Surfaces and Blood Stains??

hillcountryannie · Oct 22, 2012

My character shoots himself in the head in a barn. The MC goes back there about 6 months later, and I want her to see stains.

I don't go into details about the cleaning. But, what barn surface floor would be best for this?

Dirt (compacted)- Though this is the most common type of barn floor, I highly doubt much blood would be left because of microbes, insects, etc. Though I could have her see where the dirt has been dug out and replaced.

Wood- Not common in barns, but my family had a barn with a wood "floor" area for hay storage.

Gravel- The farm I worked for had a gravel floor with concrete in the old milk parlor (though my character doesn't like on a dairy farm).

Another option would be brick, since I could have him do it in the (empty) stable. Horses play an important role in the story.

Someone else suggested that all she would have to do is imagine the blood.

DeleyanLee · Oct 22, 2012

Shooting oneself in the head equals a LOT of blood splatter, which will go in all directions, not just down. There will be blood splatter (and bits of skull, hair and brains) on pretty much every surface (including ceiling if it's within range) within range, not just the floor.

Think about what the walls, stalls, posts, anything hanging down, troughs, anything within a range of 10-15' (IIRC). Don't just think floors and you may well find your answer.

hillcountryannie · Oct 22, 2012

My character uses a .22LR and based on research and opinions here, there might not even be an exit wound. One EMT told me he was at the scene of someone who used a .22 and there was no splatter, just blood from the entry and a large amount of blood from his mouth.

I wrote my MC kneeling on the floor where this pool of blood had been, because that's how I saw her.

DeleyanLee · Oct 22, 2012

Gotcha. That's rather anti-dramatic, though. *sigh*

Question: how likely would that dirt have been dug up or would they have just spread something over, counting on the microbes, etc, to take care of it? Then it would be there for her to discover without much hassle.

hillcountryannie · Oct 22, 2012

I don't know about the likelihood of it being dug up or covered.

Actually, using this caliber of gun makes it so much more painful for my MC-- open casket funeral, coming to realize he didn't die right away, etc.

hillcountryannie · Oct 22, 2012

Okay, thinking concrete is the best. Did some quick research and its porous and holds blood stains.

Even though it's an old barn, the concrete could have been laid later. Maybe it was later used as a garage. I don't need to get into all of that, but I like to have back stories about things like that.

spottedgeckgo · Oct 22, 2012

a .22 will penetrate a human head, but other factors involved can stop it from happening. One is the angle of the shot. 22 hollowpoints from a pistol can achieve better penetration than from a rifle in a lot of cases because the bullet isn't moving fast enough to open the point into a large mushroom. Sounds counter-intuitive but it happens.

Either way, a 22 is not going to give you the "explosion" that you will get from a more powerful round. If it penetrates, there will be some spray from the exit hole though. A solid point 22lr will easily eat 14-18" of ballistics gel, so maybe go that way instead of a HP and your penetration problem is solved.

PM if you need any ballistics info, I can get it, pistols only though, the model doesn't work for higher velocity rifle rounds.

I'm pretty sure dirt will retain that dark stain for a long time. The reason is the same for why gall ink stains so well, the iron turns to iron oxide and stains anything it touches. Color will be dark brown to black depending on how long it sits, but blood stays around for a while.

Vaulted · Oct 22, 2012

hillcountryannie said:
Okay, thinking concrete is the best. Did some quick research and its porous and holds blood stains.

Even though it's an old barn, the concrete could have been laid later. Maybe it was later used as a garage. I don't need to get into all of that, but I like to have back stories about things like that.

I was going to say concrete. Might also use brick if you had a large pile around to use.

As far as justifying it, if you had heavy equipment (harvester, tractor) and soft soil you might concrete the floor. Also if the barn was used for keeping large animals, you wouldn't want their hooves tearing up the floor.

jclarkdawe · Oct 22, 2012

hillcountryannie said:
Someone else suggested that all she would have to do is imagine the blood.

Use this instead. Most barns have a variety of stains, such as paint, oil, dried blood from slaughterings, et cetera. Dried blood, after that length of time, is not going to be obviously a blood stain.

Reality is most people in this situation imagine it more then actually see it. I know someone who put in a new floor to get rid of the blood stains and the stains are still there. Or at least she thinks so. And this is from a death that occurred to someone she never knew, who lived in the house before she and her husband bought it.

Best of luck,

Jim Clark-Dawe

Vaulted · Oct 22, 2012

jclarkdawe said:
Use this instead. Most barns have a variety of stains, such as paint, oil, dried blood from slaughterings, et cetera. Dried blood, after that length of time, is not going to be obviously a blood stain.

Reality is most people in this situation imagine it more then actually see it. I know someone who put in a new floor to get rid of the blood stains and the stains are still there. Or at least she thinks so. And this is from a death that occurred to someone she never knew, who lived in the house before she and her husband bought it.

"Out, damned spot", eh? Very interesting.

This reminds me of a terrible anime I saw this year (called Tokko). The characters visited an apartment where a slaughter had taken place several years before, and there was still bright red blood splattered on the walls.

hillcountryannie · Oct 23, 2012

Thanks for the thoughts everyone.

I know a .22 can penetrate, but it might not. Like you said there are so many factors that can change all of that. I've read and heard accounts of it happening both ways. My character needs to use a rifle, because it ties in with other parts of the story.

Forgot to say that my one hesitation in going with an earth floor would be that this happens in May, and so the blood has to sit through a hot Texas summer. I know bio-activity in soils is greater when warm.

I think I'm going with cement. The barn is pretty much empty now at that point in my story. So, it'll be part imaging/part real. She would know where it was anyway, because she saw him in the barn, and she's the kind of person who would remember exactly.

dirtsider · Oct 23, 2012

I would think that the blood splatter would not be concentrated all in one spot. It would, well, splatter. Perhaps some got lodged behind something else (a stack of wood, straw, tack, perhaps) and so was missed during the cleanup of the body.

ironmikezero · Oct 23, 2012

FWIW, in forensics there is a difference in the terms spatter and splatter... If you intend to discuss the scene in terms of bloodstain pattern analysis, you'd be well advised to use the correct term - spatter.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bloodstain_pattern_analysis

http://grammarist.com/usage/spatter-splatter/

(Caution: the following link is gruesome/NSW, and made me wonder a bit about its author...)

http://bellacozy.blogspot.com/2011/04/splatter-vs-spatter-rated-g-for-gore.html

Surfaces and Blood Stains??

hillcountryannie

Son, you ain't kiddin'.

DeleyanLee

Writing Anarchist

hillcountryannie

Son, you ain't kiddin'.

DeleyanLee

Writing Anarchist

hillcountryannie

Son, you ain't kiddin'.

hillcountryannie

Son, you ain't kiddin'.

spottedgeckgo

Da Gecko

Vaulted

Must try harder.

jclarkdawe

Feeling lucky, Query?

Vaulted

Must try harder.

hillcountryannie

Son, you ain't kiddin'.

dirtsider

Not so new, really

ironmikezero

practical experience, FTW