TN lawmaker who sponsored bill to allow guns in bars arrested drunk with loaded gun

ColoradoGuy · Oct 12, 2011

You can't make this stuff up.

A Tennessee lawmaker who sponsored a controversial bill to allow handguns to be carried in bars was arrested Tuesday for driving under the influence and possessing a handgun while under the influence.

He's loaded, his gun's loaded, but, by God, he's got his freedoms . . to kill you in several ways.

Williebee · Oct 12, 2011

I'd give you a *snerk* but the stupidity is just too sad.

Zoombie · Oct 12, 2011

No one on this site has ever argued against persecuting people who abuse their freedoms. Freedom always ends the instant someone else's nose begins.

Always. ALWAYS.

Torgo · Oct 12, 2011

Looking at the picture, my first thought was "Looks like I picked the wrong week to give up sniffing glue!"

Snowstorm · Oct 12, 2011

Hopefully, incentive for him to resign.

ColoradoGuy · Oct 12, 2011

He hadn't shot at anybody. So that's a plus.

One report says he was arrested next to the Vanderbilt University campus and hospital. I did my residency there. There's a lot of folks darting back and forth across the streets in the neighborhood.

Williebee · Oct 12, 2011

I'm waiting for the "I have learned the error of my ways, can I have my gun back now." media interview.

benbradley · Oct 12, 2011

ColoradoGuy said:
A Tennessee lawmaker who sponsored a controversial bill to allow handguns to be carried in bars was arrested Tuesday for driving under the influence and possessing a handgun while under the influence.

Oh no - now a judge or probation officer will undoubtedly introduce him to the "Friends of Bill W." and he'll eventually introduce a bill to introduce every drinker in Tennessee to the Friends of Bill. The church basements are going to be packed, and the attendees may be packin'.

Don · Oct 12, 2011

Sounds like the law worked. What's the beef?

Zoombie · Oct 12, 2011

Oh, and the reasoning behind my post is in reference to this bit.

He's loaded, his gun's loaded, but, by God, he's got his freedoms . . to kill you in several ways.

No one ever has freedom to kill anyone, save in self defense.

ColoradoGuy · Oct 12, 2011

Williebee said:
I'm waiting for the "I have learned the error of my ways, can I have my gun back now." media interview.

No doubt his constituents are concerned about his poor judgement -- not the whole drinking and driving with a loaded pistol thing, but his choice of firearm. A puny .38 special? You could hardly stop a hamster with that thing. Why isn't he carrying a real peace-and-freedom keeper? Like maybe a howitzer towed behind his car? The guy is just asking to be challenged by a proper candidate with a proper sense of ballistics.

ColoradoGuy · Oct 12, 2011

Zoombie said:
Oh, and the reasoning behind my post is in reference to this bit.

No one ever has freedom to kill anyone, save in self defense.

Better check the batteries on your Irony Meter.

Don · Oct 12, 2011

ColoradoGuy said:
No doubt his constituents are concerned about his poor judgement -- not the whole drinking and driving with a loaded pistol thing, but his choice of firearm. A puny .38 special? You could hardly stop a hamster with that thing. Why isn't he carrying a real peace-and-freedom keeper? Like maybe a howitzer towed behind his car? The guy is just asking to be challenged by a proper candidate with a proper sense of ballistics.

Good point. When you're drunk it's hard to hit the broad side of a barn. He should have at least been carrying a .50 caliber. Or maybe one of those anti-aircraft missles that Libya lost and the State Department's trying to help them find.

Zoombie · Oct 12, 2011

ColoradoGuy said:
Better check the batteries on your Irony Meter.

Oh...right, sorry.

My irony meter is at a low ebb today.

Manuel Royal · Oct 12, 2011

ColoradoGuy said:
You can't make this stuff up.

Well, if I were making it up, he would have been shot by a drunk in a bar, and his last words would be, "In spite of the obvious irony, this in no way invalidates my main argument."

Actually, his bill only allows people to carry guns into bars or restaurants if they don't drink while there; so theoretically there should never be a drunk with a gun. Hard to believe that separation would be maintained in real life, though.

Linked article said:
He allegedly failed a roadside sobriety test and refused to take a Breathalyzer test. A loaded .38-caliber gun was found in a holster stuffed between the driver seat and the center console.

I wonder if Rep. Todd was actually wearing the holster on his belt, then took it off and stuffed it between the seat and console when he saw the police lights?

I don't like guns, but I really don't like drunk drivers. Drunks kill a lot more people with cars than they do with guns.

ColoradoGuy · Oct 12, 2011

Manuel Royal said:
Actually, his bill only allows people to carry guns into bars or restaurants if they don't drink while there; so theoretically there should never be a drunk with a gun. Hard to believe that separation would be maintained in real life, though.

My nomination for the prestigious Understatement of the Year Award, 2011.

benbradley · Oct 12, 2011

Manuel Royal said:
Well, if I were making it up, he would have been shot by a drunk in a bar, and his last words would be, "In spite of the obvious irony, this in no way invalidates my main argument."

Actually, his bill only allows people to carry guns into bars or restaurants if they don't drink while there; so theoretically there should never be a drunk with a gun. Hard to believe that separation would be maintained in real life, though.

I wonder if Rep. Todd was actually wearing the holster on his belt, then took it off and stuffed it between the seat and console when he saw the police lights?

I don't like guns, but I really don't like drunk drivers. Drunks kill a lot more people with cars than they do with guns.

Statistics, schmatistics. EVERYONE drives a car, but people are AFRAID of guns!

Law Bans "Open Carry" of Handguns
By Dave Rice | Posted October 12, 2011, 9:08 a.m.

In a flurry of last-minute signings and vetoes, [Califorenia] Governor Jerry Brown on Monday announced the signing into law of Assembly Bill 144, which bans “open carrying” of handguns. Such practice, where residents are allowed to openly and conspicuously possess an unloaded weapon in most public spaces, has been permitted since the state’s inception.

Brown, himself the owner of three guns, said in a statement he was following the request of law enforcement across the state who have complained of having to respond to panicked calls from citizens alarmed by groups gathering in public to legally display weapons, which distracts from more pressing matters. ...

muravyets · Oct 12, 2011

I'm not afraid of guns. I'm afraid of drunken idiots.

shawkins · Oct 12, 2011

Don said:
Sounds like the law worked. What's the beef?

The beef is that those of us who use math are once again being forced to carry those of you who don't. The chances of shooting someone in self defense are dramatically lower than the chances of killing someone you're fond of by accident. You're risking your own life and that of your family by keeping one of those little death machines at hand. So, there are two possibilities:

1. You aren't smart enough to understand that by being a firearms owner you're actually ENDANGERING your family more than protecting it.

or

2. It's not actually about protecting your family. It's about something else.

There are no other possibilities.

Yeah, yeah. I know. You're careful. You'd never let that happen. It's aaaaaaaaaaaaall first amendment until it's your toddler in the ICU.

I actually don't care about that--the problem is guaranteed to sort itself out over the long term--but I do have an immediate and personal concern. This is Georgia. I probably live next door to someone who thinks a Desert Eagle is ideal for home defense. By definition, gun owners can't think clearly.

It's a trifle worrisome.

That's the beef.

Torgo · Oct 12, 2011

A Tennessee lawmaker who sponsored a controversial bill to allow suitcase nukes to be carried in bars was arrested Tuesday for driving under the influence and possessing a suitcase nuke while under the influence.

Sounds like the law worked. What's the beef?

Vince524 · Oct 12, 2011

Guns don't kill people. Idiot lawmakers kill people.

shawkins · Oct 12, 2011

Oh, c'mon. Anybody?

Don · Oct 12, 2011

Sure, here ya go.

Bolding mine.

From the Journal of Criminal Law and Criminology (Northwestern University, 1995)

ARMED RESISTANCE TO CRIME: THE PREVALENCE AND NATURE OF SELF-DEFENSE WITH A GUN

Previous research has consistently indicated that victims who resist with a gun or other weapon are less likely than other victims to lose their property in robberies[3] and in burglaries[4]. Consistently, research also has indicated that victims who resist by using guns or other weapons are less likely to be injured compared to victims who do not resist or to those who resist without weapons. This is true whether the research relied on victim surveys or on police records, and whether the data analysis consisted of simple cross-tabulations or more complex multivariate analyses. These findings have been obtained with respect to robberies[5] and to assaults[6].
...
National Crime Victimization Survey (NCVS) data indicate that even in the very disadvantageous situation where the robber has a gun, victims who resist with guns are still substantially less likely to be injured than those who resist in other ways, and even slightly less likely to be hurt than those who do not resist at all.

With regard to studies of rape, although samples typically include too few cases of self-defense with a gun for separate analysis, McDermott, [9] Quinsey and Upfold, [10] Lizotte, [11] and Kleck and Sayles [12] all found that victims who resisted with some kind of weapon were less likely to have the rape attempt completed against them.

The reported surveys vary widely, but even the most conservative estimates 500,000 defensive uses of handguns a year, with the highest (from the LA Times) being in the 3.7 million uses range.

Lots more at the link, with footnotes and everything.

shawkins · Oct 12, 2011

Thanks, much appreciated.

However, it seems as though I failed to express myself effectively. I wasn't trying to make the point that gun owners aren't Much more dangerous to strangers--they are indeed--but rather that they're MUCH more dangerous to themselves and people they care about.

Therefore, if your goal is to make your family safe, the best way to achieve that is to not own a gun.

benbradley · Oct 12, 2011

Furthermore, I'll point out something Don missed (or glossed over) - that "defensive use with a gun" does not mean the gun is fired, unlike what the statement below (bolded by me) would lead one to believe:

shawkins said:
The beef is that those of us who use math are once again being forced to carry those of you who don't. The chances of shooting someone in self defense ...

Every self-defense use of a gun does NOT involve shooting the gun. In fact, it usually doesn't. In the majority of instances, a "shady character" quickly turns around and goes the other way when he/she/it sees their potential victim show a gun.

As some may consider Don's source untrustworthy, I'll quote Wikipedia.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_violence_in_the_United_States#Self-protection

Of all incidents where a gun was used for self-defense, victims shot at the offender 28% of the time.

As Don says, no doubt the number of such "non-shooting" defensive uses could be much higher, as surely not everyone reports every incident where no shots were fired and effectively "nothing happened."

TN lawmaker who sponsored bill to allow guns in bars arrested drunk with loaded gun

I've seen worse.

Capeless, wingless, & yet I fly.

Dragon of the Multiverse

Formerly Phantom of Krankor.

Baby plot bunneh sniffs out a clue

I've seen worse.

Capeless, wingless, & yet I fly.

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Dragon of the Multiverse

I've seen worse.

I've seen worse.

All Living is Local

Dragon of the Multiverse

I've seen worse.

It's a doggy dog world

Old revolutionary

Ahhh. Sweet.

Formerly Phantom of Krankor.

Are you gonna finish that bacon?

Ahhh. Sweet.

All Living is Local

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It's a doggy dog world