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Filly

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I think I'm getting to the point that I want to quickly finish off/be done with my non-writing related degree and zoom off to America.

Here's a question, when you guys finally realize what you want to do/achieve in life, how far do you go for it?

Do you take on a part-time job or a less-intense job so you can focus more on your writing? What are you priorities and where do you put writing in your life?

I'm slogging along at college and I thought the thing I wanted to do in life turned out to be something I don't want to do at all. And now I think I finally have found my passion; I'm willing to go through a life of no or little income as a literary agent/editor/something in the publishing industry than being at a point where I don't like what I'm learning/doing.

Steve Jobs passed away recently and I read a quote from him that really struck a cord: "Your time is limited, so don't waste it living someone else's life."

I'm willing to go against my family norm of being business tycoons and lawyers.

I want to spend my life doing something I love.

But I guess the odds is like someone trying to be a movie star.

How crazy am I getting?

Does anyone have any life stories or advice to share?

Just clarifying: I have no dependents and no real financial responsibilities.
 
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Libbie

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You only get one life. Better live it the way you want to live it.

Of course, there are practicalities to consider. If you're at a point now where you don't have dependents and few financial responsibilities, do your best to keep things that way until you've established your career and set it on the path you want it to take. It's much harder to live life on your terms when you've got kids to take care of, tons of debt, etc. Then you pretty much have to take a job that pays the right amount of money and be as dedicated to it as it requires. Survival needs to be a priority, practically speaking.

Myself, I've kept away from getting too closely tied to any particular career so I can have the freedom to quit my day job and write full-time if I ever am able to sell a book and establish the kind of start I want to have. I've stayed pretty open with my employment options and have had some really enjoyable jobs, but have never gotten too deeply committed to them. Writing is my ultimate end goal. Work is just the stuff I do along the way to keep myself writing. When I'm lucky, I like my work. But it's all temporary in the end.

Even the writing.

So make the most of it.
 

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Steve Jobs was right.

The late Joseph Campbell expressed something similar, summed up in his well-known words "Follow your bliss."

More fully:
“Follow your bliss and the universe will open doors for you where there were only walls....If you do follow your bliss you put yourself on a kind of track that has been there all the while, waiting for you, and the life that you ought to be living is the one you are living....Follow your bliss and don't be afraid, and doors will open where you didn't know they were going to be."

It's your life, not somebody else's.
 

shaldna

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Here's a question, when you guys finally realize what you want to do/achieve in life, how far do you go for it?

I'm kind of known for acting first and thinking later - I do stupid things like decide to quit my job and do it there and then, or decide to get married and do it after 6 weeks or dating. I generally just go for it if it feels right.

Do you take on a part-time job or a less-intense job so you can focus more on your writing? What are you priorities and where do you put writing in your life?

My priority first and foremost my daughter, everyone and everything else can go to hell. If she's okay then I'll work around that. I don't like part time jobs, they are usually sucky hours that actually make things like childcare etc more awkward than a full time job. I fit writing around my job and still manage to get as much done as other writer friends without it impacting on my family life - I generally write on my lunch and tea breaks at work, or after the little ones have gone to bed. I don't let writing interrupt time I could spend with my family or friends.

I'm slogging along at college and I thought the thing I wanted to do in life turned out to be something I don't want to do at all.

Same here. It happens to all of us at some stage.]

And now I think I finally have found my passion; I'm willing to go through a life of no or little income as a literary agent/editor/something in the publishing industry than being at a point where I don't like what I'm learning/doing.

That's cool. But don't sell yourself short. Little or no money sounds fine now, but later you are gonna want a mortgage or a car, or a holiday, a family maybe, and suddenyl that little or no income isn't so great. If you really want to go for it, then do, but you should aim to do it as well as you possibly can.

Steve Jobs passed away recently and I read a quote from him that really struck a cord: "Your time is limited, so don't waste it living someone else's life."

And I agree. I used to tell something similar to my students when they were planning their courses and careers, I would tell them to choose for themselves, not for what other people, especially thier parents, wanted for them.

I want to spend my life doing something I love.

Once you know what you want to do, you just need to find someone who's willing to pay you to do it.

But I guess the odds is like someone trying to be a movie star.

You said you wanted to work in publishing, that's definately more attainable than being a movie star. But hey, SOMEONE has to be a movie star. Don't limit yourself.

Does anyone have any life stories or advice to share?

In Jurassic Park Michael Crichton wrote two very good pieces of advice:

1. For the rest of your life other people will try to take your achievements away from you, so don't take them away from yourself.

2. Most of what people tell you will be wrong.
 

Undercover

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What Libbie said. If you don't have any dependents or major financial issues, then you're ahead of the game, so if you can try to stay that way and establish a job and a place and write on the side for a while. Making money off of a book can take quite a bit of time until you actually get paid for it.
 

Filigree

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Dreams sustain your mind, but a steady paycheck lifts you above the subsistence level. I've been a poor American and I've been a middle-class American, and I've always written better when I'm feeling more financially secure. I can carve out writing time from my various jobs. It's much harder to write when I'm paralyzed by fears about creditors and looming bankruptcy. For a very long time, I was afraid my writing was only a useless, time-wasting hobby. It took some validation in other parts of my life to show me writing's value, as well.

Also, bluntly, America is no place to be poor, with any kind of health problem. You need to be physically healthy. Or have a fair amount of money socked away (I'd say at least 20K), just in case you have a health emergency. Many bankruptcies are initially triggered by high health-care costs, even with insurance.

If you're young, healthy, and fearless, I'd say go for it. As Neil Peart said in the lyrics to 'Dreamline', 'We're only immortal for a limited time.'

But have a fallback position to make money, because for most of us, writing is not it!
 

Namatu

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I'm slogging along at college and I thought the thing I wanted to do in life turned out to be something I don't want to do at all. And now I think I finally have found my passion; I'm willing to go through a life of no or little income as a literary agent/editor/something in the publishing industry than being at a point where I don't like what I'm learning/doing.
Hey now. Editors make more than no money or I'd be typing this from my cardboard box home. :D

I didn't study English or publishing or anything at all related, yet my first job out of college was as an assistant editor at a publishing house. So it can be done, and you can, eventually ;), live off of that income. Your degree could come in handy depending on what area of publishing you want to get into. Mine applies to the subject matter I work with.
 

Soccer Mom

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Shaldna has some excellent advice. My family comes first with me. Everything else, including the writing, is secondary.

You can have a real job and be a writer too. They aren't mutually exclusive. I'm a lawyer and still manage four books a year. That doesn't come without trade-offs. If I worked at a prestigious, large firm then I probably wouldn't be able to do this. By building a career and not just a job, I've given myself a lot of flexibility. I won't get filthy rich with the way I limit my law practice, but I can live well and still have time for a full life outside of my work. Also, there are times my job is very satisfying.

But you have to decide what you want and make it happen. Now is the time to really go after what you want. You'll never be young and unencumbered with mortgage and family again. These are happy obligations that I willingly accepted, but they do shape my current choices.

If you want to try and build yourself a future in the publishing industry, go after it. There will never be a better time in your life to try. College and everything else will still be there if you want it later.
 

NeuroFizz

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With all due respect for Mr. Jobs, being philosophical like that is easy when one is a bazillionaire. Someone who has to worry about "frills" like food, shelter, and health care, might just have to supplement the search for that chance at nirvana. HOWEVER, youth is one of the great times to find one's niche, one's passion. Adjustments are usually necessary, but there is time to make those adjustments. And one lesson learned by the OP is an important one--anytime we try something and say, "I'll never do that again" we have made a positive step forward because we've just narrowed our career path.

I'll jump in with Mom (above) because I've also found a passion in my day job that rivals the joys of writing, and it has led to a career instead of a job. And there is plenty of time to write, even with a family and all of the associated responsibilities.

The most important things are to be happy, to be safe, and to be healthy. In the U.S. (unfortunately) these things, for the most part, require a decent income.

Writing for a living doesn't require placement on the Best-Sellers lists, but it does require the self-discipline for a constant "hustle." It also requires a knowledge of the business side of publishing so all of that creativity can be put to best use. For some, it also requires a diverse approach to writing--doing different kinds of paying writing jobs. This all means it can be hard work. But that hard work can be among the most rewarding if it's viewed as a challenge rather than a chore.

Give it a try. See what shakes out. You'll regret it forever if you pass on the opportunity.
 

NeuroFizz

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My priority first and foremost my daughter, everyone and everything else can go to hell. If she's okay then I'll work around that. I don't like part time jobs, they are usually sucky hours that actually make things like childcare etc more awkward than a full time job. I fit writing around my job and still manage to get as much done as other writer friends without it impacting on my family life - I generally write on my lunch and tea breaks at work, or after the little ones have gone to bed. I don't let writing interrupt time I could spend with my family or friends.

Agree. My children first. Always.
My paying job second because they pay me to uphold certain responsibilities.
Writing when time and energy allows. This is not as much of a limitation as it may seem, but that depends on the individual.
 

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I'll jump in with Mom (above) because I've also found a passion in my day job that rivals the joys of writing, and it has led to a career instead of a job. And there is plenty of time to write, even with a family and all of the associated responsibilities.

One clarification on this point: despite what many people say, it's possible to build a decent career in something you don't have a passion for. My day job is a horrendously poor fit for me. Even now, many years later, it's like writing with my non-dominant hand, but I've managed to muddle through it with some success because I like money and hate failure even more than I hate my job. Last year, I leveraged that success into a writing-friendly schedule.

There are endless ways to juggle the money/time/passion/interest equation. Don't think of it as either-or because it never is. Best of luck.

ETA: I personally don't believe in expecting passion in your day job, but that may be because of how I was raised. "Do what you love" rubs me the wrong way even as much as I want to believe it. I tend to advise "do what you like" or, at a minimum, "do what you don't hate." And even that's negotiable if the price is right. I'm mercenary (practical?) that way.
 
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quicklime

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You only get one life. Better live it the way you want to live it.

Of course, there are practicalities to consider..



this.

wanna write? Write. Want to eat? Maybe still focus on a fallback career instead of putting all your eggs into a longshot basket like becoming commercially successful. There's certainly nothing wrong with trying to write, but you should have a fallback that's a "real job", not using your degree to become a gas station attendant just so you can make sure you only have to work part-time, only to find out in five years that you're giving up on writing, hate the gas station, and have a suspiciously long dead-end spot on your resume if you WANT to find a different job....


as for following your bliss, a few years eating ramen noodles in a shitty apartment where you can hear the nasty trailer-trash below you playing sex-games and putting up with a dead-end job to chase said bliss can make the bliss pretty damn elusive, also
 

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Here's a question, when you guys finally realize what you want to do/achieve in life, how far do you go for it?
...
Steve Jobs passed away recently and I read a quote from him that really struck a cord: "Your time is limited, so don't waste it living someone else's life."
...
Does anyone have any life stories or advice to share?

Hmmn.

My dream as a youth was to be the next Albert Einstein. I immersed myself in physics, went to school and had little life outside of it...although I was distracted by a woman. That distraction was enough. I failed, and only got a Master's degree out of my education.

Could I have done better? I'm not sure. I'm smart but I'm not a supergenius, and those were the people with whom I would have competed. Could I have avoided that woman and focused more? Yes, certainly, but that means I would have lived far less.

After school I got a job that made me feel good about myself, and I took on a hobby that I thought was helping people. I reinvented myself as an altruist doing good work. I thought that would be my new purpose, and I focused on it to the exclusion of almost everything else.

I failed. I lost the job, and the people I thought I was helping turned on me and drove me away. I don't think any of that could have been avoided; it was a house of cards from the start and was destined to eventually fall.

So now I have a comfortable if not exciting job, and I'm building a life with a good woman. I'm also telling stories -- I have a unique viewpoint and I'd like to share it, and maybe I can help and/or entertain people along the way.

Steve Jobs was lucky. He encouraged people to go for their dream no matter what. But that's not always good advice. It worked for him, but life often takes unexpected detours that can wreck a person's dream.

That's not to say you shouldn't chase your dreams. But my advice is that you should be ready to alter them, reinvent them, and reinvent yourself if you find your initial goals unattainable. Don't become bitter about how your childhood dreams were dashed. Dream new dreams and chase them.

Whatever you do, never give up. Never stop striving for some goal. If you find you can't reach one goal, choose another and keep on fighting.
 

Phaeal

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You should marry a rich man or woman who doesn't want children, who just needs you on occasion to buttress his/her respectable-married-person facade, and who is happy that you have a silly little hobby like writing to distract you from your loveless life. Once you make a fortune with your first book, you can divorce this loser.
 

shaldna

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this.

wanna write? Write. Want to eat? Maybe still focus on a fallback career instead of putting all your eggs into a longshot basket like becoming commercially successful. There's certainly nothing wrong with trying to write, but you should have a fallback that's a "real job", not using your degree to become a gas station attendant just so you can make sure you only have to work part-time, only to find out in five years that you're giving up on writing, hate the gas station, and have a suspiciously long dead-end spot on your resume if you WANT to find a different job....

This.

The thing is, it can take a long time to make money writing. Quite aside from the time it takes to write a book, which for some people can be several years, then there is the time it takes to get it published, which can take years to find a publisher, and then maybe another two years after that to see it in print.

And what are you going to eat in that time?

This is something that people don't seem to realise - in any industry - it can take a long time to get established.
 

Namatu

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You should marry a rich man or woman who doesn't want children, who just needs you on occasion to buttress his/her respectable-married-person facade, and who is happy that you have a silly little hobby like writing to distract you from your loveless life. Once you make a fortune with your first book, you can divorce this loser.
:eek: Who told you my plan?
 

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Also, bluntly, America is no place to be poor, with any kind of health problem. You need to be physically healthy. Or have a fair amount of money socked away (I'd say at least 20K), just in case you have a health emergency. Many bankruptcies are initially triggered by high health-care costs, even with insurance.

It's as good a place as any. If you're poor enough, dead broke, there's always health care available. For health care you are, in fact, better off broke than with twenty thousand stuck in the bank.

But it amazes me how much the poor in health, the broken in body, managed to accomplish before there was such a thing as health care. History is full of such people. Today, not so much.
 

IceCreamEmpress

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But it amazes me how much the poor in health, the broken in body, managed to accomplish before there was such a thing as health care. History is full of such people. Today, not so much.

How dare you? This is possibly the most hateful comment I have ever seen on this site.

As someone with a life-limiting chronic illness who works hard to get through every day, accomplish my goals, and be of service to others--and I know I am not the only person on this site in this situation, and probably nowhere near the person who is in the most challenging health situation--I find this callous beyond belief.

People who are experiencing health challenges need health care. Not getting health care doesn't make them morally stronger, it just makes them dead sooner.
 

Phaeal

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How dare you? This is possibly the most hateful comment I have ever seen on this site.

As someone with a life-limiting chronic illness who works hard to get through every day, accomplish my goals, and be of service to others--and I know I am not the only person on this site in this situation, and probably nowhere near the person who is in the most challenging health situation--I find this callous beyond belief.

People who are experiencing health challenges need health care. Not getting health care doesn't make them morally stronger, it just makes them dead sooner.

I, for one, wish that Jane Austen and Beethoven, to mention just two of thousands I could come up with, had had better health care.
 

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How dare you? This is possibly the most hateful comment I have ever seen on this site.

As someone with a life-limiting chronic illness who works hard to get through every day, accomplish my goals, and be of service to others--and I know I am not the only person on this site in this situation, and probably nowhere near the person who is in the most challenging health situation--I find this callous beyond belief.

People who are experiencing health challenges need health care. Not getting health care doesn't make them morally stronger, it just makes them dead sooner.


I dunno. That's not how I read James' comment. What I'm thinking he meant was that people back then didn't have that kind of healthcare, that some were still able to accomplish things, which was great. That they still trekked through it all.

But Ice Cream you bring up a good point, that's why people back then died at an earlier age. They didn't have the drugs out there that we have today. I don't think he meant it as mean.

(Like I said, that's how I'm reading it, but I could be wrong)
 
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