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LloydBrown
01-30-2006, 01:00 AM
Specifically, I'm looking for info on physical city size and things like that. I use the Medieval Demographics made easy website at http://www.io.com/~sjohn/demog.htm as a guideline, but I'd like some primary resources. Unfortunately, while I can find a collection of medieval city maps, none of them has any kind of scale.

Any pointers?

Gillian
01-30-2006, 04:21 AM
Can you be a bit more specific? What towns and cities are you interested in? Do you want to know the size in 900 or 1200 or 1400?

LloydBrown
01-30-2006, 04:30 AM
Can you be a bit more specific? What towns and cities are you interested in? Do you want to know the size in 900 or 1200 or 1400?

The setting I'm using for my model is a combination of Hanseatic league and the independent city-states of Italy, so 15th century is probably best.

ideagirl
01-30-2006, 08:01 AM
The setting I'm using for my model is a combination of Hanseatic league and the independent city-states of Italy, so 15th century is probably best.

Have you searched on google, amazon, etc. for info/books about specific Italian city-states? I mean, if you looked into size/demographics/etc. for 15th century Florence, you'd be halfway there already... there are zillions of books about 15th-c. Florence, so it shouldn't be hard to get the info.

LloydBrown
01-30-2006, 08:21 PM
Have you searched on google, amazon, etc. for info/books about specific Italian city-states? I mean, if you looked into size/demographics/etc. for 15th century Florence, you'd be halfway there already... there are zillions of books about 15th-c. Florence, so it shouldn't be hard to get the info.

Somewhat. Maps I can find. Maps with a scale I can't find.

ideagirl
01-31-2006, 05:29 AM
Somewhat. Maps I can find. Maps with a scale I can't find.

I have an awesome book called "Daily Living in the Twelfth Century, Based on the Observations of Alexander Neckam in London and Paris," by Urban Tigner Holmes, Jr. It's from the U of Wisconsin Press, 1964. Obviously it's London and Paris, not Rome and Florence, but we're still talking major European cities--close enough, if all you need to know is size/scale/population type info. It's amazing how little of the modern cities there was back then; it was just the center.

Anyway, maybe that particular book isn't hugely useful for you, but from looking at the maps in it I have a suggestion: get medieval maps without scale. Then get modern maps of the same cities (Florence, Rome, whatever), to scale. Then compare the medieval and modern maps... you'll see some landmarks and possibly some natural features that will enable you to guage the size and scale of the medieval city, by comparison to the modern city. You could even blow the maps up until they're both the same scale, and superimpose them to get a better idea. Voila.

Here's a cool site about ancient/early medieval Paris. Maybe it will give you some ideas. http://www.paris.culture.fr/en/index.html

LloydBrown
01-31-2006, 06:08 AM
Then compare the medieval and modern maps... you'll see some landmarks and possibly some natural features that will enable you to guage the size and scale of the medieval city, by comparison to the modern city.

Wonderfully simple. Thank you.

Medievalist
01-31-2006, 06:37 AM
Wonderfully simple. Thank you.

That really is the way to go--they didn't have scale maps in the Middle ages, not even the Romans had maps to scale, though they did do archietectural renderings to scale.

LloydBrown
01-31-2006, 06:43 AM
That really is the way to go--they didn't have scale maps in the Middle ages, not even the Romans had maps to scale, though they did do archietectural renderings to scale.

I know they didn't make them at the time. It's still frustrating that, with all the computer renderings of what this town or that city might have looked like, nobody seems to have plopped a scale down on an ancient city map. I know archeologists have this information down to the inch somewhere.