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View Full Version : I really wish the driving age was 18, not 16.



Perks
12-30-2014, 07:40 PM
** sigh **



This turns 16 tomorrow:

http://i148.photobucket.com/albums/s40/Perks_album/175147f3-1a48-4d31-84b1-9d26cf83e2c0_zps5c2b1b4f.jpg


Actually, she's doing really well with her driving, but I'm nowhere near ready to have it on my mind.

Amy Writes
12-30-2014, 07:49 PM
If only we were ready when they were ready. :)

In Jasper Fforde's Dragonslayer series, driver's licenses are granted based on responsibility rather than age. Obviously it is used for comedy value, but I rather like the concept. I can think of a few people I know who would be in trouble. ;)

amergina
12-30-2014, 07:54 PM
Awww. :Hug2:

Perks
12-30-2014, 07:56 PM
In Jasper Fforde's Dragonslayer series, driver's licenses are granted based on responsibility rather than age. Wouldn't work for me anyway. I have to say that she's the most responsible, cooperative, straight A getting, impossibly easy teenager ever.

Honestly, she's revolting. When she has a school project, she works on it for twenty minutes a night until it's done two days early and she can polish it up. Gross. She's an alien.

If I complained about her, I'd get struck by lightning.

A few months back, when we were talking about her birthday, this is the conversation:

Her: Hey, I was thinking about my birthday and what I wanted to do for Sweet 16...

Me: Yeah?

Her: I mean, I dunno if you'd want to, and we don't have to if you don't think this is a good plan...

Me: Do go on.

Her: Well, I thought maybe just you and me could have a spa day. Get massages, go out for lunch, something like that. Just us.

Me: *tries not to burst into tears* Actually, that sounds pretty awesome.

So that's what I get to do tomorrow.

Perks
12-30-2014, 08:03 PM
She's 5' 9", so at least her legs are long enough to reach the pedals, but her face is too much a baby to drive.

Imma put a stop to it.

http://i148.photobucket.com/albums/s40/Perks_album/141d8e91-7c95-4b95-b92b-98076015e53c_zps601ee087.jpg

amergina
12-30-2014, 08:14 PM
Sounds like a great kid!

I will say that it's probably better she learn and practice before she goes off to college. I watched a lot of my friends who didn't really struggle with finding the time afterward, and feel really weird that they were in their 20s or 30s and couldn't drive yet.

(And YAY December Birthdays!)

Haggis
12-30-2014, 08:21 PM
** sigh **



This turns 16 tomorrow:

http://i148.photobucket.com/albums/s40/Perks_album/175147f3-1a48-4d31-84b1-9d26cf83e2c0_zps5c2b1b4f.jpg



She looks very short for 16.

:)

Perks
12-30-2014, 08:22 PM
It's weird for me, because I didn't learn to drive until I was 24, because I lived in the city and didn't need to, but first and foremost, couldn't afford to.

So 16 feels SO young to me for this.

She's been doing really well, though. She drove for three hours on the highway this summer on a trip to Virginia and I wasn't white knuckling it the whole time.

Perks
12-30-2014, 08:23 PM
She looks very short for 16.

:)

I know! And she's got awfully fat knees, too.

Fruitbat
12-30-2014, 08:25 PM
Well, the older I get the older I think everyone else should have to be before they get to do anything. I went to a medical appointment the other day and I swear the doctor was about twelve years old.

Old Hack
12-30-2014, 08:31 PM
She's beautiful. And she sounds a lot like my oldest son, who works so hard and loves it so that I sometimes wonder if he really is a human person.

In the UK people are not allowed to drive on the roads at all until they're 17. We're lucky enough to live in the middle of nowhere, with lots of room for driving off-road, so both my boys have been driving since they were ten or so (as soon as they could reach the pedals) and they're both very sensible and careful and responsible. My eldest passed his test last year (he's 19 now) but despite knowing he's as sensible as he is, I still worry about him.

Good luck for tomorrow, Perks. Have a lovely spa-day.

Perks
12-30-2014, 08:33 PM
Well, the older I get the older I think everyone else should have to be before they get to do anything. I went to a medical appointment the other day and I swear the doctor was about twelve years old.

Even worse? A dermatologist who looks like Brad Pitt's better-looking brother.

Honestly, I'm in a paper gown, mottled and goose-bumpy under the florescent lights, waiting for some learned person to scan and quantify my imperfections, and in walks the Sun God himself.

Just not what I needed. Truly.

MaryMumsy
12-30-2014, 09:56 PM
My mother didn't get her license until she was around 27. I guess just because there had been no need before that.

I have two younger relatives who didn't get theirs until around 22. In both cases they just didn't feel comfortable with the idea of driving. Eventually the constant having to cadge rides from someone overcame their discomfort. I know one has had several accidents, but the other seems to have done OK.

My younger brother got his the day he turned 16. But they lived 15 miles from town and there was no bus. Sixty miles a day ferrying him to and from school got real old real fast for my Mom.

MM

Williebee
12-30-2014, 10:12 PM
She is the product of the two of you. She's going to be fine. Better than. She has an intellect and a conscience. That puts her decades and lifetimes ahead of 2/3 of the kids I see day to day.

Where she's most likely to have troubles? Six months or so from now when she's grown comfortable behind the wheel. Also, she'll have trouble turning down other kids who want a ride home/to the mall, etc. Not because she's showing off, but because she's your kid.

Oh, and the AAA membership has paid for itself every year we've had it.

Happy Birthday lovely child, and Happy New Year to the whole crew.

RikWriter
12-31-2014, 01:18 AM
My son managed to nearly total my car shortly after getting his regular license. Hasn't had an accident or a ticket since or otherwise and he's 18 now...but I still have the car as a constant reminder.

Marlys
12-31-2014, 02:05 AM
She sounds like a good kid, Perks, and will probably do fine. And her birthday wish is incredibly sweet! Have a great time.

My 19-year-old has no intention of learning to drive until his brain is fully developed--I can't remember offhand whether the current theories put that at age 25 or 27, but he knows, and won't drive until then.

Me, I took Driver's Ed in high school, but for one reason or another didn't get my license until I was 31 and pregnant with the kid.

Cella
12-31-2014, 02:14 AM
Wouldn't work for me anyway. I have to say that she's the most responsible, cooperative, straight A getting, impossibly easy teenager ever.

Honestly, she's revolting. When she has a school project, she works on it for twenty minutes a night until it's done two days early and she can polish it up. Gross. She's an alien.

If I complained about her, I'd get struck by lightning.

A few months back, when we were talking about her birthday, this is the conversation:

Her: Hey, I was thinking about my birthday and what I wanted to do for Sweet 16...

Me: Yeah?

Her: I mean, I dunno if you'd want to, and we don't have to if you don't think this is a good plan...

Me: Do go on.

Her: Well, I thought maybe just you and me could have a spa day. Get massages, go out for lunch, something like that. Just us.

Me: *tries not to burst into tears* Actually, that sounds pretty awesome.

So that's what I get to do tomorrow.awww!
:heart:

kuwisdelu
12-31-2014, 02:18 AM
I'll agree, but only if the drinking age is also lowered to 18. Makes sense to have everything the same age. Otherwise it's just weird.

cornflake
12-31-2014, 02:20 AM
Unless she has her own car, her own money for the lessons and license, and her own way to the test area (and car to use), the driving age is whatever you say it is. :)

I too grew up in a city - there were, iirc, two kids in my h.s. class who could drive by graduation. Both lived out in the 'burbs. I don't think many of the people I've kept in touch with have learned in the intervening years, either. I find the idea of teenagers driving weird and ill-advised. That said, yours sounds very mature and responsible, and you seem inclined to hand over the keys.

Remind her it's not about her - it's all the other nuts on the road who are unpredictable and reckless she has to always be aware of.

Mr Flibble
12-31-2014, 02:23 AM
In the UK people are not allowed to drive on the roads at all until they're 17.

Thank wassname for that -- my son is newly 16. And yes like Perk's kid, serious and responsible (and a sarky bugger too, don't know where he gets that from :D)


It's that old thing -- I'd trust him to drive OK. It's everyone else on the road! Worse, I don;t drive a car, but I do ride a motorbike. I hadn't ridden for a while, but recently needed to again for work, and can't afford driving lessons/another car -- and what can I say if he says he wants a bike too?

Suddenly I know why my Mum had a fit when I bought my first bike....


PS: Perks, your daughter, my son, cute couple. If I could, you know, persuade him to talk to a girl/anyone his own age. Adults? No worries. Talk your ear off about physics and space and games and politics and funny stuff and... Peers? Forget it.

Devil Ledbetter
12-31-2014, 04:30 AM
At the risk of my beloved Perks forever disowning me ...

My 17-year-old dawdled about getting her license but finally obtained it this fall. 45 minutes after collecting it from the Secretary of State (that's like the DMV for you non-Michigan folks, and pronounced SECretariAstate, all one word) she got in an accident. I believe that is some kind of record.

She claims somebody-er-other Jenner of Kardashian fame got in an accident within 24 hours of getting her license, but I say the World's Record goes to my teen.

No one was hurt, and our 15-year-old tank of a Buick (aka The Judge) was spared damage thanks perhaps to a thick coat of dirt and a dash of They Just Don't Build 'Em Like They Used To. The car she struck sustained a little damage but no one was hurt. She got a no-point ticket for "impeding traffic" which was a great opportunity to talk to her about her White Privilege. ETA: She paid all of her own fines, including fees for an online traffic school she was required to take.

There is more to the story, including the other driver misappropriating resources from her county job in attempt to coerce us into paying some grossly inflated "car rental fees" for which she had no documentation, and subsequently getting suspended from work for 2 weeks without pay for harassing a constituent, but let's just file that under People Should Know Not To Fuck with Me.

Perks
12-31-2014, 05:02 AM
Oh no, Devil. I barely love you at all anymore for how much you hate me gate-checking my bags at the airport, but this story is something I know is out there. And it's not the first I've heard in the same vein. :)

I'm so sorry that this happened to you guys!

Now I'm going to go have a rest with a cold cloth on my forehead.

Perks
12-31-2014, 05:03 AM
PS: Perks, your daughter, my son, cute couple. If I could, you know, persuade him to talk to a girl/anyone his own age.

:) I think I need to be in-lawed to an AWer.

EMaree
12-31-2014, 05:27 AM
There's no school-based driving education in the UK either, so along with the later start date of 17 many drivers don't begin driving until they're in their mid-twenties, or even later than that. The average cost of learning to drive in the UK is 1,128 GBP/$1755 USD for lessons (source 1 (http://www.moneysupermarket.com/car-insurance/blog/the-cost-of-learning-to-drive/), source 2 (http://www.moneysupermarket.com/car-insurance/blog/the-cost-of-learning-to-drive/)) and total cost of learning to drive is around 2,741GBP/$4264.58 (source 1 (http://www.moneysupermarket.com/car-insurance/blog/the-cost-of-learning-to-drive/)). So a lot of Brits who grow up without financially comfortable parents have to wait until they have a financially stable career themselves. A lot of people (moreso in big cities like London) don't ever learn to drive and rely on public transport instead.

I'm forever envious of American buddies who get driving lessons in school and only need an hour or two or practice before they pass. The UK process is super slow, and a lot of driving instructors milk the lessons far beyond the DSA-recommended 47 hours. The US system is SOOOOO much better. (I base this opinion not on safety, or better education, or any of that... just that I'm learning to drive right now, after a year of one-hour-a-week lessons, and any system that leaves me less broke than I currently am seems godly.)

Devil Ledbetter
12-31-2014, 05:48 AM
There's no school-based driving education in the UK either, so along with the later start date of 17 many drivers don't begin driving until they're in their mid-twenties, or even later than that. The average cost of learning to drive in the UK is 1,128 GBP/$1755 USD for lessons (source 1 (http://www.moneysupermarket.com/car-insurance/blog/the-cost-of-learning-to-drive/), source 2 (http://www.moneysupermarket.com/car-insurance/blog/the-cost-of-learning-to-drive/)) and total cost of learning to drive is around 2,741GBP/$4264.58 (source 1 (http://www.moneysupermarket.com/car-insurance/blog/the-cost-of-learning-to-drive/)). So a lot of Brits who grow up without financially comfortable parents have to wait until they have a financially stable career themselves. A lot of people (moreso in big cities like London) don't ever learn to drive and rely on public transport instead.

I'm forever envious of American buddies who get driving lessons in school and only need an hour or two or practice before they pass. The UK process is super slow, and a lot of driving instructors milk the lessons far beyond the DSA-recommended 47 hours. The US system is SOOOOO much better. (I base this opinion not on safety, or better education, or any of that... just that I'm learning to drive right now, after a year of one-hour-a-week lessons, and any system that leaves me less broke than I currently am seems godly.)It's a lot cheaper than what you have, but it's nothing like free.

Where I live, the driving teacher and students meet up at the school but the tuition is $320. Then when you take the driving test, that's another $75 to $125 and if you fail it and have to retake it, you pay a slightly lower fee (exact cost depends on the independent test company but they're pretty comparative). Auto insurance on teens is outrageous. If they get it on their own, it's thousands. If they get it through their parents' policy, it's still going to pile on another $600- $1200 a year onto the bill.

No one drives for free.

T Robinson
12-31-2014, 06:09 AM
I must be older than you people. Paying to learn to drive? Not with me or either of my boys. Perks, I share you pain, my oldest made me a nervous wreck. Only one wreck I know about. Single vehicle, managed to wedge it between two trees about three miles from the house, with three of his buddies in the car.

MaryMumsy
12-31-2014, 06:30 AM
I must be older than you people. Paying to learn to drive? Not with me or either of my boys. Perks, I share you pain, my oldest made me a nervous wreck. Only one wreck I know about. Single vehicle, managed to wedge it between two trees about three miles from the house, with three of his buddies in the car.

My Dad taught my Mom. When I was old enough she swore she would go out and get a job if necessary, but he was not teaching me to drive. They hired a Texas DPS (highway patrol, not Rangers) to teach me. I even learned how to do the bootlegger turn, although I haven't used it in 50 years.

MM

EMaree
12-31-2014, 07:25 AM
It's a lot cheaper than what you have, but it's nothing like free.

Where I live, the driving teacher and students meet up at the school but the tuition is $320. Then when you take the driving test, that's another $75 to $125 and if you fail it and have to retake it, you pay a slightly lower fee (exact cost depends on the independent test company but they're pretty comparative). Auto insurance on teens is outrageous. If they get it on their own, it's thousands. If they get it through their parents' policy, it's still going to pile on another $600- $1200 a year onto the bill.

No one drives for free.

Whoa, yeah, that's steeper than I thought (for the lessons -- our insurance costs are the same, more or less, in the thousands for new drivers). Thanks for the solid figures, Devil!

My American friends had made it sound a lot cheaper than that. One Californian buddy only took two hours of instructor lessons before his test, where they went straight onto the nearest motorway, and he and passed first time! I wonder if it's as T Robinson said and the cost has been rising over the years?

auzerais
12-31-2014, 07:41 AM
This is very sweet, and she sounds like a doll. Enjoy your spa day. :)

Devil Ledbetter
12-31-2014, 08:18 AM
In Michigan at least, costs are tied to the age of the driver. Anyone under 18 is required to take driver ed from a state certified instructor. Over 18, you just have to be able to pass the written test and road test, no special requirements on how you prep as long as you can pass.

Old Hack
12-31-2014, 01:30 PM
My son took twenty lessons, which cost a total of about 400, I think. His test was another 60 or so. But it was insuring him to drive which was staggeringly expensive: no one would insure him to drive either of our two cars (we had a Saab 95 and a Hilux) so we traded in the Saab for a Polo, and even then it was about 750 to add him to our insurance for just six months.

Perks, he might be a bit older than your daughter but I think they'd make a really cute couple. In about ten years, when they've both had a bit more fun.

Old Hack
12-31-2014, 01:31 PM
My son took twenty lessons, which cost a total of about 400, I think. His test was another 60 or so. But it was insuring him to drive which was staggeringly expensive: no one would insure him to drive either of our two cars (we had a Saab 95 and a Hilux) so we traded in the Saab for a Polo, and even then it was about 750 to add him to our insurance for just six months.

Perks, he might be a bit older than your daughter but I think they'd make a really cute couple. In about ten years, when they've both had a bit more fun.

RikWriter
12-31-2014, 06:28 PM
I must be older than you people. Paying to learn to drive? Not with me or either of my boys. .

Not here either. My son's high school offers free driver's ed courses. Course, he did get into a wreck so maybe you get what you pay for...

GailD
01-02-2015, 03:39 AM
In South Africa, the legal age to get a driver's license is 18. 17 year-olds can get their learner's permit but only 6 months before their 18th birthday. (It still seems ridiculously young, but how else do you get them out the house?)

Perks, you've got a lovely daughter and since she's... a girl, I'd try not to worry too much about her driving if I were you. After all, we all know that women are far better (and much more sensible) drivers than men, so the odds are heavily in her favor that she'll be a careful, responsible driver. :D

I have three daughters. I taught them all to drive (much cheaper, though somewhat more stressful) and only sent them for two lessons each with a professional instructor a couple of weeks before their driving tests - just to ensure they hadn't picked up any of their mom's bad habits. It appears to have worked. :D

Hope you have/had a wonderful day at the spa. :)

mirandashell
01-02-2015, 08:39 PM
My Dad taught my Mom. When I was old enough she swore she would go out and get a job if necessary, but he was not teaching me to drive. They hired a Texas DPS (highway patrol, not Rangers) to teach me. I even learned how to do the bootlegger turn, although I haven't used it in 50 years.

MM



What's a bootlegger turn?

MaryMumsy
01-02-2015, 09:02 PM
What's a bootlegger turn?

This is a visual

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z77gFTa7Bc4

MM

Mr Flibble
01-03-2015, 12:41 AM
Oh right!

Where I am we call that a handbrake turn. Or "some idiot pulling a u-ey"

pernickety
01-03-2015, 12:57 AM
Subject close to my heart. In France they've recently brought the ACCOMPANIED age to 15, and of course my daughter turns 15 this year (yikes!)
They still don't pass the test until they're 17 though, and apparently the extra year makes them safer drivers.

http://www.jeunes.gouv.fr/actualites/actualites-interministerielles/article/reforme-du-permis-de-conduire

MaryMumsy
01-03-2015, 02:53 AM
Oh right!

Where I am we call that a handbrake turn. Or "some idiot pulling a u-ey"

Over here the bootlegger part goes back to the days of prohibition. It was one of the ways that the moonshiners and rum runners would escape from the authorities.

MM

mirandashell
01-03-2015, 03:06 AM
Ah! Thank you Mary!

Been in the back of a few of those in my youth.