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REMLIG
06-15-2012, 08:06 AM
I need some help with information on Tennis. I can play for fun, throw the ball, hit it and rally it back and forth, and run around the court after the ball, but nothing beyond that.

What I need some help with is tennis terms, and some basic elements of the game.

How the scoring system works in a match and also in a professional game such as the ATP (Association of Tennis Professionals)?

What happens when a profession tennis player gets injured in a match?

I have a few more questions but this might get us started.

Bing Z
06-15-2012, 08:38 AM
How the scoring system works in a match and also in a professional game such as the ATP (Association of Tennis Professionals)?
Typically, men's matches are best of three but it's best of five for grand slams and Davis Cup. I think Olympics is also best of five for the final but not sure about the earlier rounds. Miami (Sony Open) is best of 3. You can check http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tennis#Scoring for the details.


What happens when a profession tennis player gets injured in a match?
a) He usually will ask for a medical timeout (through the umpire) and the tournament will send a medical trainer to check him out and give medical advice.

b) If needed, the player may withdraw from the match (& thus the tournament.) Sometimes this is called "throw in the towel" especially if it doesn't look like serious injury to the spectators/fans.

c) He sees the tournament doctor/his own doc/checks into a hospital. He may have to take a break from the tour.


I have a few more questions but this might get us started. like?

REMLIG
06-15-2012, 10:23 PM
Bing Zabriskie -- Thank you very much for your help.

You wrote - a) He usually will ask for a medical timeout (through the umpire) and the tournament will send a medical trainer to check him out and give medical advice.

How long of a timeout do they take?

What does the announcer tell the spectators in the crowd?

What does the crowd do during that time?

You wrote - b) If needed, the player may withdraw from the match (& thus the tournament.) Sometimes this is called "throw in the towel" especially if it doesn't look like serious injury to the spectators/fans.

What is the difference between throw in the towel and throw the match?Is that the same thing?

You wrote - c) He sees the tournament doctor/his own doc/checks into a hospital. He may have to take a break from the tour.

If a tennis pro is working towards ATP points what are the consequences of him throwing in the towel? Or landing in the hospital?

Bing Z
06-15-2012, 11:21 PM
How long of a timeout do they take?
What does the announcer tell the spectators in the crowd?
What does the crowd do during that time?

According to the ATP rule book (PDF download (http://www.atpworldtour.com/%7E/media/E60FB992CF9B4C86B448BC8268EA736E.ashx)) it's 3 minutes. The process is administered by the tournament-provided trainer. See a clip here (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-A6OODcLLUE).

The announcer is the chair umpire. He says "blah blah medical timeout" like this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XPXmsBWTo1U). Then the crowd do whatever they want to do--bathroom breaks, snacks, checking out/hitting on the hottie by the beefy dude, write novels on smart phones...

What is the difference between throw in the towel and throw the match?Is that the same thing?
I don't know "throw the match", but Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Match_fixing) says it is match fixing. That can get you a lifetime ban. Tennis is the world's #3 betting sport. They take it seriously.


If a tennis pro is working towards ATP points what are the consequences of him throwing in the towel? Or landing in the hospital?
There are two situations he quits a match on injury. a) Injury before the match, he "walks over" the match. b) Injury during a match, he withdraws/throws in the towel. The difference is depending on situation the loser of the previous round/qualification may take his walked-over place. In both cases this injured player gets the points he has earned up to the previous round and the prize money for the round he has reached. He will "lose" points for tournaments he will miss. He will not make money from tournaments he misses. He may or may not be paid by his commercial sponsors while he's resting at home, depending on how the endorsement contracts are written.

A player is ranked (http://www.stevegtennis.com/2012-rankings/) weekly by comparing his current performance to that of last year. In game lingo points from last year's tournament(s) come off and points the player earns now are added. It's a very complicated thing, rocket-science-like when injury or sickness are involved for they want to protect players coming off extended sick leave to be able to participate in tournaments with low/nil ranking.

What do you want to happen to your guy? State the tragedy you want and maybe we can think of something and the process he'll have to go through.

REMLIG
06-16-2012, 08:47 AM
Bing Zabriskie -- Thank you for the 285 page rule book. That is very helpful. It's a lot to read cover to cover but its a great reference to be sure I know what are the rules, and how they will apply to the character and the story.

Thank you for the video clip of Lu vs. Hewett. I wonder who the guy (in the blue shirt) that was rubbing down Lu and telling him to go out and play, when Lu kept saying he couldn't. And the umpire guy telling him the doc said he's okay so play and we'll talk about it after the game. It all didn't seem fair. Who is paying the guy in the blue shirt that is rubbing down Lu? You know the saying "Follow the money". I really wonder what his agenda is, and who signs his pay check, when the athlete is saying I'm hurt and I can't. I learned a lot from watching that.

I need to read more from the link you posted about their weekly ranking based on the year before. It's rather complex. But I need to get this right if I'm writing about it.


According to the ATP rule book (PDF download (http://www.atpworldtour.com/%7E/media/E60FB992CF9B4C86B448BC8268EA736E.ashx))

The process is administered by the tournament-provided trainer. See a clip here (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-A6OODcLLUE).

The announcer is the chair umpire. He says "blah blah medical timeout" like this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XPXmsBWTo1U).

I don't know "throw the match", but Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Match_fixing) says it is match fixing. That can get you a lifetime ban. Tennis is the world's #3 betting sport. They take it seriously.

A player is ranked (http://www.stevegtennis.com/2012-rankings/) weekly by comparing his current performance to that of last year.

What do you want to happen to your guy? State the tragedy you want and maybe we can think of something and the process he'll have to go through.

Keep in mind I haven't read everything you gave me yet, but I will. Here is the basic drift of my character so far... My famous tennis pro is one of the highest ranked in the world. He gets injured during the game in a major tournament (I haven't figured out which one yet) and he can't go on to finish that game. He is in the middle of the scoring of (I think its 18 points with the ATP). He goes out on a medical time out for this one game but can play the other up coming tournament.

I'm not sure the form of tragedy I want him to have. Any ideas?

REMLIG
06-21-2012, 03:15 AM
In what order are the pro matches played?

Is the ATP the same as the world championships or grand prix championship?

Bing Z
06-21-2012, 03:50 AM
What do you mean by "order?" Which tournament is played on 6/20/2012 and which on 7/23/2013? If that's the case, see http://www.atpworldtour.com/Tournaments/Event-Calendar.aspx Note it doesn't cover low level tournaments, but you said top player.

If you mean which match at a tournament is played on which time on which court on which day, you need to check the tournament's ORDER OF PLAY (OOP) page. They are usually issued around 7pm for tomorrow's matches. A typical one is like this (http://www.wimbledon.com/en_GB/scores/schedule/index.html).

grand prix championship has ceased to exist from 1990. ATP is the association (kinda, but not exactly like NBA) running tournaments (together with the tournament's owners). The upcoming event, the Wimbledon (called The Championships in the UK), is a Grand Slam event which is above all other big tournaments and is technically run by the ITF (another federation) and the grand slam event organizer yet ATP plays a small part in the administration and update the ranking systems.

Depending on how much you're going to cover, you may want to focus on a few events, like the next Grand Slam--U.S. Open held in NYC in late August to early September. Or you can use the Miami event.

Note that most non-slam events have title sponsors. Eg. the Miami event is called Sony Open, but most players, fans, and industry insiders don't refer to the fancy titles (as they tend to change once a few years.) They'll call it Miami/Key Biscayne. Slams are exceptions. They have their classy titles cause they're prestigious, unique, and don't change.

Becky Black
06-21-2012, 01:28 PM
What is the difference between throw in the towel and throw the match?Is that the same thing?

Absolutely not!

To throw in the towel (which I think is a boxing term actually) is to give up on the match, decide you can't go on and surrender victory to your opponent, usually because of injury when it's sport. It's a general term used for any time you give up on something you're trying to do. e.g. "I was playing Scrabble on Facebook against my brother and he was 200 points ahead of me, so I threw in the towel."

To throw the match on the other hand is to deliberately lose a sporting contest, generally for a bribe given to you by someone who's betting on the outcome. So someone who is a heavy favourite in a contest could agree (for a fee) to deliberately lose (throw) the match/fight/game so that someone can bet on the opponent at really long odds and win big. It's more common in something where the outcome is in the control of one person - like boxing or tennis, since though it's possible to get a team to throw a match, it's a lot harder to get them all to agree and of course, that's more fees to pay.

REMLIG
06-21-2012, 10:55 PM
If that's the case, see http://www.atpworldtour.com/Tournaments/Event-Calendar.aspx Note it doesn't cover low level tournaments, but you said top player.

The prizes are really high. Wow! Tennis athletes can make many millions and then even more with their sponsors.

jvc
06-22-2012, 06:26 AM
...like the next Grand Slam--U.S. Open held in NYC in late August to early September. Or you can use the Miami event.
Err, the next grand slam is Wimbledon and starts next week ;)

Bing Z
06-22-2012, 06:54 AM
Well, in a sense, the Wimbledon is already in progress. The qualification is already into the 3rd round. The players' party was held yesterday. But yeah, I should've rephrased better. :tongue

Becky Black
06-22-2012, 06:55 PM
Err, the next grand slam is Wimbledon and starts next week ;)

Ah, so that's why it's raining so much...

REMLIG
06-27-2012, 09:42 AM
I'm struggling to get the description of tennis players in a match. I tried watching the matching on YouTube but I don't know enough of the technical terms.

I just found a book "COACHING TENNIS: Technical and Tactical Skills (http://absolutewrite.com/forums/e)". Any of you heard of it? It looks kinda good.

I think I might be able to get a better grip on the movements of the game and describe what my characters are doing better.

Becky Black
06-27-2012, 12:18 PM
Are you able to watch coverage of Wimbledon? That's running right now for the next two weeks.

Here's a few links just from a Google search for "tennis" that could give you some basics about tennis and of what's going on in the world of tennis right now. Read some of the news reports about matches to get a feel for them.

But there's no substitute for watching footage of matches - or going to one! That's where you get a feel for the flow of the game and the atmosphere and just how everything happens.

http://www.tennis.com/
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/tennis/
http://www.wimbledon.com/en_GB/index.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tennis

Bing Z
06-27-2012, 01:12 PM
I second Becky's suggestion in watching Wimbledon. ESPN has live coverage while Tennis Channel repeats at night.

As for technical terms, while you need to understand them, you are not a play-by-play announcer writing for diehard tennis fans. Look at the following jargon-filled (and badly written) scene.

Baker hits a kick serve. Djokovic returns with a slice. Baker chips and charges. For a change, Djokovic hits a cross-court windshield wiper forehand but Baker manages to intercept and hits a drop volley. Great defense by Djokovic--he glides over and hits a down-the-line. The ball paints the line. Djokovic bagels Baker! What portion of your readers do you think will understand it? You need to translate the actions and mental struggles into layman terms. Like most other sports, a large part of tennis is played in the head--decision making, adaptability, coolness, stress sustainability, will power, etc. I'd expect good tennis scenes in novels written from these perspectives.

If you want to cover training, this video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3jwh0GfA_eo) has lots of unimaginable. You just have to be creative in naming the moves. There is another YouTube video about Nadal that covers mostly fitness drill (oh those muscles).

Of course, you can also read autobiographies by (former) top players. They cover behind-the-curtain issues, more reader-friendly and enjoyable than coaching tutorials. Some examples:


A Champion's Mind: Lessons from a Life in Tennis (http://www.amazon.com/Champions-Mind-Lessons-Life-Tennis/dp/030738330X) by Pete Sampras
Open (http://www.amazon.com/Open-ebook/dp/B003062GEE) by Andre Agassi
Winning Ugly: Mental Warfare in Tennis--Lessons from a Master (http://www.amazon.com/Winning-Ugly-Mental-Warfare-Tennis-Lessons/dp/067188400X/ref=pd_sim_b_3) by Brad Gilbert (he wasn't that great as a player, but has been a top coach, is now ESPN commentator. He's written an article about money side of coaching on Forbes that's pretty insightful)
Rafa (http://www.amazon.com/Rafa-Rafael-Nadal/dp/1401324517/ref=pd_sim_b_5) by Rafael Nadal
Roger Federer: The Greatest (http://www.amazon.com/Roger-Federer-Greatest-Chris-Bowers/dp/1843583895/ref=pd_sim_b_4) by Chris Bowers

REMLIG
06-27-2012, 09:18 PM
Thank you for your help. This will help me a lot!

I just tuned into Wimbledon on TV. I'm going to watch and listen.

The next understanding I need is in what order are the tournaments played and won in order to become one of the best tennis players in the world?

Are they the Australian Open, the French Open, Wimbledon, and the US Open in that order?

Bufty
06-27-2012, 10:45 PM
Hope you enjoy the tennis and learn more about it.

Re your extra questions - try Googling -it really is simple, you know, and yes, if you're going to write about something you should make some personal effort to find out about it.

Try searching-

Tennis Grand Slam Tournaments 2012 or

How does the Tennis Ranking system work?

Thank you for your help. This will help me a lot!

I just tuned into Wimbledon on TV. I'm going to watch and listen.

The next understanding I need is in what order are the tournaments played and won in order to become one of the best tennis players in the world?

Are they the Australian Open, the French Open, Wimbledon, and the US Open in that order?

REMLIG
06-28-2012, 06:11 AM
Bufty -- I understand where you are coming from I can do that... thanks.

There is something about human interaction that is missing in today's world. I would rather have interaction with other people that know and love the sport than google it.

REMLIG
06-28-2012, 07:34 AM
I'm reading about the tournaments and I need to get my facts right.

I haven't set an exact date and time of my novel yet, but it is in the modern day between 1980-2010. And I need to get some idea of the months and locations of these tournaments.

Have the tournament locations changed in the last 30 years?

For instance the Grand Slam have they always been these dates and locations?

January Australian Open Melbourne
May–June French Open Paris
June–July Wimbledon London
August–September US Open New York City

The same with the Masters Tournaments dates and locations?

March - Indian Wells Masters
March - Miami Masters
April - Monte Carlo Masters
May - Madrid Masters
May - Rome Masters
August - Canada Masters Montreal, Toronto
August - Cincinnati Masters
October - Shanghai Masters
November - Paris Masters

Then I see there is the ATP World Tour 500 series.

Rotterdam Netherlands
Memphis United States
Acapulco Mexico
Dubai United Arab Emirates
Barcelona Spain
Hamburg Germany
Washington United States
Beijing China
Tokyo Rakuten Japan
Basel Switzerland
Valencia Spain

Where I'm unsure and getting a bit confused is, how does the pro make his way up to the Grand Slam each year?

They have to work their way up right?

But where do they start? At the ATP, then the Masters, and finally the Grand Slam?

REMLIG
06-29-2012, 09:53 AM
Becky Black -- I did as you suggested. Thanks that was a great idea. Today I watched history be made. Rafael Nadal ousted in Round 2. It was amazing, moreover shocking to see it happen. It was like a 'nobody' was wiping the courts with a superstar and he was in shock as it happen. And I also watched the Williams' sisters play too.

I still have a lot of question I posted some in a previous post. I'm reading a lot and getting a better understanding of the game. I still am trying to figure out how the scoring works, in single and in doubles.

Bing Zabriskie -- I ordered a couple of those books. Thanks.

I'm going to watch more tomorrow. I'm sure I'll have more questions...

Thanks everyone for your help.

Bing Z
06-29-2012, 01:20 PM
Have the tournament locations changed in the last 30 years?

http://tennis.webz.cz/index.html and http://www.stevegtennis.com/yearend.htm have info from 1978 to 2001. http://www.stevegtennis.com/ has everything since. Anything you can't find on these sites, try Wikipedia.

To gain an idea of how players advance, look up a (few) real player(s). For example, Andy Roddick (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andy_roddick)'s early day results can be found on ITF (which carries info of grassroot ITF events (http://beta.itftennis.com/ProCircuit/players/player/profile.aspx?PlayerID=10022361) & Juniors Profile (http://beta.itftennis.com/juniors/players/player/profile.aspx?playerid=10022361)) & then ATP for "tour" level results (http://www.atpworldtour.com/Tennis/Players/Top-Players/Andy-Roddick.aspx?t=pa). Read through every year of his career results. You can do the same for Rederer, Nadal, Safin, etc. But Roddick is American (one usual trait among them is suck on clay), whose career path might suit your story better.

Becky Black
06-29-2012, 01:59 PM
Becky Black -- I did as you suggested. Thanks that was a great idea. Today I watched history be made. Rafael Nadal ousted in Round 2. It was amazing, moreover shocking to see it happen. It was like a 'nobody' was wiping the courts with a superstar and he was in shock as it happen. And I also watched the Williams' sisters play too.

Great timing that you managed to pick such a dramatic match to watch! :)

REMLIG
06-30-2012, 03:31 AM
Bing Zabriskie -- Some of those books you suggested came in so I'll be busy reading. Thanks for all the other links.

I watched more of the excitement at Wimbledon today. I also called around my local sports bars to see if they rerun the tournaments. None of them to.

I'm still trying to figure out the scoring. I watched these videos on YouTube. I noticed people are visiting this thread so, I'll share my finding in the links below, maybe other writers are gaining knowledge too.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CVXhBccQH4E&feature=fvwrel

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Spha5McXZU&feature=related (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Spha5McXZU&feature=related)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F_tScfdlKcI&feature=related

It's still rather confusing...

REMLIG
07-11-2012, 11:20 AM
I have developed a re-newed found interest in tennis.

As some of you suggested I watched Wimbeldon on TV then last week it was rained out. It didn't air on TV last Saturday and Sunday on the ESPN channels I get. Then I see the result on http://espn.go.com/tennis/ I'm so sorry I missed it live.
What happened that they didn't air it? I missed it.

I'm learning so much, I know it will help in my writing. Thank you for your help.

Sergioliving
05-09-2014, 09:59 PM
If you need more information in the future about tennis or other sports I can help you ( I´m writting for one local newspaper in Spain about tennis) and you can help me checking my blog of Living Valencia (http://blog.livingvalencia.com/en/)where I,m writing in english and I´m spanish speaker.

Cath
05-10-2014, 05:18 AM
This thread hasn't been active for a long time. I'm closing it.