I'm about to do something crazy and I need your help

butterfly · Jun 27, 2014

I just came across my dream job and I mean, I'm sitting here practically crying because I SO WANT THIS JOB!!!!!!

It's a position to teach creative nonfiction and fiction writing workshops and form-and-technique courses at both the graduate and undergraduate levels.

The problem: I don't meet the requirements of teaching these topics, having significant nonfiction/memoir/essay works published, or an MFA.

What I do have: 25+ years of writing policies and procedures for manufacturing companies, satisfying theirs and state and federal requirements, which have been audited and successfully met the requirements (current job); developing, writing, and teaching job related courses, including team building, group dynamics, and creative thinking, to hourly employees, salary and exec management (past).

Recent writing: I took an essay writing class a few years ago, taught by an editor, who loved my work. I still have her comments on my submissions (weak, I know). My first essay published on Salon got 'Editor's Pick' with over 1200 views. My 'introverted-writer' blog since 2010. The rest of my essays and a few fiction pieces are patiently resting in their respective manila folders, screaming to be freed.

The CRAZY part: I'm applying for this job, so I need your creative input as to what other things I may be missing that I can include. I can't match the MFA with anything and can't even say I have a plan for it, but would def go for it if I was miraculously hired.

Many of you are closer to college life than I am so please, tell me what I can do to sell my past and current experience and myself so when I hang up the phone / send the email (which should I do?) I don't feel like I've bumbled my way through it or came off as an irrational nut case.

And I will probably post this in a couple other forums, but AW is the first. Just sayin'.

Kylabelle · Jun 27, 2014

The very best of good luck, butterfly, I hope you land your dream job.

You might want to post about this in AW's Conquering Challenges forum (password: serenity) as you may find more focused support and suggestions from the regulars there. (It's fine for it to be here also.)

Osulagh · Jun 27, 2014

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but requirements are requirements. There are few ways to override them--like if you make such a strong impression that they have to let you pass. But, most likely they're going to filter out who meets/gets close/exceeds the requirements and toss the rest. Sorry, this is just the hiring process.

If you want my advice: If this is your dream job, do what must be done to meet those requirements. Schooling? Publishing? Anything else? Do that. Make it a goal, not a dream.
This is what I'm doing at this very moment.

JournoWriter · Jun 27, 2014

Agreed that requirements are requirements, so apply by all means but don't get your hopes up. A lot of large institutions have low-level HR staffers do the initial screenings based on the reqs, discarding anyone who doesn't meet them - but there may be a chance.

I'd suggest emphasizing your teaching experience and the Salon essay. Course development not so much - chances are the courses are already determined and they're looking for someone to plug into the spot.

Research the person who had the job last, and background the existing faculty. That will give you a sense of how to tailor your letter and general approach.

Good luck!

kaitie · Jun 27, 2014

Do you have a doctorate? If so, that would give you an advantage. You almost certainly must have at least a master's degree in something, even if not an MFA, because most colleges require master's degrees to teach undergrad (and at least as much to teach grad). There are a few exceptions, and I'm sure a person with a good publishing history could get around that, but if you don't have the publishing history, you almost certainly need the educational history.

It might be that you don't meet the requirements for this specific job, but even if it doesn't work out, why not use this as a gauge for what you would need to do to get your dream job? It might mean having to go back to school, or submit writing to different markets, or maybe even work on a new style of writing for a bit to do submissions.

This is a great chance because they're telling you exactly what they want, and if you can find a way to meet those requirements, then you could start actively pursuing this type of job rather than just taking advantage of a lucky posting.

jeffo · Jun 27, 2014

As Kaitie pointed out, most colleges are going to require an advanced degree to teach, without exception. It's part of the basic requirements to be accredited. That said, there CAN be exceptions made, but normally only if the school simply cannot locate anyone with the degree.

However, if you want the position (as you clearly do), my best advice would be to find someone who knows someone. Research the school where the position is and find out who runs that department. Find out if anyone you know knows that person. A connection in some way will certainly be your best hope here.

butterfly · Jun 27, 2014

Their only requirement other than an MFA is publication.

I did mention crazy, right?

I'm doing this.

Thank you JournoWriter and jeffo for your offerings.

Chris P · Jun 27, 2014

Ah, I've been there and know how it feels! Not with writing, but with other jobs more suited to my training. Go ahead and apply. Make them tell you no.

I will say from my own experience, however, that creative writing is a totally different animal than the type of writing you have experience in. I have about 60 scientific research articles in scholarly journals, and that's not done me much good in the fiction world. I'm still unlearning my scientific writing skills when I sit down to write fiction. I don't mention my scientific papers in query letters because although they don't hurt, they don't help either. I'm not trying to bring you down, but I fear you have quite an uphill climb in a very competitive market.

Jamesaritchie · Jun 27, 2014

Requirements are requirements, and the only time I've ever seen anyone land a job like that without the usual requirements was when that person already had a name as a writer than darned near everyone on earth would recognize. Having a famous name as a writer can get you around all sorts of "requirements".

I wish you the best of luck, and who knows, if you can blow their socks off with your writing, maybe you can get the job

V1c · Jun 27, 2014

Well, if it's in NM or another less desirable place, I'd say you have a shot. So have at it! they can't say yes if they don't know you exist.

Maryn · Jun 27, 2014

My experience is contrary to some. Requirements are indeed requirements, but there are times when the requirements exclude all the people who'd consider the job at its location, pay rate, etc. So there have been times I've seen companies I worked for post openings with stated requirements, get no applicants who met or exceeded those requirements, and hire somebody who they believed could do the job.

Do you have any feel for whether there are plenty of qualified people who know about this job and might want it?

Maryn, keeping it to herself

butterfly · Jun 27, 2014

Maryn, I have no idea. She's asking for a resume/CV, which I'll submit the curriculum vitae, which allows more freedom than a resume.

I'm making a list and going through my folders to see what I can show. Luckily I've also been putting together some essays for publication; not sure if "in process" will help but it may show some determination.

JournoWriter · Jun 27, 2014

One other thing: This won't get you to this job tomorrow, but one route to a teaching job is being an adjunct instructor at a small school or community college. In my area, only a bachelor's + experience is required to teach at the local CC. That could be a path to temporarily satisfy the itch as well as give you more experience.

Wilde_at_heart · Jun 27, 2014

V1c said:
Well, if it's in NM or another less desirable place, I'd say you have a shot. So have at it! they can't say yes if they don't know you exist.

That's what I was thinking - it depends on where the person is applying. Rural Nebraska and the OP might have a shot. Toronto, probably not. Requirements depend on the place doing the hiring, though in my experience they're most often overlooked either if there are few halfway-decent candidates (say, an MFA who is too fresh out of school with no real work experience of any sort), or if you know someone with enough strings to pull from the inside.

At the same time, you've nothing to lose by trying. May as well apply, then put it out of your mind unless you hear from them.

butterfly · Jun 27, 2014

Well, the reality is I'll look like a fool applying for a job I don't come close to qualifying for. Between what you've all said and what was said on another forum, from those actually teaching or knowing people in that area, it's best if I just let this one go, and keep doing what I'm doing.

If if fail and get fired, at 56, then what? Not a lot of opportunity out there anymore and there are many coming out with fresh MFA's so what chance would I have? I probably wouldn't even pass a question about lines from Hamlet.

Thanks for your truthfulness and encouragement. I really appreciate it.

Fuchsia Groan · Jun 27, 2014

JournoWriter said:
One other thing: This won't get you to this job tomorrow, but one route to a teaching job is being an adjunct instructor at a small school or community college. In my area, only a bachelor's + experience is required to teach at the local CC. That could be a path to temporarily satisfy the itch as well as give you more experience.

If teaching writing is a passion for you, consider this option. It's generally not well paid, but it's something you can often do on evenings/weekends, and the nontraditional students who often attend community colleges can be great — much more enthusiastic than the average college freshman (I speak from bitter experience).

I have a PhD in Comp Lit and used to teach expository writing at various colleges. Once I suggested to the department head that I had the skills to teach fiction writing, as well. He practically laughed in my face. Without a degree in that specific field or significant publications, it wasn't an option — and this was a small, not at all fancy school.

Academics are HUGE sticklers for credentials — probably have to be, as someone mentioned, because of accreditation. Still, it can be such a rule-bound, turn-up-your-nose-at-outsiders atmosphere that when I left academia, I assumed no one else anywhere would give me a job. I ended up making a living in journalism despite never attending J-school — my boss only cared whether I could write.

You shouldn't feel like a fool — who knows, you might be able to do this job much better than someone with an MFA who lacks teaching experience/aptitude. But the system is stringent and doesn't reward people who don't jump through its hoops.

kaitie · Jun 27, 2014

butterfly said:
Well, the reality is I'll look like a fool applying for a job I don't come close to qualifying for. Between what you've all said and what was said on another forum, from those actually teaching or knowing people in that area, it's best if I just let this one go, and keep doing what I'm doing.

If if fail and get fired, at 56, then what? Not a lot of opportunity out there anymore and there are many coming out with fresh MFA's so what chance would I have? I probably wouldn't even pass a question about lines from Hamlet.

Thanks for your truthfulness and encouragement. I really appreciate it.

It's always worth applying, even if you don't get it. Just don't quit the day job yet.

Honestly, you might think this sounds goofy, but at 56, especially if you have a master's degree, doing adjunct teaching at a community college could be something you'd really enjoy. Adjunct doesn't pay much, but you can do it in the evening. I teach a couple of adjunct classes, and I enjoy those a million times more than my full-time teaching position. It can be a little more casual and fun.

You might end up teaching a class that is low level, and you probably wouldn't be training someone to write a breakout novel, but even teaching lower level courses can be incredibly satisfying. I love teaching the pre-101 courses that most teachers really hate, and it's actually really fun because you can see the students make a ton of progress.

Being a full-time professor is not only hard to manage, but it can be a pain in the stressful ass. I'm not saying it isn't rewarding, but it's something you really need a passion for. But if you wanted a job that gave you tenure, the amount of work that many schools require to get tenure is kind of insane. And nowadays many schools are hiring fewer tenure-track professors because of budgetary concerns.

Adjunct teaching doesn't give you the best job security and you won't get any benefits, but because you can keep your day job, it's okay if some semesters you don't have enough students sign up to make a class. It also means that if you teach a class and find that you hate it, it's not something locking you into a whole new career. I think it's definitely worth looking into.

Fictional Cowboy · Jun 28, 2014

I've been hired for jobs that I had no qualifications for. They hired me for my "enthusiasm and passion. We can train you in the specifics." One of those jobs was one I needed a degree for and didn't have.

My point is this: If you don't at least apply, you'll regret it. You have nothing to lose and you won't be any worse off. I don't know if you can get this job without meeting the requirements or not. But there's something to be said for how you treat your dreams. I say go for it. Show 'em who you are! And if you don't get it? It's not something to beat yourself up about. Be proud that you had the courage to go after it instead of not even trying.

Frankie Bow · Jun 28, 2014

butterfly said:
Well, the reality is I'll look like a fool applying for a job I don't come close to qualifying for. Between what you've all said and what was said on another forum, from those actually teaching or knowing people in that area, it's best if I just let this one go, and keep doing what I'm doing.

If if fail and get fired, at 56, then what? Not a lot of opportunity out there anymore and there are many coming out with fresh MFA's so what chance would I have? I probably wouldn't even pass a question about lines from Hamlet.

Thanks for your truthfulness and encouragement. I really appreciate it.

Hi Butterfly, I hope you do get your dream job! Does the ad say MFA required, or does it say something along the lines of MFA *or equivalent*? I've been on search committees, and I know that they're not allowed to consider anyone who doesn't meet the minimum qualifications stated in the ad (because doing so can expose the institution to lawsuits from everyone else who didn't meet the MQs and didn't get an interview).

If there is any wiggle room in the wording, like "MFA or equivalent," "MFA or substantially similar," etc., make sure to write your cover letter in such a way that it's easy for the committee to see that you meet all the MQs. If my experience is typical, I can tell you that they will probably get hundreds of applications, but most of them will be low-quality, maybe because everyone thinks they can teach writing? A cover letter stating clearly that you have the qualifications for the position, and then listing those qualifications one by one, will get you sorted into the "good" pile.

Anyway, I hope this helps, and good luck!

Layla Nahar · Jun 29, 2014

Just want to say - give it your best shot & good luck!

jaksen · Jun 29, 2014

The people who hire you also have to keep in mind that you will be teaching students who expect you to have written something - that is, something in the area which you are teaching. If you were being hired to teach academic or scientific writing, you'd probably be fine.

I'm not saying you shouldn't go for it - definitely go for it. But I've long wondered about writing teachers who teach writing - or specifically creative writing - who have no creative writing credits.

Okay, there are probably many out there who can do this and do it well, but in my very limited experience I have been astounded by the number of creative writing teachers, who when asked by a student: What have you written? What have you had published? - and the answer is nothing.

I had a friend take a creative writing course and was surprised to hear this was the case from her instructor. When my friend sold a story (well she didn't get any money for it, just a complimentary copy of the magazine) and then told her instructor, the instructor went wild. Declaring that she was the first of her students to be published.

The woman had been teaching for many years.

Bartholomew · Jul 7, 2014

Osulagh said:
Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but requirements are requirements.

Expressing an interest is also a requirement, and the O.P. may very well be the most qualified applicant. Academia can be fairly open minded about how they cut their red tape.

Sometimes.

Quentin Nokov · Jul 8, 2014

I was hired by a surgeon at 16 years old for office work. It was my first job. I had no requirements, credentials, nothing and I'm still there working at the office to this day. I've learned a lot on the job. I say don't expect the worst until the worst happens. You won't know until you try. If a doctor is willing to hire a pipsqueak and teach me things on the job, someone who's got an impressive history in writing and maybe not a lot of requirements could still be impressive enough to hire.

Lexxie · Jul 8, 2014

I wish you good luck, Butterfly!

At my Uni, to get any job higher than an assistance position (which is only given to PhD students) people need a PhD in the field they want to teach. And when there is a position open, anyone who doesn't have a PhD gets a letter saying 'sorry, but you were not chosen for X position'.

I have no idea how this works in other countries, though, and if you have the experience needed, who knows?

CrastersBabies · Jul 8, 2014

I don't think they'll consider you w/o the degree. The only thing that might give you a pass is if you have major publications. (Think Patterson, King, etc.) I don't know. I have most qualifications to become tenured except for a published works of novel-length. And even then, there will be 1000 more applicants who have at LEAST one, plus awards in literary works, and recognition in the community.

Not meant to discourage you! Trust me.

I would look at other people who have this same type of position. Look at their work history, credentials, publication histories. It can be something of a roadmap.

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