Big Brother Going Strong

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William Haskins

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like the anti-war movement, the anti-spying movement has gotten awful quiet since 2008. must mean government spying has at least leveled out, if not decreased? right?

Justice Department documents released today by the ACLU reveal that federal law enforcement agencies are increasingly monitoring Americans’ electronic communications, and doing so without warrants, sufficient oversight, or meaningful accountability.
the charts speak for themselves...

http://www.aclu.org/blog/national-s...stice-department-documents-show-huge-increase
 

Alpha Echo

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*peeks in, looks around*

Where's Don? I thought for sure he was the author of this thread!
 

William Haskins

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don's a fed, you know.

how anyone couldn't think he is an agent provocateur is beyond me.
 

CassandraW

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Ah, but if we don't have anything to hide, why should we mind the government reading our emails. Or, for that matter, listening to our phone calls, bugging our homes, patting us down randomly, and searching our homes and possessions. My body cavities are explosive-free and you all are welcome to inspect them at any time.


ETA:

Especially you, Kayleamay. I'm digging those horns.
 

Alpha Echo

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My body cavities are explosive-free and you all are welcome to inspect them at any time.


ETA:

Especially you, Kayleamay. I'm digging those horns.

Ummm....the image you've just conjured in my head...has blinded me.
 

Vince524

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Here's the thing, should Romney win, which isn't likely, but if it should happen, expect all the protests and such to start again.
 

Shadow_Ferret

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I think it depends on what you mean by quiet. There are quite a few FB pages that are point out government "atrocities," aren't partisan, and post as many things against Obama as they do any other political leader.

And personally, I'm still against the Patriot Act, Homeland Security, and all that invasive, trampling our rights stuff.
 

robeiae

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I think it depends on what you mean by quiet. There are quite a few FB pages that are point out government "atrocities," aren't partisan, and post as many things against Obama as they do any other political leader.

And personally, I'm still against the Patriot Act, Homeland Security, and all that invasive, trampling our rights stuff.
Well, sure.

But you have to admit it's no big deal, as compared to Ann Romney's horse.
 

CassandraW

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Awe. Some. Tell me he's going to get rid of the Patriot Act, too. Oh man. I could vote for a guy who'd do that.
 

CassandraW

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No need. I've been telling all my friends. And I'm pretty sure my phone is bugged.
 

Maxinquaye

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I bet If you were to go to his website he has things laid out.

Or you could even watch the upcoming debates.

I did. There's a lot about killing Osama and rescuing Chrysler (which is Italian now, btw).

There's a lot about Romney.

If there's anything about what he wants to do next, it's buried deep.
 

nighttimer

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Here's the thing, should Romney win, which isn't likely, but if it should happen, expect all the protests and such to start again.

Something else you should expect should Mittens win is the return of something much worse than "Big Brother" bullshit.

In one of his first acts, President Obama issued an executive order restricting interrogators to a list of nonabusive tactics approved in the Army Field Manual. Even as he embraced a hawkish approach to other counterterrorism issues — like drone strikes, military commissions, indefinite detention and the Patriot Act — Mr. Obama has stuck to that strict no-torture policy.


By contrast, Mr. Romney’s advisers have privately urged him to “rescind and replace President Obama’s executive order” and permit secret “enhanced interrogation techniques against high-value detainees that are safe, legal and effective in generating intelligence to save American lives,” according to an internal Romney campaign memorandum.


While the memo is a policy proposal drafted by Mr. Romney’s advisers in September 2011, and not a final decision by him, its detailed analysis dovetails with his rare and limited public comments about interrogation.


“We’ll use enhanced interrogation techniques which go beyond those that are in the military handbook right now,” he said at a news conference in Charleston, S.C., in December.


The campaign policy paper does not specify which techniques Mr. Romney should approve, saying more study was needed because Mr. Obama had “permanently damaged” the value of some by releasing memorandums detailing Bush-era techniques in April 2009.
For all our resident civil libertarians who hop around like coked-up Chicken Littles shrieking how the eye in the sky knows whether they're wearing boxers, briefs or going commando, they should be worried about President Mitt shipping their asses down to Gitmo for some water sports.

I'll make it plain. A vote for Romney is a vote for torture. Chew on that for a while, Chicken Littles. :eek:

play golf and basically shrug and mumble about the mess he inherited?

At least he doesn't torture prisoners the way his predecessor did and his would be successor wants to. :flamethrower
 

CassandraW

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Something else you should expect should Mittens win is the return of something much worse than "Big Brother" bullshit.


For all our resident civil libertarians who hop around like coked-up Chicken Littles shrieking how the eye in the sky knows whether they're wearing boxers, briefs or going commando, they should be worried about President Mitt shipping their asses down to Gitmo for some water sports.

I'll make it plain. A vote for Romney is a vote for torture. Chew on that for a while, Chicken Littles. :eek:



At least he doesn't torture prisoners the way his predecessor did and his would be successor wants to. :flamethrower

So. We're back to "Obama may have continued to stomp all over our civil liberties, but the other side is worse."


ETA:

I agree Bush chewed up our civil liberties and spat them on the floor. I raged and screamed about that for eight years. But I'll be fucking damned if I'm cutting Obama slack for doing the same thing. Yes, I give a damn about him expanding the TSA into our goddamn underwear. And I care that he signed the NDAA. And I care that he stamped his blessing on the Patriot Act all over again. He's pretty much blown our chance of going back up that slope.

And I'm tired of his supporters constantly excusing him for it when they'd be all over Bush for doing exactly the same things.



Edited again to add:

Maybe, just maybe, if more of Obama's core supporters got pissed off about this stuff, he'd take a stand -- assuming he really does object to it. I used to be sure he did. Now, I'm not so sure.
 
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nighttimer

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how did mcconnell keep obama from closing gitmo?

Ahem.

After making an unrealistic pledge to close Guantanamo Bay and suspend military commissions two of his first acts in office, Obama faced a broad-based, targeted attack led by Mitch McConnell in the Senate, who identified terrorism policy, along with spending, as a key Obama vulnerability.
Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-Ky.) opposes plans by the Obama administration to close the Guantanamo Bay prison for terror suspects.

McConnell, in a speech at the Conservative Political Action Conference (CPAC) on Friday, said the administration has some explaining to do:

“The Obama administration has not answered one simple question: ‘Where exactly will you send them?’” McConnell said. “I’ll tell you where they ought to be … right there in jail at Gitmo.”

“This new administration should show more concern for safety than symbolism,” McConnell said.
As the Republican party continues to struggle to find a voice to match that of President Obama, Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell is doing everything he can to elevate the president's decision to close the Guantanamo Bay prison facility into a winning issue for the GOP.


"For the past several weeks, Republicans in Congress have expressed serious concerns about the administration's insistence on closing Guantanamo before it has a safe alternative," McConnell said in a speech on the Senate floor this morning. "These concerns are real . . . and yet all we've gotten from the administration on this issue is silence."


That address was McConnell's 11th on the subject of Gitmo since mid-March, a drumbeat that the Kentucky senator has supplemented with an op-ed in the Washington Post on the subject and a series of television appearances and speeches -- including one at the CPAC conference in late February in which McConnell said the Obama administration "needs to show it's more concerned with safety than with symbolism."


So much focus on the issue by one of the most powerful men in the party is not an accident but rather a concerted campaign to rally the party's base behind an idea -- protecting the homeland -- rather than around any one individual.



"McConnell's consistent and persistent messaging on Guantanamo has divided Congressional Democrats and put President Obama on defense," argued GOP consultant Alex Conant. "The Leader's efforts show that the minority's message can break through even in the middle of Obama's honeymoon."

And the result?

“Amidst all the other business we’ll be dealing with this week, I’d like to take a moment to note a welcome development in the war on terror.


“For the last two years, the Obama Administration has actively sought to bring the 9/11 plotters into our communities for civilian trials, a horrible idea that rightly drew overwhelming bipartisan opposition from the American people and their elected representatives here in Congress.

“Today, the administration is announcing that it has changed course, and that Khalid Sheikh Mohammed and the others who plotted these horrible attacks will be tried in military commissions at Guantanamo Bay, rather than in a civilian trial in New York or some other U.S. city.


“This is the right outcome to the long and spirited debate that preceded this decision. Military Commissions at Guantanamo, far from the U.S. mainland, were always the right idea for a variety of compelling reasons which I and others have enumerated repeatedly over the past two years.


“For the sake of the safety and security of the American people, I’m glad the President reconsidered his position on how and where to try these detainees. Going forward, this model should be the rule rather than the exception.

“I’m sure this decision will draw widespread approval.

“It is very welcome news.”



~ Sen. Mitch McConnell
You got questions. We got answers. :rolleyes
 
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