Rape Culture as Taught to Athletes... (TRIGGER ALERT)

It looks like maybe sexual assault is being included as part of the program (ETA: Or it was at least mentioned during the talks). It just wasn't mentioned in that article. At least that's what I got from this article at Connect Bridgeport News:

“This was an important message for our students to hear,” said Richard Jones, Principal of John Marshall High School in Glen Dale, West Virginia. “The drug education message was terrific, as was the simple yet powerful message about why rape is wrong, and what the consequences are of such an act.

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I am dumbfounded. I can't even think of the words to express how...



{Edit -- ok, the second article makes my head hurt a bit less.}

Wondering, did the AP story get it wrong? Did the edit by the WVGazette (of the AP story) get it wrong?

Or did the attorney get it wrong?

If A or B, we should be hearing from C (via the news) pretty quick, right?

Don't know. Depends on which "they" you mean. And just how wrong the story is.

I think the program intends a broader sweep. Whether or not that's successful (or even a good idea), I don't know.

If that girl in Steubenville had not been raped, would her intoxication (plus the complacency of those around her) not be a problem?

Four Surprising Ways Internet Mobs Were Used for Justice

...dat social media. But yeah, this is messed up if they're more worried about social media advertisement of the crime rather than the crime itself.

I've read versions of this stories on a few other media sites. It definitely is a facepalm moment. But in a sad, grotesque way, I'm not surprised.

I think being careful with social media is a great idea. But tying that message together with the rape case was not the smartest move.

robjvargas said:

If that girl in Steubenville had not been raped, would her intoxication (plus the complacency of those around her) not be a problem?

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? I don't understand what this means or how it relates to the OP.

The other things that happened that night are also problems, are they not?

I simply meant that the prosecutor that set this up could have intended to try to include it all.

Not that this would be a good idea.

robjvargas said:

The other things that happened that night are also problems, are they not?

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What, the fact that a bunch of teenagers were getting drunk, which they have done since time immemorial, hurting no one except possibly themselves? Are you really putting that in the same category as rape? I don't think you want to go there...

I simply meant that the prosecutor that set this up could have intended to try to include it all.

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You mean, prosecute the victim for coming forward or something like that? Really don't think you want to go there.

I'm not sure why you omitted my lack of enthusiasm for the idea, then intimated that I supported it.

*shrugs* You brought it up like it should even vaguely be considered as a possibility. I don't even understand why. All of the teens at the party were drinking, were they not? Why single out this one girl's intoxication?

Leaving aside the fact that the average prosecutor probably considers going after every MIP as a tremendous waste of time and energy, as well as the fact that going after a rape victim for their intoxication would be in exceedingly poor form (and perhaps even illegal in certain jurisdictions)... In these cases, frequently the rapists get their victims drunk by making drinks for them stronger than what they expect and frequently refilling their glasses. This is particularly the case in rapes with multiple assailants, as these rapes are always premeditated.

I doubt that the rapists were stone-cold sober, either. But in any case, it's a much better technique to advise potential rapists not to imbibe than it is to advise women to, since rapists are more likely to be intoxicated at the time of their crimes than their victims are.

ETA: Okay, please, please tell me that this article was a bunch of misquoted hogwash, because this:

The rape of a 16-year-old girl by two football players in eastern Ohio-- a case brought to light by social media -- is being used by a federal prosecutor to educate athletes in West Virginia about being responsible when texting and making posts on the Internet.

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HOW ABOUT EDUCATING ATHLETES TO BE RESPONSIBLE WITH THEIR PEENERS? For fuck's sake.

What I did was speculate as to what might have been in their minds creating this program this way.

Even if I turn out to have been correct in that characterization, that in no way means that I agreed or advocated it.

robjvargas said:

What I did was speculate as to what might have been in their minds creating this program this way.

Even if I turn out to have been correct in that characterization, that in no way means that I agreed or advocated it.

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Ah, I misunderstood. When you said "it," I thought you meant the prosecution of the rapists, not the program. Pronoun antecedent reference fail.

In any case, alcohol is a non sequitur, except that it may make rapists more likely to rape.

ETA: You know what this really sounds like, from the article? A federal prosecutor giving lessons to athletes on how to make sure there's no evidence of the crimes they commit.

This is so repellent I can't even.

It *is* a non-sequitir.

If they really did try to mix them together into one program (actually, there's lots of possible "them" items that could be involved), my problem isn't that those other items should be covered. They should be.

But rape is such a different topic from the others. I don't see how you include the others without diluting this one. And the scary thought to me is that these people think that's OK.

Yorkist said:

...
ETA: You know what this really sounds like, from the article? A federal prosecutor giving lessons to athletes on how to make sure there's no evidence of the crimes they commit.

This is so repellent I can't even.

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http://www.justice.gov/usao/wvn/news/2013/august/Projec-Future-Two-a-Days-08-08-2013.pdf

I'm gravely concerned that a U.S. Attorney is focused on "helping high school athletes stay out of trouble on the Internet", and seems unclear on the difference between:

-Females shouldn't get raped.

and

-Real men don't rape.

robjvargas said:

It *is* a non-sequitir.

If they really did try to mix them together into one program (actually, there's lots of possible "them" items that could be involved), my problem isn't that those other items should be covered. They should be.

But rape is such a different topic from the others. I don't see how you include the others without diluting this one. And the scary thought to me is that these people think that's OK.

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Exactly. Alcohol is a factor in about half of sexual assaults, but that certainly does not a 1:1 relationship make. And only about half of that half involve intoxication.

(Fun fact I learned recently: alcohol and intoxication are much more likely to be a factor in stranger rape, and less likely to be a factor in acquaintance rape, contrary to popular perception.)

It's pretty disturbing that these douchenuggets want to make these young men's crimes an opportunity for a "drugs are bad, mmmkay?" PSA, too. But the social media part? WTF I can't even. There is no other interpretation but that the lesson here is, "Um, if you commit rape? Don't photograph the evidence and make it really easy for the prosecution, boys!"

Yorkist said:

It's pretty disturbing that these douchenuggets want to make these young men's crimes an opportunity for a "drugs are bad, mmmkay?" PSA, too. But the social media part? WTF I can't even. There is no other interpretation but that the lesson here is, "Um, if you commit rape? Don't photograph the evidence and make it really easy for the prosecution, boys!"

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I'm trying *really* hard to think that isn't it. Sadly, and ironically, I think it's going to take some "adult beverages" to maintain that illusion.

It's the conflation of the steubenville case with "bad things happen if you aren't careful on social media" that I find concerning. I think educating kids about social media and alcohol is great. But the rape issue should be kept separate.

Although, I don't know that the social media being part of the same program is good, either. The whole "we're teaching you about the danger of social media in terms of getting caught doing bad things"as opposed to "don't do bad things" and separately, don't post dumb things on social media makes me really uncomfortable, because even if the adults have good intentions, all the kids are gonna hear is "here's how you can do bad things and then not get caught".

Liosse de Velishaf said:

It's the conflation of the steubenville case with "bad things happen if you aren't careful on social media" that I find concerning. I think educating kids about social media and alcohol is great. But the rape issue should be kept separate.

Although, I don't know that the social media being part of the same program is good, either. The whole "we're teaching you about the danger of social media in terms of getting caught doing bad things"as opposed to "don't do bad things" and separately, don't post dumb things on social media makes me really uncomfortable, because even if the adults have good intentions, all the kids are gonna hear is "here's how you can do bad things and then not get caught".

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Totally. I can see how alcohol awareness and social media stupidity prevention go together. I can even see why some wrongheaded but well-intentioned folk might put alcohol awareness and rape prevention together. The combination of the three makes no sense unless this is about teaching boys how to not get caught when raping people.

Also, I get kind of sinister vibes about the fact that this program is targeting athletes. Like boys in the chess club don't need to hear about rape prevention? Or if they rape, does it just not matter, since we just don't want to see our athletes get thrown in the slammer for raping someone?