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Diana_Rajchel
01-09-2012, 11:12 PM
Llewellyn acquistions editor Elysia Gallo wrote two posts about Llewellyn author's works getting posted wholesale to the Internet after a pirate site posted almost 40 works. This is the first, talking about the legality (http://www.llewellyn.com/blog/2012/01/myths-about-pirated-books/). This is the second, in response to the person who posted the works (http://www.llewellyn.com/blog/2012/01/deep-thoughts-from-a-book-pirate/).

I'm sure many of you have seen this already, and there's discussion elsewhere, but I thought some discussion here might be good, too.

Velma deSelby Bowen
01-10-2012, 01:13 AM
I am fascinated, in bad ways, by the justifications used by the pirate, and by people supporting piracy. It makes me shake my head a lot.

Diana_Rajchel
01-10-2012, 07:36 AM
I am fascinated, in bad ways, by the justifications used by the pirate, and by people supporting piracy. It makes me shake my head a lot.

I had my say about it on my blog. I'm accustomed to my work getting reposted wholesale. It's frustrating since Llewellyn actually makes this relatively easy to do with its annuals writers. In my case, I'm taking in Creative Commons approach for my online work where I do hold a copyright (with exceptions that I note) and by allowing if not encouraging derivative works from my own material, as a bridge to people beginning to create their own work and grow it from their own experiences rather than just copying it outright.

copperbeech
01-10-2012, 06:57 PM
I corresponded with several of the authors whose work was on that site. They had no idea. Several of the publishers took action, and the site was taken down, either by the owner or the ISP. Either way, it's just amazing that people still justify taking money from others so effortlessly. A lot of Pagans seem to think that because someone is Pagan they're more honest, but everyone has blinders. I wonder if this chick learned anything from her experience, or if she can turn her passion for providing to the lesser fortunate into a real way to provide that doesn't involve stealing from someone else.

Foinah
01-10-2012, 09:03 PM
Llewellyn acquistions editor Elysia Gallo wrote two posts about Llewellyn author's works getting posted wholesale to the Internet after a pirate site posted almost 40 works. This is the first, talking about the legality (http://www.llewellyn.com/blog/2012/01/myths-about-pirated-books/). This is the second, in response to the person who posted the works (http://www.llewellyn.com/blog/2012/01/deep-thoughts-from-a-book-pirate/).

I'm sure many of you have seen this already, and there's discussion elsewhere, but I thought some discussion here might be good, too.
Thank you so very much for posting this!!!!

I understand what the clueless woman was trying to do, but she went about in a certainly unpagan way.

I found the tone of the second blog post a little too sarcastic, but I also understand the frustration when it appears you are speaking to a brick wall. Obviously the website owner needed to be treated like a four year old child.

"Honey, look me in the eye. Now repeat back what I just said to you. I want you to hear me and understand why you are in trouble. Okay, here's a hug, but you are still in trouble. Don't do it again. Now go sit on the thinking step and accept the consequences."

Diana_Rajchel
01-11-2012, 12:02 AM
I corresponded with several of the authors whose work was on that site. They had no idea. Several of the publishers took action, and the site was taken down, either by the owner or the ISP. Either way, it's just amazing that people still justify taking money from others so effortlessly. A lot of Pagans seem to think that because someone is Pagan they're more honest, but everyone has blinders. I wonder if this chick learned anything from her experience, or if she can turn her passion for providing to the lesser fortunate into a real way to provide that doesn't involve stealing from someone else.


She certainly wasn't willing to learn, that's evident. You can only teach the willing, alas.

I hear what you're saying about the assumption that "Pagan" in any way equal "more honest" or automatically equals "good intentions." After all, there's a whole LOT of kinds of Pagan, and as evidenced by this incident, we can use our beliefs to justify our actions rather than to guide them the same as any other subset of a religious subset.

I also find this movement of "Pagan" and "unPagan" that has cropped up in the last five years quite troubling. A Pagan can do something pretty much recognized as "wrong" and still be a Pagan. When a Christian commits a crime, that person is still Christian - even though other Christians sure don't like what that person did, either. I prefer to operate on the assumptions that Pagans are not morally superior and are equally accountable for their actions.

I've noticed that Pagans as a culture/series of cultures have a really weird reasoning loop when it comes to money; it someimtes leads to stuff like this happening. There's a woman I know locally who has a violent hate-on for Starhawk, not because she disagrees with Starhawk's approach to spirituality, but because she accepts speaking fees. I've also been told when trying to help a university Pagan organization make itself sustainable that the work I was doing "should just happen by magic," like it "magically" appeared in a local calendar so the person "magically" showed up. There are here and there serious logic holes as to the practical work that has to be done.

I think in cases like this, because so many do not feel the physical work involved in writing a book and never see the scads of people involved in producing one, they also do not recognize that even when the book goes out of print, there is still something that the originator needs to receive for the efforts.

My solution, personally, is to try to encourage people to put in the work of making their own. My ideas is that if they feel what it's like to create, to be judged and to risk, they'll learn to respect the other creators.

Diana_Rajchel
01-11-2012, 12:06 AM
Thank you so very much for posting this!!!!

I understand what the clueless woman was trying to do, but she went about in a certainly unpagan way.

I found the tone of the second blog post a little too sarcastic, but I also understand the frustration when it appears you are speaking to a brick wall. Obviously the website owner needed to be treated like a four year old child.

"Honey, look me in the eye. Now repeat back what I just said to you. I want you to hear me and understand why you are in trouble. Okay, here's a hug, but you are still in trouble. Don't do it again. Now go sit on the thinking step and accept the consequences."

Hee! I know the woman who wrote the Llewellyn posts personally, and I could TOTALLY see her doing this.

copperbeech
01-11-2012, 04:45 PM
So well said, Diana. The issue of balanced exchange for work/service amongst Pagans remains a hot topic. Artist compensation is a concern across the board. It says a lot that so many were angered that this involved the actions of a Pagan against other pagans. We're not immune to the eco/socio-cultural issues any other collective must overcome.