Doctor loses license for not forcing a 10 year old to carry baby to term

That poor little girl. I hope Dr Ann Neuhaus doesn't lose her license.

Dr Neuhaus put her patient first. Her actual, living, sentient patient who had undergone a terrible trauma, and for whom birth would be a further awful ordeal.

If that's a sin, count me in with the sinners.

Well she lost her license.

I have to wonder if there is something else going on here. Were there other issues the article doesn't touch on? It just seems so ludicrous for that to be everything at issue. Then again, ludicrousness is pretty standard nowadays so who knows?

What did the girl's parents have to say? Did they consent to the procedure? If so, I don't understand what business it is of anyone but the parents, the girl and the doctor. I could see there being underlying concerns about girl's mental health, but again, if the parents consented I don't see the problem.

Stiger05 said:

I have to wonder if there is something else going on here. Where there other issues the article doesn't touch on? It just seems so ludicrous for that to be everything at issue. Then again, ludicrousness is pretty standard nowadays so who knows?

What did the girl's parents have to say? Did they consent to the procedure? If so, I don't understand what business it is of anyone but the parents, the girl and the doctor. I could see there being underlying concerns about girl's mental health, but again, if the parents consented I don't see the problem.

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I can't see any compelling reason for the parents to want this poor girl to carry the pregnancy to term. That's not to say it didn't happen like that, but...my god, the mind just boggles.

Stiger05 said:

I have to wonder if there is something else going on here. Where there other issues the article doesn't touch on? It just seems so ludicrous for that to be everything at issue. Then again, ludicrousness is pretty standard nowadays so who knows?

What did the girl's parents have to say? Did they consent to the procedure? If so, I don't understand what business it is of anyone but the parents, the girl and the doctor. I could see there being underlying concerns about girl's mental health, but again, if the parents consented I don't see the problem.

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I had thought the same thing, so I did some googling.

Kristin Neuhaus was the second-opinion doctor (second opinions being required by law in Kansas for late-term abortions) for the now deceased (murdered by a pro-lifer) Dr. Tiller, who performed third-trimester abortions, in many cases for mental health reasons, before mental health issues were excluded as a "threat of permanent harm to bodily functions" by Kansas lawmakers (I *think* in 2010, but I can't find a source). Neuhaus served as Tillman's second opinion doctor from 1999-2006. She was found to have not adequately examined 11 patients (perhaps including this 10 year old, but I didn't find that specfic either), in 2003, before giving her approval for the late-term abortions.

But damn, remind me never to google Kansas again. That state is wacked.

before mental health issues were excluded as a "threat of permanent harm to bodily functions" by Kansas lawmakers.

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This is pretty appalling.

Wow. Thus intensifying even more my resolve to never spend a cent in Kansas. This isn't moral; this is the wedge issue of the Culture War (aka the run up to the American Civil War, pt 2). A pity more young women aren't waking up to realize what kind of world they'll inhabit in a few years.

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/kansas-revokes-doctors-license-abortion-case-152745500.html

Is this the same doctor? Appears to be. The above story meshes with the ThinkProgress one. Both are from June of this year.

I don't know where the article Maxinquaye cited is getting it's info, but it's dated and neither the above nor the ThinkProgress article cite a specific case of incest and a ten-year-old.

The Yahoo piece says:

The administrative judge concluded in February that Neuhaus performed inadequate mental health exams in 2003 on 11 patients, aged 10 to 18. The judge said Neuhaus' records didn't contain the information necessary to show that she did thorough exams, and the patients' care was "seriously jeopardized."

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I'd guess that could be the ten-year-old in question. Perhaps other details weren't available 'til now. But it seems that Neuhaus lost her license for failure to meet requirements in what is a controversial law, not for performing an abortion.

Still hazy, though.

Maxinquaye said:

It wasn't the only source, only the first I saw. The same info is also reported on care2 and RH Reality Check.

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Despite the headline in the Reality Check piece, the article says this:

The cases all involved girls who sought abortions due to mental health issues from depression to suicide, with an age range from 17 years old to as young as 10. The board alleged that Neuhaus's exams were not thorough enough based on the available records provided, and that her follow up care was inadequate, as she did not recommend counseling or hospitalization afterwards.

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That's a far cry from what's in the original piece, with regard to the "why" behind the action (her losing her license).

Still doesn't mean it was right or fair. And it could be related to the case of the ten-year-old, specifically. Just seems like a but of truth-stretching to fire people up. So far.

Still doesn't mean it was right or fair. And it could be related to the case of the ten-year-old, specifically. Just seems like a but of truth-stretching to fire people up. So far.

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TBH, I'm actually more annoyed now I've found out about the mental health law than I was with the original story. It's sickening that mental health isn't considered important enough to take into account.

EDITED: Well, that's still... I don't even know what to say about this any more.

crunchyblanket said:

TBH, I'm actually more annoyed now I've found out about the mental health law than I was with the original story. It's sickening that mental health isn't considered important enough to take into account.

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Agreed, but doesn't it seem odd that a 10-year-old who was raped by her uncle would carry a fetus for 22+ weeks before seeking an abortion on mental health grounds?

crunchyblanket said:

TBH, I'm actually more annoyed now I've found out about the mental health law than I was with the original story. It's sickening that mental health isn't considered important enough to take into account.

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I think it's because pro-lifers think that the mental health argument is just an easy excuse to approve abortions. I'm not sure how detailed the psychological examination is, but I can see why they feel this way.

Chrissy said:

Agreed, but doesn't it seem odd that a 10-year-old who was raped by her uncle would carry a fetus for 22+ weeks before seeking an abortion on mental health grounds?

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Maybe she didn't show any signs or the signs that were given were misleading; maybe after the pregnancy was discovered, they were delayed by bureaucracy or by money?

Chrissy said:

Agreed, but doesn't it seem odd that a 10-year-old who was raped by her uncle would carry a fetus for 22+ weeks before seeking an abortion on mental health grounds?

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It doesn't seem odd to me.

It might take a while for a ten year old to realise that she is pregnant - and for her parents to also realise that.

Add in trauma of being raped - then for the parents to deal with the whole issue - rape and pregnancy.

Then add in the time to actually get her to a doctor, confirm the pregnancy and decide what to do.

I can easily see this taking quite a few weeks.

I wonder if the parents even knew she had been raped. Also, even if they did, the rape/pregnancy might have coincided with her first ovulation so they wouldn't even have known she could get pregnant.

It's just so sad. I'm depressed. At least she did get the abortion.

Not even getting into the mental health thing.
Physically, couldn't having a baby kill a ten year old? I doubt she would be developed enough but I'm asking because I honestly don't know enough.

CQuinlan said:

Not even getting into the mental health thing.
Physically, couldn't having a baby kill a ten year old? I doubt she would be developed enough but I'm asking because I honestly don't know enough.

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It can but not necessarily. If you'd like to be extra horrified, read the wiki list of youngest birth mothers

They're all under twelve.

jmare said:

I think it's because pro-lifers think that the mental health argument is just an easy excuse to approve abortions. I'm not sure how detailed the psychological examination is, but I can see why they feel this way.

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I used to think that way too. But when I really thought about it (with some prompting by fellow AWers), how many women carry their babies into their third trimester and then try to finagle an abortion with a mental health excuse? Seriously. I doubt it's an epidemic.

Chrissy said:

I used to think that way too. But when I really thought about it (with some prompting by fellow AWers), how many women carry their babies into their third trimester and then try to finagle an abortion with a mental health excuse? Seriously. I doubt it's an epidemic.

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I'm not saying it is or that I agree. I try to look at it from their perspective. To them, all abortions are infanticide. And from the viewpoint, I can understand why they feel the mental health argument is weak. I also understand why some pro-lifers kill abortion doctors. To the pro-lifer the doctor is killing babies. I don't agree with it, but I understand where they're coming from.

I'm personally morally opposed to abortion but I try to see the issue from both sides and I don't feel that just because I feel a certain way, that I have the right to impose my views on everybody else.