What Do I Know ?

We all know more than some and less than others...

Yeaaaah.

I'm always checking AW but don't post very often because everyone gives better advice or says what I wanted to say much better than I'm able to. I'm still to finish my first novel and I'm much younger than everyone else here so I tend to keep it to myself.

You know what seemed to work best for you, which may be something I've never thought of trying.

I've blogged about the dangers of taking advice about how to write a couple of times, but it always boils down to test-driving an idea or practice to see if it fits. So IMO anyone who's tried something is in a position to offer an idea about something new to try.

I don't offer advice on writing. I don't write. But I do offer advice/info on a multitude of other topics and/or situations.

MM

Ken said:

Who am I to offer anyone advice on the subject of writing ?

Do you sometimes feel that way? I do at times.

<-- Tom and Jerry do too.

Shameful confessions to be sure.

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Not me, I've got it all figured out. Not just about writing either, but about life in general and in the specific and it is my solemn responsibility to spread the word, lest lowlier types be forced to learn their lessons like I did, the hard way...

No, of course I do. Add to that the certainty I have that there is no real answer for anything, and what works for me may not work for you. But if I can shed any light at all, if only by raising a point someone may not have thought of, in good conscience I have to do it. This what I do in my offline life as well as here. Even when it's something as frustrating as the gun issue in America- which I am all but certain will never, ever be resolved.

More often than I should, probably, but it's a natural feeling. I may not be an expert on, well, anything, but every now and then a topic comes up where I can actually be useful. Until I get those moments, though, I just learn from the other experts.

I know that I know little - about writing or anything else. But I have fun documenting my fumbling attempts to improve, and hope they might help someone else down the line.

Everyone here knows something.

It would be sad to think you know nothing.

It's fine so long as you remember you don't know everything.

Ken said:

Who am I to offer anyone advice on the subject of writing ?

Do you sometimes feel that way? I do at times.

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And this is why I post so very rarely.

I feel more confident about giving advice now that I'm famous.

Oh wait.

Honestly, I always stress that my advice is based on my personal opinions and experience. No two paths are the same, so as long as the advicee understands that, we're good.

But I do try and help when I can, because so many people gave me good advice when I was starting out.

Every time I'm about to hit 'Submit Reply,' I have a moment of panic and wonder who am I to act like I know what I'm talking about (occasionally), act like I have experience (laughably little), or presume to help someone (ha!). I tend to fill my posts with qualifiers because I'm afraid of being obnoxious.

Persei said:

Yeaaaah.

I'm always checking AW but don't post very often because everyone gives better advice or says what I wanted to say much better than I'm able to. I'm still to finish my first novel and I'm much younger than everyone else here so I tend to keep it to myself.

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Yeah this is pretty much me lol

Ken said:

Who am I to offer anyone advice on the subject of writing ?

Do you sometimes feel that way? I do at times.

<-- Tom and Jerry do too.

Shameful confessions to be sure.

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Do I sometimes feel that way? Try always. I've spent the last ten minutes trying to work up the courage to post this.

ladybritches said:

Do I sometimes feel that way? Try always. I've spent the last ten minutes trying to work up the courage to post this.

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I'm glad you posted it.

And I'm glad Ken started the thread, too. I know far less about writing than do many here at AW but I know that I know a few things. Even so, there are many times I'll compose a post and then decide not to click the Submit button.

The forums are about more than writing advice per se, and IMO it's the other stuff that goes on here that gives the actual writing advice such a healthy platform. Everyone here has something of value to contribute. Age, number of publishing credits, genre of preference, whether self or trade published, never published at all, not even wanting to publish, education, I.Q., breadth or narrowness of interests -- none of these is a measure of value. Everyone has something worth contributing.

The best example is SYW, by the way. I am not all that confident in critiqueing others but I have begun to learn to do it a little more effectively. However I do know that as a writer I don't care about any "qualifications" when I receive a critique other than the fact that the person read what I wrote and has an opinion to offer. Readers are the people we write for. Everyone here is (most likely) a reader.

Having some doubts and second thoughts about what we might post is also a good thing, IMO. But I'm glad it doesn't stop most of us from ever posting anything!

OK, I'm feeling like kind of an idiot right now. My initial reaction was "what's the big deal?" But that's because of how I participate in this board in the first place. I'll talk about Novels, I'll give my $.02 on Basic Writing Questions, my favorite spot is Grammar and Syntax. Well, I also like swapping recipes

My concern about actually telling someone how s/he should (in my opinion) improve his or her writing is so high, I don't even look at SYW threads. If I comment on a first three lines, it's either because I really like them or there is something, objectively/structurally or grammatically wrong. Or sometimes I intercede with an opinion that the original was good when I think someone is being told to make something worse. But as far as direct review and criticism of others' work is concerned, that's it.

Ken said:

Who am I to offer anyone advice on the subject of writing ?

Do you sometimes feel that way? I do at times.

<-- Tom and Jerry do too.

Shameful confessions to be sure.

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I think it helps to remember that advice is just that, a suggestion. It isn't an order, and can't be enforced. Anyone receiving advice is prefectly free to reject it.

Like most published writers I've known do, I sometimes reject advice for really great editors. I'd say I follow editorial advice about eighty percent of the time, but I also say no about twenty percent of the time, even though I respect the opinion of the editors highly.

It's okay for anyone to give advice because it's also okay for anyone to reject the advice.

Mooky, not sure why any of this would make you feel like an idiot?

I'm just glad people who do feel some hesitation to post are speaking up. I hope the fact that that is not an unusual feeling will mean that posting gets a bit easier.

It's okay for anyone to give advice because it's also okay for anyone to reject the advice.

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Words to live by, IMO.

MookyMcD said:

OK, I'm feeling like kind of an idiot right now. My initial reaction was "what's the big deal?" But that's because of how I participate in this board in the first place. I'll talk about Novels, I'll give my $.02 on Basic Writing Questions, my favorite spot is Grammar and Syntax. Well, I also like swapping recipes

My concern about actually telling someone how s/he should (in my opinion) improve his or her writing is so high, I don't even look at SYW threads. If I comment on a first three lines, it's either because I really like them or there is something, objectively/structurally or grammatically wrong. Or sometimes I intercede with an opinion that the original was good when I think someone is being told to make something worse. But as far as direct review and criticism of others' work is concerned, that's it.

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Aww, Mook

I'm glad this thread was started, and I think you bring up an excellent point. Maybe bc I was just talking about this with a friend earlier today. While I think everyone can offer feedback/opinion on SYW pieces, I think it's important for those who do to also remember that once they aren't talking about grammar, POV, etc, they're offering an opinion--their take on what was written. My way isn't necessarily the correct way, it's just my way. I believe both those offering and receiving crits should keep this in mind.

I do wonder how many people I've left staring at their screens in awe at my stupidity after posting about writing. Or attempting to give advice on anything, really. Venturing into SYW can be especially hard. I think I had to do a shot of something for sufficient courage to hit the post button on the last crit I wrote. Typed up a heck of a lot more of those things than I've dared to send. (On a related note: Ever write, like, 1000 words of comments and read back over them thinking you may as well have written 'Cool story, bro. Liked it when the stuff happened!'?)

Ken said:

Good point. And my guess is that people are far quicker to reject an opinion than to accept and follow one anyway.

With editors, I have to say I once got advice over the phone from a really esteemed one. I followed the advice and only years later found it wasn't working for me. The advice was sound, but still not applicable.

Overall, though, editors know their business. "Following what they say 80% of the time," seems a good way to go.

I've always been amused, though, by what another established member here posted a few years ago. When their editor advises them to change something in one of their manuscripts they just ignore the advice and return the manuscript to them unchanged :-D

(And that works. Their manuscripts go to print as is.)

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I like the way that writer thinks. I spend some time thinking about the advice, and if I believe it will improve the book, and fits my style, I take it. If I don't think it will improve the book, or if it just doesn't match my style, I say no. Most often, I find the editor is right.

My experience is that good editors really do just offer suggestions. Too many new writers are afraid to say no, but editors usually think it's fine to disagree with them on this or that.

Was it Socrates that said "I know one thing: I know nothing" or something along those lines? I think its because of this attitude that his opinion was respected. I would rather take writing advice then have it stated to me as rules.