need to understand is what is subject to tracing.

For example, a driver's license is easily traced, if you apply for a new one after you move. If you don't apply for a new one, it's a useless way to trace. School records are a bit harder to find, but many parents don't cooperate with the new school district and the records are never transferred. Jobs require that you show a bunch of forms when you apply, but many employers ignore this law.

For a normal person, it's next to impossible to disappear in the US. But we have a large and vibrant underground in the US. How many undocumented aliens do we have? 10 million? 20 million?

Whitey Bulger is a good example of how easy it is to hide in the open. He avoided the places where tracing is easy and otherwise maintained a low profile. Despite extensive searching, he knew how to stay off the databases that would have made him easy to find. THE DAY OF THE JACKAL gives a good example of how you can hide from a massive manhunt.

Best of luck,

Jim Clark-Dawe

Calder · Aug 27, 2015

Captcha said:
The kids don't know. It's possible the father doesn't know, at the time he's leaving town. He's getting out fast, more or less running from the investigation.

In which case: "it's possible he could find out where they're moving to by asking the school to tell him where the records are transferred to," is a bit nonsensical, unless your character is willing to wait for Heaven knows how long until he feels enough time has passed for the killer to have established himself in his new location, settled his kids into school etc. I think it's stretching the limits of credibility to have a father, your killer, just pile the kids into a car and take off, not knowing where he's going. If the kids were children, as opposed to young adults, their school would be concerned by their non-attendance. After fruitless telephone calls. the police, or social workers, would be brought in. They would visit the family home and discover it empty. If only to ensure that the children were safe, investigations to establish their whereabouts would begin. The police would easily obtain his car's registration and police forces would be asked to "be on the lookout for . . ." In short, your killer would become a fugitive. Since your main character is a police officer, all he would have to do is tell his superiors of his suspicions (in fact, he would be in dereliction of duty if he didn't.) The killer's sudden and suspicious disappearance would add strength to your main character's allegations, probably resulting on a large-scale manhunt.

I would suggest that the best way to go would be to have the killer possess a carefully worked out, pre-planned "Plan B," to be put into effect as soon as he suspects someone is 'getting too close' and which includes a plausible reason for him and his children suddenly leaving.

Database of never-convicted suspects?

Captcha

King Neptune

Captcha

King Neptune

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frimble3

Heckuva good sport

Captcha

King Neptune

ironmikezero

practical experience, FTW

Captcha

WeaselFire

Benefactor Member

ironmikezero

practical experience, FTW

Captcha

charlene

blacbird

Fingers

My cat Toby

charlene

Captcha

Calder

Captcha

waylander

Who's going for a beer?

jclarkdawe

Feeling lucky, Query?

Calder