View Full Version : Makarov vs. P7

Michael Myers
03-30-2012, 05:32 AM
When on extended assignment in San Francisco, would my Russian spetsnaz hero be packing a Makarov or a P7?


03-30-2012, 05:48 AM
I can't answer your question, but if he was new in country it would be easier to just buy a gun here in a private sale. Plus, there might be less tell-tale evidence in some cases.

Just an idea.

Drachen Jager
03-30-2012, 06:36 AM
I think DeNiro's character summed it up well in Ronin. "It's a toolbox, you use the tool you need."

Weapon preference doesn't really enter into it for a pro. They'll take what's available and put it to good use.

Steve Collins
03-30-2012, 07:09 PM
He can have whatever you want him to. I agree with the others unless he actually came in with the weapon he'd use whatever he could get his hands on. The favourite close quarter weapon they use is the sharpened entrenching tool.

04-01-2012, 05:09 AM
I'll go with probably not a Makarov. There's only one gun chambered for 9mm Makarov, and the ammunition isn't terribly common in the US. Since it isn't actually the same bore as other 9mm, it would be pretty noticeable forensically. It would be pretty easy to trace any ammunition purchases.

If he got desperate he could use .380 ACP with a Makarov, but that I've heard it doesn't work so well (http://makarov.com/makfaq.html). There are aftermarket kits to convert, and some were made in .380 ACP. So you could go with .380, but there are better guns in that caliber. It's also not the best caliber.

You'd be better off going with something where any ammunition you had to purchase or use would get lost in the noise. 9mm Parabellum would be probable. Since it's the caliber used by the Russian Army (http://world.guns.ru/handguns/hg/rus/yarygin-pya-grach-e.html), he'd be pretty used to it.

04-01-2012, 04:32 PM
Have him pick up a gun from a house which has been set up - fifty years earlier - for this purpose. He walks in, past a middle-class family watching middle-class TV (haha, sorry for stereotypes). Everyone ignores him. He goes upstairs. He pulls down access to attic. Climbs into attic, retrieves a weapon. Walks back down and out.

Or, he waits til the kids are in school and husband at work, and/or wife and goes in and does the same.

After he uses the weapon, (which is generic, US-made, pick any weapon you want), he throws it in the nearest dumpster (hidden in a fast-food bag).

Anyhow, that's how I'd do it.

04-01-2012, 07:51 PM
What time period, under what circumstances, and will he need to keep using the gun?

Drachen Jager
04-01-2012, 08:22 PM
I wouldn't do the nearest dumpster Jaksen. The police often search nearby dumpsters. Walk five blocks at least first.

Dave Hardy
04-04-2012, 07:40 PM
I'm not a Russian Spetznaz commando (I don't even play one on TV), but I have fired a Makarov plenty of times.

Ammo is not too hard to get commercially, though less common than other types. What's available is often rather cheap and corrosive Chinese-made stuff. But, the sort of commercial-grade Makarov you find here is not terribly high-quality. Mine has occasionally had bits fall out while being fired. They fit back in though and it still shoots. IIRC, Makarov's are the sort of thing they issued to cops in the USSR.

So, figure what is the scenario:

The agent has to infiltrate totally clean and obtain whatever firearm is available. Quality doesn't matter since it will be used once on an unsuspecting target from a range of two feet and discarded.
The agent and weapon are a unit. He must use a top-quality firearm sighted in for a left-handed shooter who walks with a limp, etc...
He is only authorized to carry a .9mm Makarov because the Alternate Sidearm Waiver D/7-.89q was not filed with the Department of Socialist Armaments in the Ministry for Liquidations.
Some other issue...

04-25-2012, 03:29 PM
have you considered a Stechkin ASB or an OTS-33 Pernach?

as the other posters suggest, the Makarov is a rather agricultural weapon meant for mass production for the services, and since 2003 the standard Russian sidearm is the MP-443 Grach


04-25-2012, 08:02 PM
An intelligence operative will only be successful if he/she remains undetected. Blending in is the key. He/she would make use of whatever firearm (handgun) is most prevalent/common to the area of operation (and meets the tactical requirement of the mission). Pros are well trained in the use of what's likely available.

Cry Havoc
04-26-2012, 01:41 AM
I'm no Sonny Puzikas, but what's the situation? Is he going into a deep cover op? Or is he counter-guerilla? Is he trying to give a false flag? Or does he want to 'send a message' that the real Bad Men are here?

Answer these questions, and you'll have the question to your original one.

Edit: I own a Bulgarian Makarov, and its a good little gun. I can usually do a group from 15 yards away that the bottom of a paper cup will cover, and I haven't had a jam yet. There is good ammo, generally Brown/Silver/Golden Bear, in jacketed or HP as well. But the above poster is right - do NOT try running .380 through a 9X18 Makarov.

05-05-2012, 12:39 AM
What is your character's status? Is he here on a Diplomatic Passport? If so, he could have a pistol brought in in a diplomatic pouch and he could carry it wherever, as he isn't subject to search or arrest or, if he is searched or arrested, he would be released as soon as it is established he has immunity.

If he's not here on a Diplomatic Passport, then his having or carrying a pistol would be illegal. Once again though, if his agency wants him to have it, they likely would have brought it in in a Diplomatic Pouch. A Makarov certainly would be appropriate as it is Russian mil issue.

A HK P7? Not so much. That's a German pistol that is also out of production. It's also pretty pricey. I can't think of any reason that makes sense for a Spetnaz guy.

Burl Kenneth Sloan
05-05-2012, 01:01 AM
Whatever the contact at the Russian embassy gives him. Probably a cheap High-Point or Kel-Tec or something.

Unless he needs a specialty weapon.