Legality - consensual fight leading to death

Captcha · Sep 28, 2012

Setting: Current day, unspecified (as yet) US State (or Cdn location, if that would make things easier)...

I want one of my characters to have killed another man in a fight (accidental death, deliberate fight). Both fighters were rough, drunk, and looking for trouble, and the death would have resulted from a deliberate blow that wouldn't be out of the question in a typical bar fight.

I want my character to go to jail for something (manslaughter?) but to be morally redeemable.

If someone dies after a consensual fight, is it a crime? What crime? What would the likely punishment be (offender might have some minor criminal issues in the past, but nothing big)? Are there factors exacerbating or minimizing his guilt of which I should be aware?

(Ideally, I'd like the guy to SERVE at least a few years in prison. More than one, less than ten - how do I have to arrange the crime to make this happen?)

Thanks for any help!

amschilling · Sep 28, 2012

Yes, it would still be a crime. We're not talking about a legal boxing match or something like that. And we're not talking about self-defense. It's just two drunk idiots taking punches at each other and one of them dies. At best I'd think depraved indifference (conduct 'so wanton, so deficient in a moral sense of concern, so lacking in regard for the life or lives of others, and so blameworthy as to warrant the same criminal liability as that which the law imposes upon a person who intentionally causes a crime') or something, but I'm not a lawyer.

What the exact charge will be will vary by state. Once you get the location locked down you can google the statues for that state to figure out what the exact charge and sentencing guidelines are.

jclarkdawe · Sep 28, 2012

Here are New Hampshire's statutes for voluntary and involuntary manslaughter:

MANSLAUGHTER

I. A person is guilty of manslaughter when he causes the death of another:

(a) Under the influence of extreme mental or emotional disturbance caused by extreme provocation but which would otherwise constitute murder; or

(b) Recklessly.

II. Manslaughter shall be punishable by imprisonment for a term of not more than 30 years.
III. In addition to any other penalty imposed, if the death of another person resulted from the driving of a motor vehicle, the court may revoke the license or driving privilege of the convicted person indefinitely.

NEGLIGENT HOMICIDE

I. A person is guilty of a class B felony when he causes the death of another negligently.
II. A person is guilty of a class A felony when in consequence of being under the influence of intoxicating liquor or a controlled drug or any combination of intoxicating liquor and controlled drug while operating a propelled vehicle, as defined in RSA 637:9, III or a boat as defined in RSA 265-A:1, II, he or she causes the death of another.
III. In addition to any other penalty imposed, if the death of another person resulted from the negligent driving of a motor vehicle, the court may revoke the license or driving privilege of the convicted person for up to 7 years. In cases where the person is convicted under paragraph II, the court shall revoke the license or driving privilege of the convicted person indefinitely and the person shall not petition for eligibility to reapply for a driver’s license for at least 7 years. In a case in which alcohol was involved, the court may also require that the convicted person shall not have a license to drive reinstated until after the division of motor vehicles receives certification of installation of an ignition interlock device as described in RSA 265-A:36, which shall remain in place for a period not to exceed 5 years.

Manslaughter requires reckessness and can result in a prison sentence of not more then 30 years. Negligent manslaughter requires negligence and is punishable by up to 3.5 - 7 years in prison. Both of these would apply in a bar fight where it isn't mutual combat. (A friend of mine got a bar fight down to mutual combat from the jury -- usually doesn't happen.)

Big questions that are out there is whether your character started the fight, and whether the fatal blow would have been seen by the bystanders as intended as a fatal blow. And the next question is whether the fatal blow was legitimately being used to protect him from worse harm.

But here's a scenario for you: Big mouth is running his yap, and insults hero's girlfriend by describing her as the biggest Ho north of Miami. Hero swings at big mouth, intending to put him down in one blow. But big mouth is better then hero thinks, and comes up fighting. Fight continues, with hero restraining himself from killing the guy.

Until the big mouth kicks the hero in the nuts. Hero then delivers a fatal blow that was obviously intended to be fatal. Big mouth has reputation of insulting people.

Prosecutor charges second degree murder (intention to kill but no malice aforethought). After discussion with defense counsel, a plea deal is reached and the charge is reduced to manslaughter with a four to eight year sentence.

Best of luck,

Jim Clark-Dawe

Captcha · Sep 28, 2012

jclarkdawe said:
Here are New Hampshire's statutes for voluntary and involuntary manslaughter:

Manslaughter requires reckessness and can result in a prison sentence of not more then 30 years. Negligent manslaughter requires negligence and is punishable by up to 3.5 - 7 years in prison. Both of these would apply in a bar fight where it isn't mutual combat. (A friend of mine got a bar fight down to mutual combat from the jury -- usually doesn't happen.)

Big questions that are out there is whether your character started the fight, and whether the fatal blow would have been seen by the bystanders as intended as a fatal blow. And the next question is whether the fatal blow was legitimately being used to protect him from worse harm.

But here's a scenario for you: Big mouth is running his yap, and insults hero's girlfriend by describing her as the biggest Ho north of Miami. Hero swings at big mouth, intending to put him down in one blow. But big mouth is better then hero thinks, and comes up fighting. Fight continues, with hero restraining himself from killing the guy.

Until the big mouth kicks the hero in the nuts. Hero then delivers a fatal blow that was obviously intended to be fatal. Big mouth has reputation of insulting people.

Prosecutor charges second degree murder (intention to kill but no malice aforethought). After discussion with defense counsel, a plea deal is reached and the charge is reduced to manslaughter with a four to eight year sentence.

Best of luck,

Jim Clark-Dawe

If it WERE deemed mutual combat, would that be an absolute defense? Like, the guy would walk?

jclarkdawe · Sep 28, 2012

Captcha said:
If it WERE deemed mutual combat, would that be an absolute defense? Like, the guy would walk?

Mutual combat is usually a misdemeanor or a very low level felony (which beats manslaughter because it has less maximum time). A judge would probably sentence him to the max, which in the case of a misdemeanor would be a year.

Self defense is the only way he walks. If the other person was the instigator, if the other person swung the first punch, and if the punches your hero threw were defensive, but ended up fatal, self defense applies. Self defense is now a bit broader concept and you can be more aggressive in defending yourself. George Zimmerman's case in Florida shows how far out a claim of self-defense can now extend.

I didn't address self-defense because you said you wanted prison time (jail time is nearly always less then one year).

Best of luck,

Jim Clark-Dawe

John342 · Oct 3, 2012

You may find this case interesting.

Woman Charged After Killing Rapper With Single Punch

Read more: http://www.dreamindemon.com/2011/05...lling-rapper-with-single-punch/#ixzz28EE0PefC

I think she was eventually found not guilty.

Chris P · Oct 3, 2012

Yeah, I think no matter how consensual the fight was, the "killer" should have known not to use deadly force and is still responsible for his actions. Even if he didn't intend to use deadly force, and the departed consented to the situation, the death is still the responsibility of the killer.

Legality - consensual fight leading to death

Captcha

amschilling

jclarkdawe

Feeling lucky, Query?

Captcha

jclarkdawe

Feeling lucky, Query?

John342

Chris P

Likes metaphors mixed, not stirred