E-books and Piracy

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gothicangel

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http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencet...housands-turn-sites-download-free-eBooks.html

One pirate website boasts: ‘With a Kindle there is pretty much no protection against pirated books. There are programs which can simply convert any piece of text into the proper format and it will show on your Kindle as if you had bought it!’
It is estimated that up to 20 per cent of eBook downloads are from pirate sites.

The Publishers Association issued 115,000 legal threats to websites to stop them offering free pirated books in 2011, a rise of 130 per cent on 2010.

Old news, but I think the comments area is far more interesting. Could also just be the morality of DM readers of course.
 
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bearilou

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Many of the comments (and usually comments in any discussion on ebook piracy) revolve around the (mis?)understanding that ebooks are cheaper to produce.

But are they? I ask in earnest because I don't think I recall anyone discussing the numbers, even in vague terms, of the difference between the work/time/money going into a print book and the work/time/money going into an ebook.

If it's ebook only, are the costs the same as a print? Are publishers trying to recoup expenses for the print when they release an ebook? Is there more work that goes into making a print available for eformat and that justifies the high(er) price?

I just wonder if there are some erroneous assumptions being made about value (or perceived value) and that maybe if there were more discussion revolving around the printing process (and how ebooks fit in), it might clear up a few of those preconceived notions.
 

Alitriona

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The disrespect for authors in the comments is upsetting, so many dislikes for author comments. People want free entertainment. If it's there for free, many still will not pay even a low price because free trumps all. Some justify to themselves by saying ebooks are expensive, if they were cheaper, they'd pay. I believe they are the same people who would come up with some other excuse.

Judging by all the other pirate threads, no doubt some will come on with long posts why that isn't so. I've seen nothing to convince me otherwise as yet.
 

seun

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Why am I not at all surprised by the comments from Mail readers? The biggest surprise is the lack of immigrants are stealing our books comments. And that they cause cancer.
 

OtterFactory

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Piracy is like going into the author's house, stealing his dog, dressing it up like a cat, taking photos of it, and putting them up on the Internet and captioning them with rude comments and crudely drawn MS Paint graffiti!!

(Just to get the ball rolling ;))
 

Chekurtab

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Piracy will always be there. I think it's important for the authors and publishing industry to be on the same page. Individual writers have no recourse, but putting the efforts together, we can fight piracy.
 

Amadan

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Great Piracy Debate aside, the spectacular level of ignorance about technology and ebooks is just appalling.

Creating pirate copies of published books is simple and can be done using a computer and a scanner in a relatively short period of time

Yeah, scanners have been around for quite a while now, and before that we had these things called photocopiers...

Freely available software which people can download to their home computers is able to convert just about any document file for reading on a Kindle or other ereader.

... and this is a bad thing? I love how they talk about perfectly legitimate technology -- which happens to be usable for piracy, just like scanners and photocopiers -- as if it's some kind of illicit hacker invention.

One pirate website boasts: ‘With a Kindle there is pretty much no protection against pirated books. There are programs which can simply convert any piece of text into the proper format and it will show on your Kindle as if you had bought it!’

That... isn't even piracy. And Kindles have nothing to do with the difficulty or lack thereof of pirating/converting books.

It is estimated that up to 20 per cent of eBook downloads are from pirate sites.

"By me. I estimated that right now while writing this article."

In some cases, Amazon and Apple are charging more for an eBook download than the real book.

I don't think I've ever read a Mail article that appeared to be written by someone not suffering rectal-cranial inversion.
 

areteus

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Nothing is ever free to produce because everything takes time and time is money. Anyone who is prepared to give away time for free is selling themselves short. Therefore, nothing should ever be free. Ebooks are cheaper to make, true, but not free therefore they should never be given away for free.

In addition, the old adage 'anything we obtain cheaply we esteem lightly' applies here.
 

Max Vaehling

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Sidebar: If you want to scandalize a problem, don't bring up estimates of "up to 20%". That's ridiculous!

Make it "up to 80%"! Now we're talking! And it's just as true, because even if it's really only 5%, it is in the realm of "up to" 80%.
 

The Lonely One

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As for statistics...any Todd Snider fans?

Though I guess my link to a pirated song doesn't help my case much.

And while I think a lot of arguments against pirating aren't well-formulated, none of the pro-pirating arguments are good.

Forget about all the opinions of the actual authors and companies that lose money to piracy, think about the mindset of the person pirating--who at best is a young person whose brain doesn't fully comprehend their actions, or otherwise is a selfish a*hole who won't fork out a measly 5-15 bucks for a book that took years to get to them.

I was a teenager/young adult once. I've downloaded my fair share of music albums and video games.

I probably was romantacized by the idea that "most of that money goes to the record labels/publisher" or whomever, not the artist. But why is that any kind of excuse, no matter what percentage the author gets?

I wouldn't walk past someone in the street and pickpocket a piece of lint, let alone fractions of a profit. If anything, that's even MORE reason to pay, because it's harder for the artist to make money on the product than the representative company.

Also, why would I want the companies that produce the things I consume to not have an income?

I guess in summation I'm saying I've not heard an argument for stealing things that clearly don't belong to you (and no don't feed me any of that "art belongs to everyone" crap), that isn't just a coverup for selfishness.

P.S.: I can't read through the comments on that link, they make me too angry. It's like the comments on any other news site--worthless, unthoughtful one-liners by cretinous morons. Why I fought against having "comment" sections that weren't at the least HEAVILY moderated on news sites. It makes them less legit, like if Jerry Springer told the news or something. Bunch of racist, inbred heehaws, the worst of the worst, are the only ones who usually have enough self-importance to post.
 
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Many of the comments (and usually comments in any discussion on ebook piracy) revolve around the (mis?)understanding that ebooks are cheaper to produce.

Not really--you might, depending on the book--save a buck or two. Maybe.

Most of the costs of professionally producing a book happen before the book is sent to the printer; a publisher doing a large print run (5k or more--and 10K is still fairly common) pays about 2.50/book for a hardcover, and anywhere from under a dollar to 1.75 for paperback.

But the author's advance, editing, production (copy editing, proofing, design, compositing (if there are illustrations), typesetting, cover art, etc.) are the major costs. And those costs are all shared with the ebook.

Once the file forks (one version going to a printer, and another going to the ebook production) there is additional work. The book needs to be flowed (turned into an ebook), front and back matter created, cover art revised, QA has to be done. There may be fees for art (digital licensing is different) and a license for DRM. Then the retailer (Amazon, etc.) takes a cut.

Plus you have additional costs for ebooks--you need to maintain a separate raw materials archive, for instance.
 

kuwisdelu

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Not really--you might, depending on the book--save a buck or two. Maybe.

Most of the costs of professionally producing a book happen before the book is sent to the printer; a publisher doing a large print run (5k or more--and 10K is still fairly common) pays about 2.50/book for a hardcover, and anywhere from under a dollar to 1.75 for paperback.

But the author's advance, editing, production (copy editing, proofing, design, compositing (if there are illustrations), typesetting, cover art, etc.) are the major costs. And those costs are all shared with the ebook.

Once the file forks (one version going to a printer, and another going to the ebook production) there is additional work. The book needs to be flowed (turned into an ebook), front and back matter created, cover art revised, QA has to be done. There may be fees for art (digital licensing is different) and a license for DRM. Then the retailer (Amazon, etc.) takes a cut.

Plus you have additional costs for ebooks--you need to maintain a separate raw materials archive, for instance.

Is there a source for all this somewhere that would be easy to point people to? It's a misconception I see everywhere, but I'm not generally knowledgeable enough to clear it up.
 

Al Stevens

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Plus you have additional costs for ebooks--you need to maintain a separate raw materials archive, for instance.
Print edition books have additional post-production costs, too. Warehousing and shipping, for example. And the physical processing of returns.
 

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Is there a source for all this somewhere that would be easy to point people to? It's a misconception I see everywhere, but I'm not generally knowledgeable enough to clear it up.

I'll go find Charlie Stross' links.

Honestly, though, in terms of places like new papers outside of AW, I don't bother anymore.

It's wearing to have to deal with people who don't actually read much, and who are SURE that the greedy publishers are ripping them off.
 

Pacze Moj

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I don't understand how "pirate" websites are cashing in on eBook piracy if the websites are facilitating free downloads. Advertising?

In all likelihood, these websites collect, sort and post links to other sites that host the files (like rapidshare) or else torrents (in which case, there is no one host.)

It's a case of Somali pirates raiding a European cargo vessel that's carrying valuable artworks, taking photos of that artwork, putting those photos somewhere, telling a third party the location of those photos, that third party publishing the location of the photos for free for all to see, and the Daily Mail calling the third party a "pirate" that's cashing in on the theft of the artworks (which were never actually stolen.)

As for stealing lint:

Lint is a thing. Things can be stolen. Ideas cannot be stolen. Copyright, moreover, is not a form of property (and property itself is merely a relationship, never a thing itself.) "Intellectual property" is a misnomer. Walking into a book store, taking a book and walking out of the store without paying is theft. Walking into a book store, photocopying a book and walking out of the store without paying is not theft. It's a violation of copyright. But so is walking into a book store, photocopying a book, paying for that book and then walking out of the store.

So when it comes to "pirating" eBooks, there doesn't have to be a pro-stealing argument, because no one is stealing anything. Unless, of course, someone steals a physical book from somewhere, then digitizes it, etc. In that case, the original taking is theft, but not the subsequent digitalization, uploads, whatever.
 

Alitriona

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I don't understand how "pirate" websites are cashing in on eBook piracy if the websites are facilitating free downloads. Advertising?

Yeah, advertising. I've also seen people charge for ebooks. One woman on facebook and twitter was boasting 500 dollars a week from her personal blog. Needless to say that was easy enough to get shut down.

In all likelihood, these websites collect, sort and post links to other sites that host the files (like rapidshare) or else torrents (in which case, there is no one host.)

ShareTerm Papers is one site I know was hosting the files. Some members didn't seem to grasp 900 or so share(for example) wasn't the equivalent of the number of times a paperback would be shared without falling apart. In their defense, the moderators are fast about taking down posts as soon as they are alerted and have created an opt-out list authors can add their name to so as not to continuously have to chase them up.

It's a case of Somali pirates raiding a European cargo vessel that's carrying valuable artworks, taking photos of that artwork, putting those photos somewhere, telling a third party the location of those photos, that third party publishing the location of the photos for free for all to see, and the Daily Mail calling the third party a "pirate" that's cashing in on the theft of the artworks (which were never actually stolen.)

No, it's really not at all. The copy of the ebook in the case of pirating is not a photo or a photocopy. It is an exactly replica of the original file and indistinguishable. Your comparison is one person having a painting from one of the masters in their living room while their neighbor looks at a photo on their computer, as opposed to two people on different sides of an ocean looking at the exact same file on their ereader that the original purchaser has on their ereader.

EFA: I know some pirate files are actually rubbish and not replicas.
 
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Pacze Moj

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No, it's really not at all. The copy of the ebook in the case of pirating is not a photo or a photocopy. It is an exactly replica of the original file and indistinguishable. Your comparison is one person having a painting from one of the masters in their living room while their neighbor looks at a photo on their computer, as opposed to two people on different sides of an ocean looking at the exact same file on their ereader that the original purchaser has on their ereader.

EFA: I know some pirate files are actually rubbish and not replicas.
In most cases, the copy has had its digital-lock removed, making the copy different from the original.
 

Alitriona

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In most cases, the copy has had its digital-lock removed, making the copy different from the original.

Because once DRM is broken it's okay to pirate. :Shrug:

If there is DRM.

If you are an author and if you want to share your books free, go right ahead. Have a ball with it. No one other than my publisher and me has a right to make that decision for me.

Generally, I honestly can't understand why this is a hard concept to grasp.
 

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This mulberry bush is downtrodden with bootprints.
 

Pacze Moj

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Because once DRM is broken it's okay to pirate. :Shrug:

If there is DRM.

If you are an author and if you want to share your books free, go right ahead. Have a ball with it. No one other than my publisher and me has a right to make that decision for me.

Generally, I honestly can't understand why this is a hard concept to grasp.
My point was that if the original-file has DRM and the copy-file doesn't, the copy is not an exact replica of the original, just like a photograph is not an exact replica of a painting.

The concept is hard to grasp because the concept "your" is hard to grasp when it comes to novels, stories and poems. When you make a sculpture, you own the sculpture. When you write a story, you do not own the story. No one can ever hold any form of property in a story. That's why a story cannot be stolen (or pirated.) And that's why using those terms is misleading. It's also manipulative because it morally-equates copyright infringement with, say, looting a Dutch galleon.

The novel you wrote: it's only ever "your" novel in the sense that you're the creator and you have certain exclusive rights for a certain period. It's not "your" novel in the same way that the sock on your foot is yours.
 
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