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JohnnyGottaKeyboard
07-14-2013, 01:10 PM
Another binge-watch at Casa Keyboard. We did the entire series (13 epis) in two days.

It had its flaws (for instance, every time the MC showed up I shouted Dagney Taggert!...But um maybe that's my own flaw). I really enjoyed it. I thought the progression grew a little formulatic toward the end <SPOILER>for instance the MC devolving and going through the same journey as OZ's Tobias--actually the situation was quite derivative of Tobias' story, but I never felt quite clean after watching OZ and didn't experience that with OITNB</spoiler>

And even though I saw Kate Mulgrew's name in the credits, I did not recognize her when her character made her first appearance (so no shouting "Janeway!")

thebloodfiend
07-14-2013, 07:06 PM
Pfft. I finished it in one day. Well, one late night and early morning.

I liked it. It was much better than most things on Netflix, or even television. And it wasn't as bad as Weeds (that show, I did not like).

I haven't watched OZ, but it reminded me of a women's prison show from Australia called Prisoner. At least, the MC did. Redd = Bea. I didn't expect the ending, either. That was intense.

I suppose the only thing I didn't like was the back and forth with Alex, wondering whether or not she turned Piper in. Also that she and Alex ended up in the same jail. I know it's based on a book, but I'm kind of curious as to how that happened.

Manuel Royal
07-14-2013, 09:32 PM
I'll have to check it out if they offer it on DVD. I cancelled my streaming account because Netflix's crappy Silverlight software won't work on my pc.

CrastersBabies
07-17-2013, 10:38 PM
Yes. Just Yes. I'm on episode 4 now and I'm trying to figure out how I'm going to watch it all over the next few days.

Awesome show!

Mclesh
07-17-2013, 10:48 PM
I've watched the first three episodes. I think it's pretty good so far.

JohnnyGottaKeyboard: Thank you. I was trying to figure out why Red looked so familiar.

Can I just say I'm not loving Jason Biggs? Can't put my finger on it, but I think another actor would have been a better choice for that role.

Cory, I was wondering the same thing about Alex. Strange coincidence?

All in all, I like that it's not as exploitative as the women-behind-bars shows usually are. (I mean, the old ones I can think of on late-night television.) :D

Rhoda Nightingale
07-17-2013, 11:42 PM
I keep seeing ads for this on Blip. Looks interesting, although I couldn't tell from the clips whether it's supposed to be a comedy or a drama.

CrastersBabies
07-17-2013, 11:49 PM
It's from the creator of Weeds. It's a drama/comedy. That's what I liked so much about Weeds (first few seasons) . . . funny, but also dramatic in parts.

I'm on episode 5 now. I love how they go back and show how certain women got to where they are in jail. It's not like a "feel sorry for me, I shouldn't be here," but women making bad choices and paying for them.

I've worked with inmates and a lot of what I see here is spot on. A few things aren't, but I'm not the nitpicky sort.

:)

Love Donna from That 70's Show, too. She's awesome.

Zoombie
07-18-2013, 12:06 AM
If it's good, then the commercials are doing a fantastic job of making it look fucking awful. Seriously, I watch a lot of blip-TV shows, and if I have to hear the schmaltzy line: "The scariest part of prison is having to face yourself" or however it goes, I am going to chew through my own neck.

thebloodfiend
07-18-2013, 12:10 AM
Can I just say I'm not loving Jason Biggs? Can't put my finger on it, but I think another actor would have been a better choice for that role.I don't really like him in the role either. But probably because I can't get the image of him humping an apple pie out of my head every time they try to play him straight.
Cory, I was wondering the same thing about Alex. Strange coincidence?Probably. A little explanation goes a long way. Ah, well, I'm still watching season 2.

Mclesh
07-18-2013, 12:33 AM
I don't really like him in the role either. But probably because I can't get the image of him humping an apple pie out of my head every time they try to play him straight.

That could be the reason. :D

Zoombie, the show is better than the promos.

Grrarrgh
07-18-2013, 04:34 PM
I just finished episode 5 last night, and I love this show. I simultaneously want to speed through the next 8 episodes and drag them out so it doesn't end.

Has anyone read the book or know more of Piper's story? How much of what we're seeing is truly the way it happened, and how much was added for drama's sake. I agree with Cory and McLesh - Alex showing up at the same prison?? Did that happen, or was that added? I may have to read the book, but I probably wouldn't until after I finish the season.

Zoombie
07-21-2013, 05:27 AM
Zoombie, the show is better than the promos.

Thank god...not only that that's how it is, but also that the promos have been swapped for an incestuous phone commercial.

CrastersBabies
07-22-2013, 09:49 AM
I just finished episode 5 last night, and I love this show. I simultaneously want to speed through the next 8 episodes and drag them out so it doesn't end.

Has anyone read the book or know more of Piper's story? How much of what we're seeing is truly the way it happened, and how much was added for drama's sake. I agree with Cory and McLesh - Alex showing up at the same prison?? Did that happen, or was that added? I may have to read the book, but I probably wouldn't until after I finish the season.

I haven't read the book, but it would depend on where both were living (Connecticut in the series), I suppose, or where the alleged crimes were based? There are only X number of facilities per state, X number of min. security facilities, etc.. These two women met when they were both living near one another (at a bar). If both returned home, then I would imagine it's not strange for them to be at the same prison.

But, I have no idea if this happened in the book. I'm guessing no. The lesbian love twist seems Hollywood to me (not because of the lesbian part, but the travelling around the world and living the posh life part. Maybe).

DancingMaenid
07-22-2013, 10:30 AM
I could be wrong, since I haven't read the book, but I'm assuming the show is mostly fictionalized and is just based on the premise of the book.

But Piper and Alex ending up in the same prison doesn't seem extremely bizarre to me. Pretty sure it's supposed to be a federal prison, which further limits the number of facilities they could end up in. I imagine one or both of them could have ended up in another state, but I don't think the court would see that as practical if there was an appropriate facility closer to where they lived/were tried.

Alpha Echo
07-22-2013, 10:57 PM
We watched it in a weekend and loved it! Something different, you know?

My husband is convinced Netflix is only going to release the second season (of this and the others, especially House of Cards) for an upcharge. I hope he's wrong because he's cheap about some things, and this is one of them.



I love how they go back and show how certain women got to where they are in jail. It's not like a "feel sorry for me, I shouldn't be here," but women making bad choices and paying for them.

I've worked with inmates and a lot of what I see here is spot on. A few things aren't, but I'm not the nitpicky sort.

:)

Love Donna from That 70's Show, too. She's awesome.

All of this. I think that's my favorite thing about it, telling the characters' stories in ways that makes you sympathize but not pity them.

I also kind of agree that something is off with Jason Biggs. I'm not sure...

katiemac
07-23-2013, 02:55 AM
Ran through all the episodes in two days. I think Piper is my least favorite part of the show. Even though she was naive when it started (understandably), I think she still is too much so... but I do appreciate they are addressing the realities of why she's in prison and not just that her past caught up with her.

CrastersBabies
07-23-2013, 02:56 AM
In the Entertainment Weekly article where they interviewed the author, they mentioned her lesbian love affair that led to the money-laundering, but did not say anything about Piper and her lover being in the same prison.

Sydneyd
07-23-2013, 07:23 AM
(snipped) A little explanation goes a long way. Ah, well, I'm still watching season 2.

How are you watching season 2? Is it airing someplace else?

thebloodfiend
07-23-2013, 07:50 AM
How are you watching season 2? Is it airing someplace else?Not that I know of. But when it comes out, I'm going to watch it. I have no idea when S2 airs.

JohnnyGottaKeyboard
07-26-2013, 09:01 AM
Laverne Cox plays Sophia Burset. (http://www.thedailybeast.com/newsweek/2013/07/17/transgender-characters-get-a-transformative-moment-on-netflix-s-orange-is-the-new-black.html)

Opty
08-28-2013, 01:13 AM
Finally got around to watching this. Very good show and I think I'm in love with the actress who plays Piper.

Very darkly funny with some truly great character moments. The cast is awesome ("Crazy Eyes"...oh man, lol) and it's well-written.

Looking forward to season 2.

Jehhillenberg
10-19-2013, 08:51 PM
Sooo, I just hopped on board and binged watched all 13 episodes.

I don't know what to do wit my life now.

I want more. I loved it. The characters were so, so great. Great chemistry between them all. Love Laura Prepon (especially with dark hair now). Taylor Schilling is amazing.

Seriously, I feel empty. I need season 2 now. I shouldn't binge anymore.

CrastersBabies
10-19-2013, 10:14 PM
I hear you, sister Jehhill. (sighs)

Jehhillenberg
10-20-2013, 10:40 AM
I hear you, sister Jehhill. (sighs)

Oh yes, Crasters.

*lies on floor, stares up at ceiling*

((hopelessly waiting))

CrastersBabies
10-20-2013, 08:51 PM
Laura Prepon was really good. Usually, when she's in something, I just see Donna from That 70's Show, but she was great in Orange is the New Black. She was super seductive and scary all at once (from Piper's POV). Full of mystery. The dryer scene was awesome.

Jehhillenberg
10-22-2013, 03:44 AM
I still see her as Donna. Like when she was being cool, seductive, intimidating Alex, I like "Donna's doing that?!" LOL

The dryer scene was awesome indeed. That Pennsatucky chick got on my LAST nerve. Her whole story of how she ended up in prison was ironic and funny. That's some GREAT writing (for the show in general).

But yes, I LOVE Prepon's character of Alex on there. She's a bad, fierce chick. I love it.

Man! "Porn-stache" Mendez and Mr. Healy were/are definitely on my shit-list.

Satori1977
05-08-2014, 12:58 AM
I finally broke down and got streaming on my netflix account so I could watch this. I just finished ep 8, and I love it. Was hooked after the first show. Figured I would try to find (and resurrect) the thread on it since Season 2 starts next month.

It reminds me just a little of OZ because of the flashbacks, but other than that, it is a very different kind of show. Much more tame. I've been a fan of Taylor Schilling since watching her in Mercy (good show, cancelled after 1 season). Never really saw Laura Prepon except an episode here or there of That 70's Show. Very different type of character, but she's excellent. Wasn't sure about the dark hair, but it fits the character, and it's growing on me.

Kate Mulgrew is totally shocking as Red. I almost didn't recognize her. I agree with Jason Biggs. I like him as an actor, but he bothers me in this role. I think a different actor would have been a better choice. Natasha Lyonne I have heard is completely crazy in real life. So this character is a good fit for her. :) Oh, and that mustached guard - what is his name? - it took me a few eps to realize where I had seen him. He played the psycho killer/rapist on SVU recently. I hope that guy is just that good of an actor, because he kinda creeps me out.

By this weekend I will finish the season. I am thinking about going slow so I won't have to wait too long for the premiere. Anyone else going to watch Season 2?

Jehhillenberg
05-11-2014, 09:53 AM
I'm waiting. Waiting. Waiting.

CrastersBabies
05-11-2014, 08:20 PM
I'm waiting. Waiting. Waiting.

(Sits next to Jehhillenberg and breaks out the popcorn)

Jehhillenberg
06-04-2014, 01:42 AM
JUNE 6th!!!!!!!


New episodes!! Season 2!!


Yay-yay!!!!!!! :) :) :)



:partyguy:


Netflix has purpose for me again! :D

K-Fred
06-04-2014, 10:55 PM
June 6th :eek:

Jehhillenberg
06-10-2014, 04:51 AM
I've binged watched. I shouldn't have. But I did. So I'm gonna re-watch. Re-absorb. And take it day-by-day.

Cranky
06-10-2014, 04:59 AM
I started watching this awhile back. Got about four episodes in. I might finish and pick up season two if anyone can convince me that Piper becomes less annoying? I hated her so damn much I couldn't keep watching, even though I LOVED the other characters/writing. It was that deep a loathing, ha.

Jehhillenberg
06-10-2014, 05:21 AM
Then watch for the interesting other characters! Because Pipes is still good ol' self-absorbed, annoying Pipes. Haha

Satori1977
06-10-2014, 07:18 AM
I'm trying to watch slowly and really appreciate the show, but I'm already halfway through!

Yeah, Piper can be very annoying. But I can look past that because I love all the other characters so much. And it's interesting seeing pieces of their back stories.

JohnnyGottaKeyboard
06-10-2014, 09:34 AM
I found Piper's asinine gullibility in Episode 1 of Season 2 (believing the lying bitch who got her into this mess to begin with) an almost TSTL plot twist. Episode 2, which was happily Piper-free (Tastee, yea!), redeemed the series somewhat.

katiemac
06-10-2014, 09:43 AM
I've finished season 2. Piper's grown on me. There came a point in season 1 that her unlikeability became the most interesting thing about her as it became obvious she doesn't understand how self-destructive she is and that prison is where she is supposed to be. As season 2 has less of her, inactually started to miss it a bit.

But plenty of other amazing characters to fill the space and some new character dynamics.

CrastersBabies
06-10-2014, 10:53 AM
3 episodes in. Can I ask a question for those who have watched all of season 2: do we ever Pussay's (sp?) story at all this season?

katiemac
06-10-2014, 06:01 PM
3 episodes in. Can I ask a question for those who have watched all of season 2: do we ever Pussay's (sp?) story at all this season?

There's a lot of Poussey in season 2! Which is nice, because she was one of my favorites from season 1.

Maze Runner
06-10-2014, 09:30 PM
I've watched quite a few episodes. Not in order, but enough so that I think I think I have a pretty good take on it. What strikes me is how they manage to give every character their due. And now they're flashing back to show their back story, before they were in prison. I think it's very well written.

Cranky
06-10-2014, 09:42 PM
Well, I trust y'all, so I'll give it another shot. I'll just yell at the screen whenever Piper is acting like an idiot/jerk again. :D

Maze Runner
06-10-2014, 09:52 PM
Well, I trust y'all, so I'll give it another shot. I'll just yell at the screen whenever Piper is acting like an idiot/jerk again. :D

Maybe being a typical male, I'm blinded by her beauty, but what is it exactly that irritates you so much? Naivete? Entitlement? I've consulted an expert and been told that she was more so in the first season, but is a little less the princess this season. Does everyone agree?

Cranky
06-10-2014, 09:55 PM
Maybe being a typical male, I'm blinded by her beauty, but what is it exactly that irritates you so much? Naivete? Entitlement? I've consulted an expert and been told that she was more so in the first season, but is a little less the princess this season. Does everyone agree?

The bolded. She's also selfish, boorish, and myopic. I wanna punch her in the face. :D

Maze Runner
06-10-2014, 10:02 PM
The bolded. She's also selfish, boorish, and myopic. I wanna punch her in the face. :D

But she's cute...

Hey I won't try to stop you. I know better than to get in the middle of that.

Jehhillenberg
06-11-2014, 01:29 AM
The bolded. She's also selfish, boorish, and myopic. I wanna punch her in the face. :D

The self-awareness of either the show or the characters points this out too.


She's also selfish, boorish, and myopic. I wanna punch her in the face. :D

This is why she rubs the female inmates the wrong way -- at least initially. This is why Alex has loving, yet complicated feelings towards her.


But she's cute...


Yes and blonde, and pure-looking, and tall-ish, and so I can't stop looking at her as well...


Maybe being a typical male, I'm blinded by her beauty, but what is it exactly that irritates you so much? Naivete? Entitlement?


Along with other men that may be attracted to Piper....this is why Larry and Alex are wrapped around Piper's finger. They both are aware of it. They love her. :D

Jehhillenberg
06-11-2014, 01:32 AM
Season 2 was freakin' great -- as I expected it to be. More info on the characters revealed. Poetic Justice was served. Figueroa's story is delved into too. I loved the old ladies that became friends with Red. Daya and Bennett's side love story is always sweet to watch.

katiemac
06-11-2014, 01:39 AM
Daya and Bennett's side love story is always sweet to watch.

Out of all the questionable morals this show has taken on, I hate Bennett the most for this.

Jehhillenberg
06-11-2014, 04:11 AM
Out of all the questionable morals this show has taken on, I hate Bennett the most for this.

Oh no, is it because he's in a position of authority over Daya? Was hesitant to step up to what he took a part in?

katiemac
06-11-2014, 06:17 AM
Oh no, is it because he's in a position of authority over Daya? Was hesitant to step up to what he took a part in?

They play with the authority dynamic a lot in a lot of different ways, but for him to think their relationship is okay under the guise of romance... blegh.

They didn't do much with them in this season but I'm expecting shit to hit the fan in season 3.

Jehhillenberg
06-11-2014, 08:59 AM
They play with the authority dynamic a lot in a lot of different ways, but for him to think their relationship is okay under the guise of romance... blegh.

They didn't do much with them in this season but I'm expecting shit to hit the fan in season 3.

Yeah, the relationship isn't okay at all. I'm a hopeless romantic, so I got roped into it.

The characters frequently make references to what their relationship might be like were it not for them being in prison or in their positions. It sucks all the way around.

Satori1977
06-12-2014, 06:00 AM
Piper gets on my nerves sometimes, but she doesn't bother me as much as she seems to bother other people. I really like Taylor Schilling though. She was in a show I really liked that got cancelled a couple years back. So it's nice seeing her in something again.


3 episodes in. Can I ask a question for those who have watched all of season 2: do we ever Pussay's (sp?) story at all this season?

I haven't seen the whole season, but she is around more in season 2. And there is one ep that has her flashbacks. One of my favorite stories this season, because I adore Poussey.

JohnnyGottaKeyboard
06-12-2014, 02:10 PM
3 episodes in. Can I ask a question for those who have watched all of season 2: do we ever Pussay's (sp?) story at all this season?Yes, there is an episode devoted to her first love/backstory (set in Germany, no less) and she plays a very visible part in the main season arc.
Piper gets on my nerves sometimes, but she doesn't bother me as much as she seems to bother other people. I really like Taylor Schilling though. She was in a show I really liked that got cancelled a couple years back. So it's nice seeing her in something again.I like Piper okay...probably because I would act something like her in prison. Whenever I see the actress however, I am reminded of Atlas Shrugged, Part One.
I haven't seen the whole season, but she is around more in season 2. And there is one ep that has her flashbacks. One of my favorite stories this season, because I adore Poussey.What Sat said.

CrastersBabies
06-13-2014, 10:06 AM
Saw the Poussey episode. LOVED it. Holy cow.

But, overall? This season isn't capturing me like last season. Not sure why. And there is so..... much..... sex in the prison. I feel like it's kind of there to appeal to male audiences almost. There's a lack of emotional connection in the scenes. At least with Piper and Alex, there was real, genuine passion happening (or so I believe).

We did see some with Poussey and her German girl--which is why I think I like that episode the best so far.

katiemac
06-14-2014, 02:56 AM
A big draw for me in the first season was the prison dynamics, conflicts and how everything worked. There was less of that this season as we've figured that out, and this focused more about family and making prison life home life. In that sense I think there was less "drama."

Jehhillenberg
06-14-2014, 06:13 AM
There was a pretty common antagonist though, "V." Man she put the "V" in EVIL.

LAgrunion
06-19-2014, 07:27 PM
:nothing

Just wanted to say I loved season one. Interesting characters. Strong cast. Everybody is just ... so good. Haven't seen season two yet as I'm currently working my way through The Newsroom (good so far). Looking forward to seeing Piper and company again.

Mclesh
07-15-2014, 02:34 AM
:nothing

Just wanted to say I loved season one. Interesting characters. Strong cast. Everybody is just ... so good. Haven't seen season two yet as I'm currently working my way through The Newsroom (good so far). Looking forward to seeing Piper and company again.

I've been binge-watching Season 2, and I've been very impressed. Overall, I think it's just gone up a few notches compared with Season 1. I'm enjoying all of the back stories and the new "bad guy." She's so compelling!

ScarletWhisper
07-15-2014, 03:08 AM
Loved the first season, watched three or four episodes of season two and don't want to see more.

The first season had a development, showing how a very typical girl got drawn into a web of criminality. Then it showed her evolution into a more hardened inmate, wiser to her new environment and herself at a base level.

I'd hoped to see that continue in the second season. I wanted to see Piper "break bad" and really become hardened by the experiences that she never deserved.

Instead, season two seems like an aimless parade of misery. Too depressing to watch.

guttersquid
07-15-2014, 04:40 AM
I loved season 1, and I loved season 2 even more. The ending of the final episode was so satisfying.

Mclesh
07-18-2014, 08:23 PM
I loved season 1, and I loved season 2 even more. The ending of the final episode was so satisfying.

Just watched the final episode of Season 2 a couple nights ago. You're right. That ending was perfect.

dragonjax
02-26-2015, 01:39 AM
Finally binge-watched seasons 1 and 2. Super impressed. Can't wait for season 3! (And I think I'll buy the book.)

Viridian
06-19-2015, 05:57 AM
Bump.

Just finished watching the third season.

I never thought I could hate a character as much as I hate Counseler Heely. Aleida (Dayanara's mother) comes pretty close, though. What a horrible, selfish, manipulative, self-centered, cruel woman.

Brutal Mustang
06-20-2015, 11:12 AM
Bump.

Just finished watching the third season.

I never thought I could hate a character as much as I hate Counseler Heely. Aleida (Dayanara's mother) comes pretty close, though. What a horrible, selfish, manipulative, self-centered, cruel woman.

I actually like Healy. He's misogynist. And clueless. But he does try. Kind of reminds me of my dad in some ways.

Aleida, yeah, she's a real bitch. Her advice to Daya is pure poison.

CrastersBabies
06-21-2015, 10:28 AM
I'm up to episode 9 right now.

Piper is the most uninteresting character on the show and it feels like they're "reaching" for her storylines now. I'm so much more interested in other characters, namely Boo, Diaz (pregnant woman), and even Pennsatucky and Leanne. It was actually Leanne's story that surprised me the most, though I don't like what's come after to some degree. It's like they gave her substance then shot her right back into shallow territory.

I am curious about So-So now.

And enjoyed the hell out of Chang's backstory as well.

They have more of Sophia this season, but not as much as I'd hoped.

katiemac
06-21-2015, 10:09 PM
Piper is the most uninteresting character on the show and it feels like they're "reaching" for her storylines now. I'm so much more interested in other characters, namely Boo, Diaz (pregnant woman), and even Pennsatucky and Leanne. It was actually Leanne's story that surprised me the most, though I don't like what's come after to some degree. It's like they gave her substance then shot her right back into shallow territory.



I find Piper really interesting. She's awful, yes, but that's why I like her--she spent the first season not taking any responsibility for her actions. By the second season she slowly lost the victim angle and embraced her real disposition. Now, in season 3, when the prison is falling apart and everyone is struggling to survive, Piper is a stark contrast: She's the only one thriving in that environment. She's embraced the personality that drove her bad choices in the first place.

As far as other characters go, I feel like they changed a lot of characters' personalities this season. Leanne being the most confusing. Her backstory felt like a stretch.

Viridian
06-21-2015, 11:59 PM
I'm really enjoying Doggett and Boo's storyline. Really glad they didn't go through with their evil plan to rape that guard. Hearing Doggett say "I guess I'm not a rapist" was really satisfying.

I'm really pleased with Soso's storyline, too. Really interesting stuff this season.

I get sick of Piper's relationship with Alex. They bounce between love and hate so quickly it gives me whiplash. That will never, ever be a good relationship. Piper makes a cool villain, though, and I think she's an interesting character.



They have more of Sophia this season, but not as much as I'd hoped.
Just wait. :(

Brutal Mustang
06-22-2015, 12:30 AM
I'm really enjoying Doggett and Boo's storyline.

Me too. They're two twisted people who better each other.


I find Piper really interesting. She's awful, yes, but that's why I like her--she spent the first season not taking any responsibility for her actions. By the second season she slowly lost the victim angle and embraced her real disposition. Now, in season 3, when the prison is falling apart and everyone is struggling to survive, Piper is a stark contrast: She's the only one thriving in that environment. She's embraced the personality that drove her bad choices in the first place.

I agree. I really enjoyed Piper this season.

oceansoul
06-22-2015, 12:56 PM
I love this show and just finished marathoning season 3. Each season, the characters get more and more complex.

The only thing I don't like so much is Piper's transformation. I just struggle to believe her character arch.

Brutal Mustang
06-23-2015, 04:42 AM
I'm having a sad I have to wait another year to keep watching.

Viridian
06-23-2015, 05:32 AM
Lea DeLaria -- the actress who plays Big Boo -- did an "Ask Me Anything" thread on Reddit today. Here's the link. (http://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comments/3aqh8z/lea_delaria_aka_carrie_big_boo_black_from_orange/)

At first I thought she was answering all the questions in-character. As it turns out: nope, that's her actual personality. She's hilarious.

Ravioli
06-23-2015, 09:21 AM
Love the show for its entertainment value, but the opening sums up all that annoys me about it. A cutesy girly song. Seriously. When it's women, it's all cute and touchy and human to be a murdering criminal? They would never present a men's prison show that way. Murdering men are shown as the monsters they are, but Yoga Jones is adorable because she's all sad and yoga for having shot a boy. Here, have a cute squeaky-voiced girl song and lots of women who are oh-so-cute because hey, they killed people, but look how much fun they are with their plays and creative projects and library and girl talk. And their girly song.

Also, Piper the main character, has become Meredith Grey. Utterly useless and only "needed" for making knowing faces and giving smart, deep speeches on feeeeeeeeeeeeelings and liiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiife.

Toothpaste
06-23-2015, 05:43 PM
Well keep in mind this isn't a maximum security prison, and the point of the show is not to just show us the bleak horror that is life, but to show how many many women in our society do end up in such a prison, to address some of the systemic racism that makes certain races more likely to be sent to jail, and to show that people who go to prison aren't all "teh EVIL!!!!!!". Also there have been studies to prove that women criminals are not the same as male ones, that there are different reasons they go to prison (though yes, there definitely are truly evil and horrific women criminals as well). And in past seasons they have had one or two truly heinous people behind bars as well.

(and the yoga didn't shoot the kid on purpose, it was an accident and she feels terrible about it)

I agree though with Piper. She was an unfortunate necessary evil to get the show made (must have a white girl as the lead or else no one will buy it) but now she's quite frustrating. Though I will say her arc this season has been in my opinion the best of her three seasons.


ETA: I actually really like the theme song. I don't find it cutesy at all, I find it sad and pleading, "Remember all their faces, remember all their voices" and when it gets to "You've got time" it just sounds really raw and angry. Yes it's not hardcore punk, but emotions can exist in different genres and in different ways. Not just in straightforward screaming.

Davis McCardle
06-23-2015, 08:04 PM
There's such a large amount of nuance to the characters of Orange, which I just finished binge watching in the intervening period after graduation. This is easily the best part of the show, and while Piper was clearly the focal point in season 1, her importance has lessened throughout, and it's grown as an ensemble piece.

One thing I will say, though, is that I wish the show had some stylistic variation. A lot of it is simple television cinematography (shot-reverse-shot, standard lighting, etc). While this is more than fine, it doesn't quite fill the void left by shows like Mad Men, Breaking Bad, or Six Feet Under that had some pretty great cinematography for television series.

But, it probably has the best cast right now:
http://media.tumblr.com/fe1facd5495a9aa5f5731d8d8d70c2ed/tumblr_inline_mr4g08qsuk1qz4rgp.jpg

Viridian
06-23-2015, 08:21 PM
But, it certainly has probably the best cast right now:
I've been thinking about that.

I feel like maybe it's cuz the actresses they cast are not supernaturally beautiful. They've never had that advantage, so they have to be a lot better at their job. It's really immersive.

For some reason I never really connect with Alex. She doesn't feel real to me.

Davis McCardle
06-24-2015, 05:57 AM
I've been thinking about that.

I feel like maybe it's cuz the actresses they cast are not supernaturally beautiful. They've never had that advantage, so they have to be a lot better at their job. It's really immersive.

For some reason I never really connect with Alex. She doesn't feel real to me.

Yea, and while I don't want to whittle down their talents to anything involving their appearance, the fact that they aren't models (with the exception of a few, of course) lends not just realism, but an actual authenticity to the experience that a lot of other shows don't have.

And yes, Laura Prepon's performance is the only one that I've never really been drawn in by. Not sure if it's a character flaw or performance thing.

Ravioli
06-24-2015, 11:12 AM
I've been thinking about that.

I feel like maybe it's cuz the actresses they cast are not supernaturally beautiful. They've never had that advantage, so they have to be a lot better at their job. It's really immersive.

For some reason I never really connect with Alex. She doesn't feel real to me.
Agreed on both points. I always get miffed when a show is all about pretty faces, like Buffy, Orphan Black, Pretty Little Liars... Or worse, when american shows steal and remake British shows only to pretty them up, like Broadchurch, as if the show isn't good enough with normal-looking people. Orange is a refreshing change from that. I was disappointed to find the Canadian Primeval all prettied up and watered down, even if Evan looks like my ex, which was nice.

vanilla
06-10-2016, 09:08 AM
So, just got the message in my email from Netflix! New season is coming the 17th of this month! Who's psyched? I swear, I was disappointed thinking that the end of season 3 with them swimming was the "End-end" - which obviously since they left so many questions unanswered! Now, I cannot wait for more!

Fruitbat
06-10-2016, 09:25 AM
Yup, can't wait!

Opty
06-20-2016, 12:17 AM
New season came out 2 days ago and....damn. No spoilers other than to say that there's one episode that got me like the end of the "Hold the Door" episode of GoT this season.

vanilla
06-20-2016, 12:44 AM
New season came out 2 days ago and....damn. No spoilers other than to say that there's one episode that got me like the end of the "Hold the Door" episode of GoT this season.

Serious. This season ain't jokin' around. I didn't mean to watch all of them in these two days, I'd planned to pace myself. Turned out to not be possible.

Brock Landers
06-20-2016, 01:54 AM
I'm 6 episodes in and so far it's not the best season but not the worst. There was 1 part at the end of episode 1 where the characters used a certain tool to do a certain task that definitely have to call bullshit on, though LOLOL. Said tool would not be capable of that particular task, not remotely. But, it's a TV show, after all.

Fruitbat
06-20-2016, 01:57 AM
I'm 6 episodes in and so far it's not the best season but not the worst. There was 1 part at the end of episode 1 where the characters used a certain tool to do a certain task that definitely have to call bullshit on, though LOLOL. Said tool would not be capable of that particular task, not remotely. But, it's a TV show, after all.

Okay, so now I'm dying to know. I've watched the new season up to number eight so I don't remember exactly what all happened in the first episode.

Opty
06-20-2016, 03:30 AM
I'm 6 episodes in and so far it's not the best season but not the worst. There was 1 part at the end of episode 1 where the characters used a certain tool to do a certain task that definitely have to call bullshit on, though LOLOL. Said tool would not be capable of that particular task, not remotely. But, it's a TV show, after all.
They used two tools. They switched to another, more appropriate, tool as they got into the job.

However, depending on how sharp the first tool was, and the fact that they only used those on the lower arms and were cutting through the soft joint tissue at the elbows and wrists and weren't trying to be pretty about it and make nice, clean, precise cuts, it didn't really seem like bullshit to me at all, especially because hedge shears are made for cutting through branches and people cut their fingers off using them every year...it's one of the most common injuries for that tool. If a person can very easily cut off fingers, through the bone, in a restaurant kitchen using a dull knife very little pressure/force (which I have seen happen in front of me several times), then I don't have a problem believing that the tool they used could perform the limited job on the specific areas they used it for. If even moderately sharp, that tool could have easily done the job.

Fruitbat
06-20-2016, 09:16 PM
Ugh. Watched episodes nine and ten right before bed last night. It really could have used more light moments to break up all the creepy incidents there. :scared:

Brock Landers
06-21-2016, 05:20 AM
They used two tools. They switched to another, more appropriate, tool as they got into the job.

However, depending on how sharp the first tool was, and the fact that they only used those on the lower arms and were cutting through the soft joint tissue at the elbows and wrists and weren't trying to be pretty about it and make nice, clean, precise cuts, it didn't really seem like bullshit to me at all, especially because hedge shears are made for cutting through branches and people cut their fingers off using them every year...it's one of the most common injuries for that tool. If a person can very easily cut off fingers, through the bone, in a restaurant kitchen using a dull knife very little pressure/force (which I have seen happen in front of me several times), then I don't have a problem believing that the tool they used could perform the limited job on the specific areas they used it for. If even moderately sharp, that tool could have easily done the job.

I've been doing tree work to put myself through school and otherwise support myself for about four years now...take it from me, said tool (especially when sharp, as I keep all my tools lethally sharp) is only capable of cutting through a soft branch, maybe an inch think at most, and it's used in a quick, snipping motion. Now, since it definitely wouldn't be able to snip through what they were snipping through, I assume it was implied that they were using it in a sawing motion. Said tool is literally useless in that type of motion. Frankly, what they were doing could have been done easier hacking away with a shovel.

katiemac
06-21-2016, 06:17 AM
New season came out 2 days ago and....damn. No spoilers other than to say that there's one episode that got me like the end of the "Hold the Door" episode of GoT this season.

I just finished that episode. The show has always been issues-driven, so I felt it coming on but... fuck.

Opty
06-21-2016, 06:17 AM
I've been doing tree work to put myself through school and otherwise support myself for about four years now...take it from me, said tool (especially when sharp, as I keep all my tools lethally sharp) is only capable of cutting through a soft branch, maybe an inch think at most, and it's used in a quick, snipping motion. Now, since it definitely wouldn't be able to snip through what they were snipping through, I assume it was implied that they were using it in a sawing motion. Said tool is literally useless in that type of motion. Frankly, what they were doing could have been done easier hacking away with a shovel.
Really? Are you 100% sure or are you basing your entire claim on your own personal anecdotes (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Problem_of_induction)?

If you're 100% sure that you are correct, then you might want to contact the DA and judge in this case where a man was convicted of murder for dismembering his roommate with tin shears, hedge clippers, and a hacksaw (http://www.newsandsentinel.com/page/content.detail/id/502668/Pa--man-convicted-of-killing-area-native.html) (just like in OITNB) and also in this case where a guy decapitated his grandfather using the even smaller blades of long-handled hedge clippers (http://www.chron.com/news/houston-texas/houston/article/Prosecutor-Man-decapitated-grandfather-with-5542109.php) and let them know that these guys were obviously wrongfully convicted/arrested because these types of tools "definitely wouldn't be able to snip through what they were snipping through" and are "only capable of cutting through a soft branch."

Brock Landers
06-21-2016, 11:15 PM
Really? Are you 100% sure or are you basing your entire claim on your own personal anecdotes (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Problem_of_induction)?

If you're 100% sure that you are correct, then you might want to contact the DA and judge in this case where a man was convicted of murder for dismembering his roommate with tin shears, hedge clippers, and a hacksaw (http://www.newsandsentinel.com/page/content.detail/id/502668/Pa--man-convicted-of-killing-area-native.html) (just like in OITNB) and also in this case where a guy decapitated his grandfather using the even smaller blades of long-handled hedge clippers (http://www.chron.com/news/houston-texas/houston/article/Prosecutor-Man-decapitated-grandfather-with-5542109.php) and let them know that these guys were obviously wrongfully convicted/arrested because these types of tools "definitely wouldn't be able to snip through what they were snipping through" and are "only capable of cutting through a soft branch."

Hacksaw yes, definitely. Hedge shears no lol. Like I said, definitely not. They might have tried it with the hedge shears, then said f*ck this and gotten the hacksaw. But literally impossible with shears, I'll stand by that comment 100%. I don't care what the article says. Go buy a pair of shears at Home Depot and try cutting through any type of hardwood (still not even close to as hard as bone, not remotely) like oak or maple or something that's more than an inch think. Let me know how you make out.

But I'll also say that I didn't notice that they switched to a hacksaw in OITNB the first time I watched it. So that scene is much more realistic than I thought it was.

Fruitbat
06-21-2016, 11:24 PM
I watched the rest of the season last night and might not watch the next one (assuming there is one). The gruesomeness has become too concentrated for my tastes. The earlier seasons did a better job of tempering that with some lighter stuff and hope imo.

Opty
06-21-2016, 11:38 PM
Hacksaw yes, definitely. Hedge shears no lol. Like I said, definitely not. They might have tried it with the hedge shears, then said f*ck this and gotten the hacksaw. But literally impossible with shears, I'll stand by that comment 100%. I don't care what the article says. Go buy a pair of shears at Home Depot and try cutting through any type of hardwood (still not even close to as hard as bone, not remotely) like oak or maple or something that's more than an inch think. Let me know how you make out.

But I'll also say that I didn't notice that they switched to a hacksaw in OITNB the first time I watched it. So that scene is much more realistic than I thought it was.
So, you're presented with evidence that you're wrong and you stick to your anecdotal guns? Okay....

I think this is your main misunderstanding - they didn't (in the episode) use the hedge clippers to cut through the bones. They used them on the joints...where there is no bone.

Frieda specifically tells them when she hands the clippers to Alex (at roughly the 50 minute mark in the episode) to "cut along the joint line."

They didn't use them to cut through bones, which is a detail I pointed out in my earlier post. That's why it's not only believable but absolutely possible, as demonstrated by the news stories I linked to above, where real people in real life actually did what you obdurately claim is impossible.

You're entire "it's bullshit" argument is built upon a false premise.

Fruitbat
06-21-2016, 11:43 PM
So much for friendly discussions...

chloecomplains
06-23-2016, 01:47 AM
So much for friendly discussions...

I would love to have a friendly discussion, but I just finished the season and #heartbroken. My hetero-lifemate is the manliest man-man that ever manned, and at one point bellowed, "THERE'S SO MUCH DUST IN MY EYES RIGHT NOW."

I thought right from the first episode of the season it was going to end with tears, but never did I imagine it was going to be this.

katiemac
06-23-2016, 03:18 AM
Yep. We're going to move on past the thread spiral and reminder everyone this is a friendly chat space and respect your fellow writer is enforced here, too.

JohnnyGottaKeyboard
06-24-2016, 04:09 PM
I haven't watched it yet (I also have Season 2 of Daredevil waiting!) but I did watch Seth Meyers tonight! Samira Denise Wiley was the guest. And they spoiled the ending!!!

chloecomplains
06-25-2016, 03:35 AM
I haven't watched it yet (I also have Season 2 of Daredevil waiting!) but I did watch Seth Meyers tonight! Samira Denise Wiley was the guest. And they spoiled the ending!!!

Oh no!

It's so hard with all the social media and simply being a global community to keep that from happening anymore. My roommate just had that happen with a GoT actor who mentioned something about what had just aired on Instagram I think it was. And you know, you wanna get mad that they spoiled something, but hell, they're people, too, and of course they get just as excited as the rest of us about what's happening in their lives.

My heart goes out to you, though. I always watch the previous season to prepare when the next one comes out, and it's going to be awful watching and knowing what's going to happen :(

DancingMaenid
06-25-2016, 04:13 AM
I think containing spoilers is a major difficulty with this new tendency to encourage binge watching. Not everyone can finish an entire season in a few days, but there's always going to be interest in discussing major events, and the showrunners don't want to miss out publicity by waiting too long to let the actors do interviews. There's no real clear guideline for when it's safe to assume that most people will have seen the episodes.

Personally, I typically want to be spoiled. And with a show like OitNB, where so many horrible things happen to the characters, I pretty much need a synopsis of each episode before I can feel comfortable watching. I actually took a break from this season until I could find a site that had posted recaps of each episode, so I could read them before continuing.

JohnnyGottaKeyboard
06-25-2016, 04:54 AM
I usually don't mind minor spoilers. It's just a tv show after all. And occasionally, like you DM, if something truly awful is going to happen, I sometimes prefer a heads up. And Seth Meyers did warn us that there would be spoilers. But that was a major one and I was shocked!

Viridian
06-25-2016, 06:08 AM
I just finished the last episode. And... FUCK. FUCKITY FUCK FUCK.

I spent the entire hour weeping. I heard one theory that Poussey's night in New York is her afterlife. Maybe that was the night she was supposed to get arrested, but this is heaven, so instead she avoided getting caught.. Like an alternate timeline of sorts. I choose to believe that theory. I'm not religious, but I like the idea that Poussey has a nice afterlife somewhere, dancing with drag queens and smoking weed with monks. Okay, I'm crying again.

Viridian
06-25-2016, 06:18 AM
Also, I need to get something off my chest about Judy King.

Spoilers: Judy King raped Luschek, right? He did not want to have sex with her. He turned her down, and then she blackmailed him into it. The contrast between how Pennsatucky's rape was handled versus how Luschek's rape was handled is unsettling. Pennsatucky has a character arc devoted to it... Luschek continues casually hanging out with his rapist, doing drugs with her, and even has a threesome with her.

katiemac
06-26-2016, 01:06 AM
I've heard the afterlife theory, mainly because One World Trade is complete and the spire lit, which was not current in 2012 when Piper went to prison and the show started, and mainly because of the direct look to the camera at the end. The showrunners have addressed the look at the camera, not the World Trade as far as I know.

Personally I do think it is the night she was arrested. Whether it can also mean something more--I don't think that's wrong, either.

As for the other note re: Judy King and Luschek, absolutely. I don't think the show is going to ignore it, though. I absolutely hated how the show treated Daya and Bennett, as though he was one of the good ones even though he, by definition, was raping an inmate, too. I think we're going to get a lot more of Daya's feeling about Bennett, based on the cliffhanger: "You COs, you're all pieces of shit."

But aside from the obvious heartbreak, I feel so let down by the system. I thought Bayley was going to get a moment where he stood up to his fellow COs, not this. And then I thought the entire last episode Caputo was going to grow a pair and do something, just not that. Why oh why oh why would you leave the prison two nights in a row when your guards are falling to pieces?

For next season, though, the repercussions are big. They touched on it, but Judy King's celebrity is going to mean something (I hope she does the right thing?!) and Papa Washington is going to raise hell.

For those interested, check out this Mother Jones article. An investigative reporter spent four months as a CO at a private prison in Louisiana.

Link: http://m.motherjones.com/politics/2016/06/cca-private-prisons-corrections-corporation-inmates-investigation-bauer

Make sure to read the Editor's Note, too.

DancingMaenid
06-27-2016, 03:21 AM
Also, I need to get something off my chest about Judy King.

Spoilers: Judy King raped Luschek, right? He did not want to have sex with her. He turned her down, and then she blackmailed him into it. The contrast between how Pennsatucky's rape was handled versus how Luschek's rape was handled is unsettling. Pennsatucky has a character arc devoted to it... Luschek continues casually hanging out with his rapist, doing drugs with her, and even has a threesome with her.

I agree. It bugged me that the show seemed to play it for laughs a bit and didn't really seem to take it seriously.

CrastersBabies
06-27-2016, 03:38 AM
Katiemac, I just read that article a few days ago. Pretty solid read.

Caputo was just . . . I don't know. I feel like he is trying to do the right thing, but in the end, he chose to save "the boy" who he wanted out of the prison business instead of focusing on the tragedy.

I wasn't sure how I was supposed to feel about that scene with Bayley doing what he did. It was like the show wanted to address the senselessness occurring with the arrests and deaths of African Americans, but also wanted to show how a corrections (or police) officer can make mistakes when things get chaotic. The show didn't want to piss off anyone from any camp? Or, were they just trying to show how things might have gone down?

The season was solid. I feel like the show has a tendency to make us feel sympathy for a character by giving us a glimpse into their backstories--or putting them through something awful in prison--then, they cheapen it. Like when the corrections officer made Maritza "make her choice for real," then turned her right back into a shallow character, giggling about being in front of the cameras because of "the dead girl."

I did enjoy Red this season and Lolly. The "gang" situations felt weird.

In the last few seasons, I had no connection to Piper at all. Same holds true this season. Just, meh... Not interested.

I still liked watching it. Not enough Laverne, though.

DancingMaenid
06-27-2016, 05:37 AM
Caputo was just . . . I don't know. I feel like he is trying to do the right thing, but in the end, he chose to save "the boy" who he wanted out of the prison business instead of focusing on the tragedy.

Caputo really annoys me. He has these moments where you can see that he's really trying to do the right thing, but he's ultimately pretty cowardly and short-sighed.


I wasn't sure how I was supposed to feel about that scene with Bayley doing what he did. It was like the show wanted to address the senselessness occurring with the arrests and deaths of African Americans, but also wanted to show how a corrections (or police) officer can make mistakes when things get chaotic. The show didn't want to piss off anyone from any camp? Or, were they just trying to show how things might have gone down?

I actually thought it worked well that Bayley was the one who did it. I don't think they were trying to play it safe or pull any punches there (they were fine with showing how horrible some of the guards were in other episodes). I think the point wasn't that Bayley made a mistake so much as he was set up to fail by a system that provided inadequate training and encouraged abuse. The guards who came in right after MCC took over (like Bayley and Coates) were woefully unprepared and undertrained. And the new batch of guards, who were enabled by Piscatella, were mostly abusive and cruel. Piscatella created a volatile situation that Bayley was not in any way prepared to deal with, and it had tragic results. For that matter, it never would have happened if Caputo had stuck to his guns earlier when he first learned about the abuse and Piscatella's disregard for his orders. It was an accident, and Bayley isn't an evil guy, but the situation was a direct result of poor management and oversight.

CrastersBabies
06-27-2016, 07:02 AM
Caputo really annoys me. He has these moments where you can see that he's really trying to do the right thing, but he's ultimately pretty cowardly and short-sighed.

I really wanted to root for him ALL season, but felt like he kept doing dumb things (like hooking up with that lame MCC lady).



I actually thought it worked well that Bayley was the one who did it. I don't think they were trying to play it safe or pull any punches there (they were fine with showing how horrible some of the guards were in other episodes). I think the point wasn't that Bayley made a mistake so much as he was set up to fail by a system that provided inadequate training and encouraged abuse. The guards who came in right after MCC took over (like Bayley and Coates) were woefully unprepared and undertrained. And the new batch of guards, who were enabled by Piscatella, were mostly abusive and cruel. Piscatella created a volatile situation that Bayley was not in any way prepared to deal with, and it had tragic results. For that matter, it never would have happened if Caputo had stuck to his guns earlier when he first learned about the abuse and Piscatella's disregard for his orders. It was an accident, and Bayley isn't an evil guy, but the situation was a direct result of poor management and oversight.

Thanks for your perspective. I'm mulling it over. I think it's good that I'm conflicted in a sense because I'm not all gung ho to just jump on one "side" or the other. That's really what this show does well. It lets us hate characters then redeems them to some extent, then shows us their flaws and dares us to make up our minds . . . either way.

katiemac
06-27-2016, 08:01 PM
I don't think they were trying to play it safe or pull any punches there (they were fine with showing how horrible some of the guards were in other episodes). I think the point wasn't that Bayley made a mistake so much as he was set up to fail by a system that provided inadequate training and encouraged abuse. The guards who came in right after MCC took over (like Bayley and Coates) were woefully unprepared and undertrained. And the new batch of guards, who were enabled by Piscatella, were mostly abusive and cruel.

Agreed. It has would have been far easier for an inmate death to be at the hands of one of the abusive guards. Instead, the show is highlighting the overall breakdown in the system. Mismanaged prisons are a danger for the inmates and the guards.

Here's what Samira Wiley said (http://www.vulture.com/2016/06/poussey-orange-is-the-new-black-samira-wiley-black-lives-matter.html) on the topic:


How did you feel about the fact that the guard who kills her is humanized in the episode? He's not one of the jerks. That that's real life, too. Honestly, it was a really smart decision on their part because it is complicated. All life is complicated. You could've had one of those asshole guards be the one to do it, but then that would've made your feelings so cut and dry. It wouldn't have been complicated like life is. It's something I didn't know was coming. Even when I was reading the script up until that moment, I knew what was going to happen but I was surprised that it was him. In the last episode, you see that they are two kids, and we pass each other on the street. That's really cool of them to do that, too, just to see that these are just two kids walking down the street. In however many years, one is going to kill the other. It's not this vicious crime. It's the system. That's what Jenji's trying to do. She's trying to highlight this horrible corrupt system that's corrupt on both sides.

Brock Landers
06-28-2016, 04:03 AM
All I know is that I want to see more of Humps (the guard that made Maritza eat the baby mouse) next season. I'm always fascinated by psychopathic characters like that - Mr. Blonde in Reservoir Dogs, Ralph Ciffaretto in The Sopranos, Dexter (obviously), etc. I'd love for them to do some flashbacks with him that show how he ended up the way he did.

Viridian
06-29-2016, 04:44 AM
I thought the entire last episode Caputo was going to grow a pair and do something, just not that.



Caputo was just . . . I don't know. I feel like he is trying to do the right thing, but in the end, he chose to save "the boy" who he wanted out of the prison business instead of focusing on the tragedy.


Caputo really annoys me. He has these moments where you can see that he's really trying to do the right thing, but he's ultimately pretty cowardly and short-sighed.

I interpreted Caputo's speech waaaaay differently.

The corporation needs someone to pin the blame on someone. They couldn't pin the blame on Poussey, so they tried to use Bayley as a scapegoat.

Caputo just destroyed that defense. He announced on television that the officer was not at fault because the officer was "set up to fail." Maybe I'm crazy, but I feel that MCC itself -- not Bayley -- is responsible for Poussey's death. They shoved hundreds of people into one tiny prison, then denied those people basic necessities like food, tampons, and sleep. In those conditions, a riot is inevitable. And when there's a riot, people get hurt.

Caputo put MCC in a bad position, and I'm pretty sure he did it on purpose. I'm cool with that.

Viridian
06-29-2016, 06:36 AM
Er... katiemac? I think you might have goofed. It looks like you edited my post, deleted every single thing that I wrote, and then used my post to write your own.

That really sucks.

Anyway. Moving on. I think we'll have to agree to disagree. I definitely remember Caputo talking about how Poussey's death was a tragedy. He did talk about Bayley more, but after an entire episode devoted to Poussey, I was willing to let Bayley have thirty seconds of "he didn't mean to hurt her and really it's the prison's fault" time.

MacAllister
06-29-2016, 06:52 AM
Er... katiemac? I think you might have goofed. It looks like you edited my post, deleted every single thing that I wrote, and then used my post to write your own.

That really sucks.

Anyway. Moving on. I think we'll have to agree to disagree. I definitely remember Caputo talking about how Poussey's death was a tragedy. He did talk about Bayley more, but after an entire episode devoted to Poussey, I was willing to let Bayley have thirty seconds of "he didn't mean to hurt her and really it's the prison's fault" time.

I bet it's just a slip of a button - if Katiemac doesn't get a chance to restore it, AW Admin or I can, Viridian.

katiemac
06-29-2016, 08:31 AM
Er... katiemac? I think you might have goofed.

And you're back. Sorry about that. Sometimes I don't know my own power.

DancingMaenid
06-29-2016, 04:44 PM
I interpreted Caputo's speech waaaaay differently.

The corporation needs someone to pin the blame on someone. They couldn't pin the blame on Poussey, so they tried to use Bayley as a scapegoat.

Caputo just destroyed that defense. He announced on television that the officer was not at fault because the officer was "set up to fail." Maybe I'm crazy, but I feel that MCC itself -- not Bayley -- is responsible for Poussey's death. They shoved hundreds of people into one tiny prison, then denied those people basic necessities like food, tampons, and sleep. In those conditions, a riot is inevitable. And when there's a riot, people get hurt.

Caputo put MCC in a bad position, and I'm pretty sure he did it on purpose. I'm cool with that.

Just to be clear, since you quoted me, I don't disagree with any of this. Caputo was definitely taking a stand against MCC, and I don't think he was trying to throw Poussey under the bus.

It just borders on too little, too late. Maybe this is a turning point for him, but it's hard to tell since it all took place in the last few minutes of the finale. I hope that where they're going with him is that he's finally had enough.

But up until that point, he tried but just couldn't bring himself to do what needed to be done. There were so many moments where he could have acted but backed down, or allowed himself to be swayed. It's good if that's changing now, but that doesn't change the fact that he was the warden and if he'd stood up to Piscatella more, things might not have gotten as bad.

dragonjax
07-02-2016, 07:25 AM
Just finished watching season 4. And avoiding the Internet as much as possible. Perils of not binge watching.

Powerful. Raw. Painful. Samira Wiley rocks. The rest of the cast rocks. The writers are outstanding. Everything about the last three episodes of this season were brutal and brilliant and wow, I need to hug a teddy bear.

Ravioli
07-31-2016, 11:32 PM
I'm only at episode 7, smirking at Chapman's kitchen escapade. She had it coming. A horrible person all around; her girlfriend screwed her over, so now she's "victim gone perp" and lashes out, and puts a couple more years on an innocent woman's sentence to save her silly panty business? Hell no. Bye, Felicia. I just wish they'd have picked a different design. Nobody deserves to get beat up for something they're not. Never liked her much. A coward, a manipulative pity seeker, liar, shallow, fake, insecure... just the whole package of Ew.

Opty
05-24-2017, 10:58 AM
Since the new season will be starting soon, I thought I'd post this Sesame Street clip to get you excited. I'm sure the references go over the kids' heads, but I thought it was funny and cute:

Orange Is The New Snack (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=16nnlzOjhjc)

EMaree
06-15-2017, 01:30 AM
Just caught up with the new season, curious to hear your thoughts when you reach the end. Overall I'm happier with the tone that with season 4, which got far too grimdark for my liking, but.... there were a lot of attempted red herrings, I think?, that ended up feeling like forgotten character traits: diabetes guard, most notably. Again, in this season, male rape and abuse was played for laughs and nothing else. The Donuts & Tucky plotline still infuriates me. The timeline was kinda inconsistent, and there was a massive and awkward over-reliance of poop humour over every other kind of comedy. I could do with never hearing fake shitting sound effects again in my life, please.

But... I really loved Frieda's whole arc, and Flaritza's vlogger adventures. Loved the constant presence of Poussey's memory and impact on the cast. Enjoyed a season where Nicki didn't relapse and Alex and Piper managed to stay relatively drama-free for four whole days. Lots of wonderful and poignant social commentary, lots of powerful statements, and I really enjoyed that the whole season was structured in such a short time window. LOVED that so much of the season was about people looking out for and taking care of Suzanne.

Also, some absolutely glorious cinematography moments. The horror movie Episode 9 and the pop-music-video shots in episode 12/13(?) were absolute highlights.

katiemac
06-15-2017, 01:47 AM
Just caught up with the new season, curious to hear your thoughts when you reach the end.

SPOILERS

I've finished the season. I admit that I didn't know what to do with a lot of it. I had little sympathy for the characters and a lot of them acted like idiots. I agree wholeheartedy that they did not correctly handle the abuse and rape of the male guards. Pennsatucky and the other guard is infuriating. But then you have characters like Daya slow to realize that shooting a guard means going to max? Or Red thinking that a plan to torture a guard into a signed murder confession wouldn't be completely inadmissable? I have no idea why part of our main cast ended up holing up in the pool bunker fully expecting to be killed rather than self-surrender like Nicky told Lorna to do. And while we're on that, maybe don't get caught wearing a guard's uniform and handcuffs?

I wasn't much of a fan of the condensed timeline. Having what was essentially a bottle season may have impacted the ability to balance the humor and drama that show is usually very good at.

EMaree
06-15-2017, 12:59 PM
Oh yeah, completely agree. A lot of the character beats felt off in this one. I didn't mind Daya and Red so much since it fits their core characters, in my head (naive and easily swept up / ruthless and easily blinded by rage) but I'm still mystified by Tucky getting pushed to her limit and then... punching Linda? That's it? She's such a creature if righteous rage and punishment but her fire was missing in this one.

The bunker thing bothered me too: the bunker-characters kept talking about how awful it was on the surface to justify not going there, but... it wasn't? And it was characters who had been up there and seen it that were saying this. The prison's had far worse than SWAT uniforms and hands-against-the-walls, the raid didn't come across as anywhere near as terrifying as the show seemed to think.

I think this was partly because nobody got hurt, despite all the lampshaded potential deaths. With nobody hurt, it seemed ridiculous for the show to position the bunker (with friggin' Piscatella in it!) as a safe place.

And it was super weird that Frieda, the most sensible of the lot, chose to face the raid holding a gun and wearing a head-visor and armour. Frieda is smarter than that! I could buy Tova wearing the guard uniform because she makes a lot of ridiculous decisions, but Frieda pushed believably for me.

Jade Rothwell
06-22-2017, 10:03 PM
I agree. It bugged me that the show seemed to play it for laughs a bit and didn't really seem to take it seriously.

although they way they're handling Pennsatucky's is making me really uncomfortable too

Fruitbat
06-22-2017, 10:32 PM
I was icked out by Pennsatucky's "love interest," but then I thought well, it is an example of major dysfunction...

I just love this show. I binge watched the whole season in two nights and now it's over. :(